Conversions & Hybrids - Ls1 E36 Bmw

I am plannin on buying an LS1 for my BMW. I am very new to the American Muscle, and I don't know where to start looking for one. I want something on the cheaper side, but I dont want a piece of crap. Any ideas?

-John

What are your goals?? Power? Manual or Auto?

What are your goals?? Power? Manual or Auto?

I am looking for about 350rwhp and I also want the T56 manual tranny.

-John

'99+ complete F-body LS1/T56 takeout will get the job done.

Most replace the oil pump ($140), Tchain ($22) at the minimum. If you want to spin it beyond 6600rpm rod bolts are a wise investment ($150).

If you buy an '01-02 LS1 motor (F-body) you get the LS6 intake (+20hp) and slightly better flowing factory heads (+5-10hp) with the improved oil pump/rod bolts.

Remember that doing an LS1 conversion on a Bimmer is an expensive one. An RX-7 is a much cheaper proposal.

Remember that doing an LS1 conversion on a Bimmer is an expensive one. An RX-7 is a much cheaper proposal.

No doubt! My estimate is that I could buy an FD + complete the swap for about the same amount as the conversion is costing into my Bimmer. Too bad I'm well beyond the point of no return.

'99+ complete F-body LS1/T56 takeout will get the job done.

Most replace the oil pump ($140), Tchain ($22) at the minimum. If you want to spin it beyond 6600rpm rod bolts are a wise investment ($150).

If you buy an '01-02 LS1 motor (F-body) you get the LS6 intake (+20hp) and slightly better flowing factory heads (+5-10hp) with the improved oil pump/rod bolts.

Remember that doing an LS1 conversion on a Bimmer is an expensive one. An RX-7 is a much cheaper proposal.


I don't believe this to be true. If you are willing to do the fabrication yourself, the lower initial cost of a mid 90's BMW will make the project cheaper in itself.

Parts necessary for a stock motor in either a BMW or RX7 is the same.

Radiator
Cooling Fan
motor mounts with subframe modification
rear trans mount
driveshaft
electrical modification
power steering lines
radiator hoses
Intake hoses
brake pedal modification on BMW/hydraulic clutch master on RX7

About the only part I did on the BMW that I didn't do on the RX7 was ABS relocation. I would probably remove the ABS in the future.

Headers are by far the biggest deal on the BMW conversion. Sanderson at least makes a set of headers for the RX7. There is no one else besides Nash for headers right now on the BMW and they make for some interesting motor mounts. I made my headers. They took me about 36 hours start to finish. If I were to make them over, I would make tri-y's I believe they would fit a lot better in the 3 series.

Matt

I don't believe this to be true. If you are willing to do the fabrication yourself, the lower initial cost of a mid 90's BMW will make the project cheaper in itself.
Matt


However if you are like me (and many others)and don't have the knowledge or tools to do the custom fab work, we pay thousands for headers, thousands for diff mount/subframe mods....it adds up.

I believe the prices are still the same. Buy the whole kit from Nash and the price isn't terrible. By the time you add up the hinson kit and the Sanderson headers. You probably end up near the same price for the kit. Mid 90's BMW's are a dime a dozen and parts are cheaper than the RX7 of the 90's. 2.3 million E36 BMW's were made worldwide vs. 15,000 3rd gen RX7's.

The parts prices my friend paid for bullshit interior pieces on the RX7 were astronomical. The BMW pieces are pricey, but they probably will be available for a lot longer.

Don't get me wrong. If I didn't have a child, I would definitely be sporting a 3rd gen. I owned before the Hinson era and I loved it. I just need a back seat. I am telling you from experience that the prices are similar. Even with all my own fab work, I still have thousands in it. This shit is expensive.

I plan on buying motor mounts and drivetrain pieces. Other than that I can fabricate everything else. That should keep the price down.

Or you can just buy everything from my car and have a plug and play solution.

I've got around $25,000 invested in just the engine, rebuilt transmission with lower overdrive gears, custom headers, custom pan with accusump, all the mounts, radiator, etc. BUT it is set up for a track car, no power steering (which could easily be added back), no ABS and a GM ASA cam which is pretty lumpy for a street car.

Anyway if someone wanted to have a ready built solution for $10,000 it's their's.

Anyway if someone wanted to have a ready built solution for $10,000 it's their's.

^^^ good deal

With your power goals I would reccomend to buy a LS1 w/ T56 and PCM/harness. I know I usually think I could piece together a set up for less but unless your building a forged motor w/ heads and cam then just buy a complete stock motor. Like some others have said I would upgrade a few things especially since it will be easy w/ the motor out. I would install the following:
1. LS6 intake ('01-up come w/ it)
2. Ported oil pump
3. Double roller timing chain
4. Cam/valvetrain (may as well now)

You can either buy the cam/valvetrain used off here to save some or there are some nicely priced set ups out there.

http://sites.reachtheworld.tv/waterNew/default.asp?T=507473&DID=1225
This would be a good set up. $255 for valvetrain and $279 for the cam.

And here is a motor...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1998-5-7-LS1-T56-Manual-Engine-and-Transmission-96k_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33615QQitemZ1800018 27062QQrdZ1

Have you figured out what oil pan you have to use for an E36? Fbody or probably the GTO?

F body, no cutting necessary.

Or you can just buy everything from my car and have a plug and play solution.

I've got around $25,000 invested in just the engine, rebuilt transmission with lower overdrive gears, custom headers, custom pan with accusump, all the mounts, radiator, etc. BUT it is set up for a track car, no power steering (which could easily be added back), no ABS and a GM ASA cam which is pretty lumpy for a street car.

Anyway if someone wanted to have a ready built solution for $10,000 it's their's.

What is that engine and all?, What power (KW'S) did you end up getting? 1/4 mile time? and videos?

I plan on buying motor mounts and drivetrain pieces. Other than that I can fabricate everything else. That should keep the price down.


Expensive parts for me were subframe reinforcement and headers. These two items cost about $2.5k more than my LS1/T56

At that kind of price, why didn't you buy the Nash kit or the V3auto kit before they stopped selling it?

What was the subframe reinforcement other than the M3 plates welded to the chassis?

Don't get me wrong. If I didn't have a child, I would definitely be sporting a 3rd gen. I owned before the Hinson era and I loved it. I just need a back seat.well then dont laugh that I just bought some rear seats for my 2nd Gen RX7, because there is a 6 yr old that needs to come to carshows, etc with my and my gf, so a 4 seater sounded like a good idea to me, for now. and you can buy rear seats for the FD rx7 from Japan, Ive seen perfect condition setups for less than $400 shipped.

now you could also buy a 240sx since they are al 4 seaters, the 1995+ bodystyle is pretty damn nice too.

but if you want a 4 door, thats a different story and the BMW is the only option.

At that kind of price, why didn't you buy the Nash kit or the V3auto kit before they stopped selling it?

What was the subframe reinforcement other than the M3 plates welded to the chassis?



Rear subframe, for differential. Similar to what you see here

http://www.rfdm.com/Randy/BMW/pics/projects/01_Rear_Reinforcement/

What is that engine and all?, What power (KW'S) did you end up getting? 1/4 mile time? and videos?

Yes, that's everything. 370rwhp, 360 torque. It was setup to be a reliable long term solution with a broad power band for road racing, not a peak power drag car, so I wasn't looking for more horsepower than the car could handle or a lean fuel strategy for maximum power.

That's why I did things like spend spend $2500 having the diff rebuilt and beefed up as well as adding lower 5 & 6 gears.

The design of the every component was centered around mitigating any heat issues from the tight packaging. The thought and design put into the routing of every oil line, cooling line and wire by the builder is really impressive.

This is Going to be a First

This is Going to be a First

I think you need to read the rest of the thread :eyes:

Those prices quoted are ridiculous. Mines not an e36 but between the price of the car and the parts I'll be under $5k. Of course I did everything myself except the driveshaft, axle shafts and stub axles.
I totally understand the prices if you have someone do it for you but then why not just buy a used m3 or 5?
The only reason I did it is because I wanted the performance and didn't have a lot of money. If I had $25k I'd do as I suggested.

I made my headers. If I were to make them over, I would make tri-y's I believe they would fit a lot better in the 3 series.

Matt
Someone please clarify, are tri-y headers the same thing as 4-2-1 headers? (pic attached)

You missed my point I think. When we looked at everything out there that had been done we found too many things were a compromised solution that didn't meet our specific goals. There are over 300 hours labor in the design and install of the LS1 upgrade.

I'm sure your conversion works well for you, I was just looking for a bullet proof package that would hold up to enduro races, etc. I think the pictures posted in the original thread speak for themselves.

Those prices quoted are ridiculous. Mines not an e36 but between the price of the car and the parts I'll be under $5k. Of course I did everything myself except the driveshaft, axle shafts and stub axles.
I totally understand the prices if you have someone do it for you but then why not just buy a used m3 or 5?
The only reason I did it is because I wanted the performance and didn't have a lot of money. If I had $25k I'd do as I suggested.

If you can do it for under $5k and not cut corners more power to you! If I could do the same I'd be making/selling them for $20k profit all day.

Bullit proof is my goal. Welded roll cage , Porshe 930 Turbo CVs . spicer 1320 u joints, 7000 rpm driveshaft, chromemoly axles and stub axles. 210 case "EVO' diff, mocal rear end cooler, wilwood front brakes masters and pedals, audi TT rear brakes, coilovers etc etc etc
EBAY and the internet are wonderful things for the poor.
Built the engine from parts for $600, the trans was the most expensive thing purchased at $1000 (rebuilt). Car cost me $200.
The wilwood calipers hats, rotor and calipers cost me less than $500 total. Made the brackets for the wilwoods out of scrap 6AL4V titanium, got the rotors new off ebay for $10 each etc etc