Pewterme

I've got an 01 C5 Coupe 6 spd with Halltech Stinger, Ghl Bullets exhaust, LG Pro longtubes with high flow cats, Shaner ported tb, and 4:10's. I made almost 51 rwhp and a little over 8 rwtq. Lift on cam is 588/595. Patrick G recommended this cam to me, I told him I wanted a med size cam with good low to midrange and a good lope. The cam makes good hp but I thought it would make a little more torque. This is with stock heads. What has got me bumfuzzled is that up to 4500 rpm's I'm actually lower on hp and tq than I was with just headers then I start coming ahead. Okls1 has this exact cam only on a 110+2 on his Z28 and we have almost the exact same mods and make almost the exact same hp and tq. The difference is his graph shows he started ahead in both his hp and tq. I sent Patrick G a pm advising him of this and he said the tq should have peaked out 4800 rpm's and hp at 6300 rpm's. This is just what the graph shows on okls1's. Patrick thought perhaps my installer didn't degree the cam. He installed it dot to dot just the same as okls1 did. So the BIG QUESTION is, What caused my hp and tq to start out lower than before and then peak higher than it supposed to. Could this be caused by the tuner??? Could the dyno cause it to show incorrect??(this is the same dyno I used before) I am just beside myself trying to figure out why my results don't look similar to okls1's. It still makes good power, but it's up top, not low and midrange like I wanted. Anybody got any ideas. Here's a copy of both graphs.

Mine






okls1

chriswtx

iTrader: (5)

I made a little more with my 224/224 .581 lift on a 115LSA in my 2004 C5...398wrhp/372rwtq. The problem with a 110LSA cam is you need different heads with more compression to really take advantage of it. The 110LSA really bleeds off combustion pressure with the larger valve overlap(both valves open at the same time), hurting you low end torque...I always degree cams, even new ones. They are never exactly the same as the cam card. I've even seen the wrong cam sent...Also okls1 is an Fbody and they have less drivetrain loss.

cantdrv65

iTrader: (3)

Looks like a tuning issue to me....When my H/C car was running lean down low it made 100 LESS RWTQ from 3000 to 4000rpms. What was your A/F Ratio? have a graph?

exSSer

The short answer is, "you need more compression".

I'm getting pretty much the same cam, i.e. 228/232@112+0 and .600/.600. I'll post all my result, however, I'm doing heads/intake/pulley at the same time so that'll skew the results. OTOH, great HP gains, congrats.

Pewterme

I don't think the a/f ratio is incorporated into their graph, seems like he said it was an older dyno or something, I really cant remember what he said. I do know that it was 13.0 on WOT.

Patrick G

iTrader: (14)

Like I said in my PM, tuning will help bring up some of the low-end and mid-range torque, but it appears to me that the cam is not in at 109 intake centerline. It looks more like it's in at 112. Installing the cam dot to dot does not guarantee that you'll get the exact ICL you want. It can be as much as 4 degrees off. I'd recommend tuning first, then if the power doesn't increase down low, then look at cam centerline.

Did you get a print-out of the cam?

Patrick G

iTrader: (14)

Not exactly. Intake valve closing point is what largely determines dynamic compression and how robust your low and mid range is. A wide LSA cam will tend to have a later IVC and lower dynamic compression than a cam of similar duration but with a narrower LSA. Yes, overlap can bleed off some low speed cylinder pressure, but we're talking 800-1500rpm with this cam size. The issues at hand are mid-range related. Tune further (timing is your friend), then look at the intake centerline of the cam if still not satisfied.

Pewterme

Can a cam be installed on a 109 ICL if you have a stock timing chain??? The impression I got from my installer was if you have a stock timing chain all you could do was install on a dot to dot. Also, I'm sending you a copy of the cam card in pm.

Pewterme

anyone else??

PREDATOR-Z

Yes stock chain is non adjustable.
Look at your 3300 area, that dip is not kosher. Do some more tuning and if symptoms persist, the degreeing will reveal the truth.
Look at Okls1's graph, it reflects more how the cam should behave.

NoMoreFWD

iTrader: (1)

Out of curiousity, what are people using to degree LSX cams? Offset keys, bushings? I have not had to degree a LSX cam yet, but am planning an install soon.

Josh

iTrader: (9)

As the others have suggested, start with tuning. It can make a bigger difference than you might think. Just for reference, here's my graph of the exact same cam installed dot-to-dot.



I apologize for the standard correction, but its symetrical axes make it a bit easier to read than the SAE graph.

Josh

Slowhawk

iTrader: (12)

Looks like lack of timing down low. I know the big Cams I do need good timing down low on a stock head.

bigdsz

iTrader: (1)

I went from a TR 224/224 .563/.563 to a Comp XER 228/230 .588/.591. I lost alot under the curve low and mid range, I was disappointed, but picked up up top. Comp has a great infinitely adjustable timing chain.

Pewterme

Seems I've heard alot saying timing. Is there a range where it should be in the lower rpm's. I've also heard your name mentioned often over in Corvette Forum, you tuned Grond didn't you. I've got to call my tuner and pick his brain a bit and the more info I have the better. That's the bad part about being 2 1/2 hours away, but I guess many travel much farther for a tune.

eamador11

Try mail order tune from a reputable shop.

2xLS1

iTrader: (25)

I tuned okls1's car and i have his timing at 30 degrees from 2800 up. 0 KR and it seemed to like it.

BriancWS6

iTrader: (18)

Western KY? That's where I'm from! Where exactly are you located? Where'd you have your tune done?

I must recommend my Tuner(see sig ) they have a dynojet that is less than 2 yrs old, and they're great guys to deal with. I picked up 13rwhp and 25ft lb tq over the stock tune with only exhaust, lid, and my own ported TB when I had them dyno tune my car. The gain was throughout the entire powerband as well!

Pewterme

In Paducah. A guy named Jerry Onx in Nashville, Tn did the tuning. I really don't think he has done a lot of tuning with cams, mostly headers. Have your tuners done a lot of cams???? You can pm with more info if you wish.