equandt

iTrader: (2)

I recently answered some questions from another board member. I thought I should post my comments for all to read and for those later who like to use the search button:

Let me temper my comments by letting you know that they are given by a 36 year old mechanical engineer. I’ve owned four f-body’s (79, 95, 99, 02), a GTO (04) and worked with and driven my fathers vettes (98 C5, 01 Z06). I currently own the 02 Z28 and 04 GTO.

1. I guess the first thing I should ask is how do you like the cam and
is it stronger than stock from idle?

1. I like the TR220 cam. It idles very well. If you listen to the exhaust you can tell the car is cammed; however you will have to know what you are listening for. I also have a ’04 GTO that is stock. The idle of each is very different. The GTO is smoother and has less shake at idle. My Z28 (w/ the TR220) has a small amount of shake at idle. It’s not annoying.

2. How is the low end to mid range throttle response?

2. I think that off idle to 1800 rpm I have lost a little bit of torque. The reason I say this is because I have to give it a few more rpm when I let out the clutch. By 2000 rpm, all the torque is back and then some. From 2200 rpm on up the cam is very powerful and very responsive. The car can cruise easily at 1100 rpm in sixth gear, no surging, no bucking.

I have tried to remedy the loss of off idle torque by adding some TEA 5.3 heads. I’m bumping the compression to 11.0:1. The better heads and raised compression should yield more torque everywhere in the rpm band. The heads are on order.

I’ve also considered changing my gears from the 3.42 to 3.73 but haven’t yet. If the heads don’t get me what I want, gears will be next.

3. Also, I have read a lot of complaints on LS1Tech about valve train
noise or, the sewing machine effect, after a cam install. Do you have much noise from the valve train with your TR220?

3. The valve train has some noise. I think all fast ramp cams have this. The TR220 in my car is noticeably noisy from 2000 – 2200 rpm. At idle it’s not bad, louder than stock but it wouldn’t turn your head and make you think twice about it. I think the valve train noise is something you’ll have to deal with no matter what cam you pick.

4. Did you have any tuning issues or idle problems?

4. The cam was installed and tuned by Speed, Inc. in Chicago. I have had not tuning or idle problems with the cam.

I debated a long time on which can to get. I was really torn between the LPE GT2-3 and TR220. They are very different cams but both suited my purpose of an easy to drive street cam. I wanted low end torque and an easy to drive, fun street car. I did not want a big, lopey cam and killed my low end and screamed from 5000 – 6500 rpm. My advice is this; the LPE GT2-3 is a great street cam (by design) that can be raced, the TR220 is a small (but great) race cam (by design) that can be easily street driven. I think the LPE GT2-3 cam would have suited my goals better, but I got a deal on the TR220, springs and pushrods that I couldn’t pass up. Doing it again, I would purchase the GT2-3 because I think it would have better off idle torque, a smoother idle and have comparable top end power. I think the GT2-3 would give up some mid range (3000-5000) torque but would be a better all around street cam. If you aren’t going to replace the converter (keep the stock converter) in your A4 car I think the GT2-3 would be the better choice; however both will work well. Either cam will like the 3.73:1 gear, I think the TR220 will love the gear.

LPE sells the GT2-3, they also sell a cam similar to the TR220. They have a 222/222 duration cam. LPE may be able to give you more detail on the comparison between there GT2-3 and their 222/222 single pattern cam.

nuzee

iTrader: (2)

I think that was a damn good assessment! Must be that engineering background.

When I look at LPE's cam lineup, it appears they mimick some of the hi-po factory cams. The GT2-3 looks like a '02 LS6 cam with some tweaks. They have another one that is similar to the '01 LS6 grind too. That GT2-3 with higher compression heads would be a great street setup IMO too.

davered00ss

iTrader: (4)

Great review. Thanks.

fasteddyss

iTrader: (1)

Great read!! I will post my impressions after after more miles on my tr-220. I changed out the cam and added headers and ls6 intake at the same time. This makes it much harder for me to compare the cam by iteslf to my stock setup.

What lsa are you at, 112 or 114??

I also debated the gt2-3 vs the tr-220 but came to a little different conclusion than you did.

I got the tr-220 (at 112lsa) so I would have more low end, where I tend to spend most of my time. I highly doubt the gt2-3 has more low end.

My understanding is that the lower the LSA and lift the more low end torque. The gt2-3 has more lift and a much wider LSA. It will idle much nicer and scream up high, but will not have the low grunt of the 220.

I also thought the tr-220 would be nicer on springs.

I would love to hear from more tr-220 and gt2-3 owners!!!!!!

Spellbound

I loved my TR220 114. Cam only with bolt ons, 3500 stall, 3,73's, & slicks; 11.8x 114.

equandt

iTrader: (2)

I have the TR220-114 w/ Comp 918 springs and TR 7.400" chromemoly pushrods.

Tom99SS

iTrader: (2)

I don't have a TR220 but I do have a Comp XE 218/218 .563/.563 114 cam. I love these so-called small cams (by today's standard). I have nice low end torque and I shift around 6500. Also, it is hard to tell I even have a cam but it does like to rev.

ArcticFormula

Don't have the TR220 but something similar, 222-222 .581 .581 XER 115 lsa.
Dyno graph is my 02 5000mile car with lid-catback then add the cam, AFR 205 heads out of box, and vig 2800 and Speed Inc tuning. Still have stock manifolds and cats. Looking forward to getting the car to the track here in a few weeks. Only about 200 miles on the new setup but idle is good, drivability is fine, haven't noticed to much sewing machine noise. Want a 110+mph trap to be completely satisfied as that was a core goal.

fasteddyss

iTrader: (1)

That may be why you feel you lost torque off idle to 2K. The higher the lobe seperation, the higher your power band moves. The tr-220 at 112 lsa may be better for you since you have a stick and are looking for power down low.

Also, I found that 3:73's really make the car more driveable around town. I can get into 6th in the city now. Before with 3:42's 6th was worthless in town.

JEB99TA

iTrader: (32)

I also have the TR220 but on a 112 LSA w/ Comp 918 springs and TR 7.400 hardened chrome moly pushrods. It's got a good lope and makes great power with my setup.

TheBowtieboy

iTrader: (6)

I too had the TR220 on a 114....and most bolt-ons.

In comparison to what I have now (224/581 on a 112 +4), the TR220 almost had no valvetrain noise.
.....now the car sounds like all I need is some thread and cloth

While I agree that the 112 LSA will bring your torque down, it's at the expense of having more idle "lope".....some like it, others don't.

I personally think that the addition of 3:73's and what most forget about a lightweight flywheel would get you close to where you're wanting to get - without the expense of the heads.
......with the cam I have now and stock 241's (with 3:73's, spec clutch and LTW flywheel) I achieve almost maximum torque by 2500 RPM's (truely almost a straight line from 2500 - 5600 RPM's)

Please keep us posted at to the results with the heads !

nuzee

iTrader: (2)

The higher the duration, the higher your powerband moves. The tighter lsa will make the powerband narrower but more intense. It maybe true that the powerbands peak may move a little bit lower with a tighter lsa vs. a wider lsa's powerband moving a little bit higher. I think you are confusing the way lsa affects power "peaks" with power "bands".

CHRISPY

Yep the higher LSA will generally spread the power curve making it wider.

Ragtop 99

iTrader: (7)

A lot of times the manusfacturers grind 4* advance in, whether the cam is a 112 or 114. That will cause the 112 to have slightly better low end.

SSpeedracer

iTrader: (8)

I ran a TR220 113.5LBA on a stock 2000 M6 LS1 with great results both on the street and a road course. Choose 220 for driveability (heavy convertible), emissions (CA), and cost (got it used). I have since added PP/FFHP heads at 10.4 compression with an LS6 intake. Clutch is clutchmaster AL w/SpecII.

After idle tuning, lope at 850 RPM is hardly noticable resulting is a slight chassis shake. Valve train noise is louder, but barely and seems to soften as the engine warms up. Not only does this setup have good RPM range, but the throttle response is excellent. There is a loss of torque below ~1800, but except for parking lots I am never there.

I could not notice any seat of pants difference between my 220 and a friends TR224 except that his t-top is lighter, so off idle clutch play was more forgiving.

I cant wait to get a strange 12bolt with 3.73 and drop the clutch on my 315 nitto's.

equandt

iTrader: (2)

I was goofing around on LS1tech this morning and found this old thread. Attached is the link to the next thread. Same car with heads.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...20#post7506346