View Full Version : TSP Stage 1 heads, Torquer 2 Dyno #'s


my 00 vette
09-22-2006, 07:59 PM
TSP Stage 1 heads, Torquer 2 cam 114 , LS6 intake, UD Pulley, LG Street headers, Stock TB, Vararam, Z06 TI exhaust, 3.42 gears, Vig 3200 stall, 100 octane fuel. 396 RWHP, 340 Torque. What do you all think? Car is an A4 Built tranny. Wheels are 19" with 295/30R19s BFG KDWS

bad95killer
09-22-2006, 08:46 PM
Impressive numbers man & the track is your next big step with stickies & skinnies :devil:

peace

HOSS
09-22-2006, 11:11 PM
Why the 100 octane?

my 00 vette
09-23-2006, 09:02 AM
compression is in the low 11's and thought it might make it safer. Sure maybe overkill but still learning. I just put in a bottle of torco to a tank of 93 octane

BrianC98Z28
09-23-2006, 12:12 PM
Stock TB is holding some power. Was this locked or unlocked? Torque is low

my 00 vette
09-23-2006, 01:44 PM
unlocked. Could not get it to lock.

RoastEmSS
09-23-2006, 02:51 PM
nice numbers, should be a runner at the track

my 00 vette
09-23-2006, 09:08 PM
Should I buy the fast 90 intake and t/b?. Would it make enough of a difference to spend the big money. Why was my torque low?. Is there anything else I can add to get in the 430-440 range?. Car pulls hard and was tuned nicely by Slowhawk. Idles great.

86 IROC
09-23-2006, 09:17 PM
I would only do the FAST 90mm if you're willing to spend the extra money to have it ported. You're right, the TQ does seem kind of low... but I think an unlocked verter will give you skewed #'s. Overall, it sounds like it's a nice set up that drives well on the street.

WS6FirebirdTA00
09-23-2006, 11:03 PM
I would only do the FAST 90mm if you're willing to spend the extra money to have it ported

Why? HOSS and I both gained 15 rwhp with unported intakes. Definately worth the money on one.

86 IROC
09-24-2006, 06:53 AM
Why? HOSS and I both gained 15 rwhp with unported intakes. Definately worth the money on one.

At peak, what about under the curve? 15 is very good, I don't see people typially get that much. A friend of mine w/ an AFR 205 head - 224/228 cam combo only got 9 from an unported 90 & a 90mm TB over his stock stuff. It is an A4 C5 w/ a stall & full bolt ons.

300bhp/ton
09-24-2006, 03:34 PM
At peak, what about under the curve? 15 is very good, I don't see people typially get that much. A friend of mine w/ an AFR 205 head - 224/228 cam combo only got 9 from an unported 90 & a 90mm TB over his stock stuff. It is an A4 C5 w/ a stall & full bolt ons.
How high was it being revved?

The 90/90 will show most gains from 5500rpm and above, so if the stock shift point and rpm limter are in place I wouldn't expect much gain.

And from the dyno results I've seen the 90/90 should match a LS6 100% if not a little better all the way from 2000rpm up, right until it starts making more.

86 IROC
09-24-2006, 04:14 PM
How high was it being revved?

The 90/90 will show most gains from 5500rpm and above, so if the stock shift point and rpm limter are in place I wouldn't expect much gain.

And from the dyno results I've seen the 90/90 should match a LS6 100% if not a little better all the way from 2000rpm up, right until it starts making more.

6500-6700, it's your typical AFR headed, stock cube car with the 224/228 cam like Tony Mamo's old set up. Patrick G's car had nice under the curve power vs. an LS6 even below 5500.

my 00 vette
09-24-2006, 08:46 PM
How high was it being revved?

The 90/90 will show most gains from 5500rpm and above, so if the stock shift point and rpm limter are in place I wouldn't expect much gain.

And from the dyno results I've seen the 90/90 should match a LS6 100% if not a little better all the way from 2000rpm up, right until it starts making more.

Car was revved to 6500 RPM'S

my 00 vette
09-24-2006, 08:47 PM
would a little taller than stock tire make a difference?.

dedge
09-25-2006, 10:42 AM
I just had a new 2001 Vette crate motor installed along with a set of PRC LS6 stage 1 heads. I am also running the Torquer V2 cam but on a 112. My car put down 386 rwhp thru an A4 unlocked with a Vig 3200-3400 stall. So I would say your rite about where you ought to be. The guy tuning said bring mine back in 1500 miles after the motor breaks in a little bit and he thought he could get 400 rwhp out of it. I've got the LS6 intake and a Dynamaxx long tube with the catted Y. :devil: Runs like a scalded dog doesn't it!!

Brian Tooley
09-25-2006, 01:35 PM
Most times a low torque # is from the heads, what is the port volume on those you have?

my 00 vette
09-25-2006, 01:49 PM
I just had a new 2001 Vette crate motor installed along with a set of PRC LS6 stage 1 heads. I am also running the Torquer V2 cam but on a 112. My car put down 386 rwhp thru an A4 unlocked with a Vig 3200-3400 stall. So I would say your rite about where you ought to be. The guy tuning said bring mine back in 1500 miles after the motor breaks in a little bit and he thought he could get 400 rwhp out of it. I've got the LS6 intake and a Dynamaxx long tube with the catted Y. :devil: Runs like a scalded dog doesn't it!!

Car does run hard though even though the numbers seem low.

Trevor @ Texas Speed & Perf.
09-25-2006, 01:58 PM
Then would you care to explain this a4 locked graph here:
http://www.texas-speed.com/briansgraph.jpg

Same heads & completely different torque. PRC heads ship with cnc ports & a cnc valve job to insure consistant results with every set!
Most times a low torque # is from the heads, what is the port volume on those you have?

HOSS
09-25-2006, 03:18 PM
Then would you care to explain this a4 locked graph here:


Same heads & completely different torque. PRC heads ship with cnc ports & a cnc valve job to insure consistant results with every set!
what cam was that with?

Zach@Texas-Speed
09-25-2006, 03:28 PM
The torquer 3

Brian Tooley
09-25-2006, 03:36 PM
Then would you care to explain this a4 locked graph here:

Same heads & completely different torque. PRC heads ship with cnc ports & a cnc valve job to insure consistant results with every set!


Is that date correct on the graph? Cause in late 2004 you guys didn't even have a running CNC did you? :eyes: Let alone this new PRC LS6 head? Unless the dyno graph is the prototype hand finished units? :bang:

I have also seen poor valve seat concentricity cause poor torque, I see that you have a CNC valve job, what type of seat and guide machine would that be?

You say every set ships with CNC valve job, isn't the valve job an optional upgrade on these heads?

What about my original question

what is the port volume on those you have?

HOSS
09-25-2006, 03:49 PM
The torquer 3

Wouldn't that make up for some of the torque too?

Curious about the date also, as version 3 of the cam just recently came out?

WS6FirebirdTA00
09-25-2006, 03:58 PM
At peak, what about under the curve? 15 is very good, I don't see people typially get that much. A friend of mine w/ an AFR 205 head - 224/228 cam combo only got 9 from an unported 90 & a 90mm TB over his stock stuff. It is an A4 C5 w/ a stall & full bolt ons.

I lost nothing under the curve and started to gain at 4k

Jason 98 TA
09-25-2006, 04:34 PM
I appreciate your concern about our products, but I think maybe it would be best if you worried about your own products. The graph was printed with the wrong date because the computers date was wrong. If you'd like discuss each others products we can do that, I have Mike Tokar's supposed super duper TEA ported Dart's here that flow FAR, FAR from what you quoted.

I appreciate your concern about our valve job, it has been dyno tested time & time again. Infact we have dyno tests in next months GM High Tech incase you'd like to see some results. Our CNC LS6 heads have been tested many times. If you have any questions on them you might also talk to Casey @ the School of Automotive Machinist. He recently flow tested one at over 315cfm @ .600 lift! Not bad for a set of $1000 heads that pickup 50+ flywheel horsepower with stock compression! Rest assured our valve job works just fine on that set of heads just like every other set that ships. The beauty of our seat & guide machine is that we can reproduce a valve job design consistantly everytime, and even make instant angle changes.

Attempting to discredit other vendors products... Nice... :eyes:

If you'd like to discuss this, feel free to contact me personally, instead of attempting to discredit my products on the internet.



Jason
Texas Speed
www.texas-speed.com


Is that date correct on the graph? Cause in late 2004 you guys didn't even have a running CNC did you? :eyes: Let alone this new PRC LS6 head? Unless the dyno graph is the prototype hand finished units? :bang:

I have also seen poor valve seat concentricity cause poor torque, I see that you have a CNC valve job, what type of seat and guide machine would that be?

You say every set ships with CNC valve job, isn't the valve job an optional upgrade on these heads?

What about my original question

cantdrv65
09-25-2006, 07:40 PM
Those are great numbers for an unlocked auto anyway you slice it. If you want bigger dyno numbers simply find out why the convertor wont lock....That is a problem in itself anyway. If the convertor doesnt lock it could be a bad lock up clutch and it WILL cost you a tranny eventually if you drive it without lockup up in Overdrive.

As for TEAs comments: This is an obvious attempt to discredit a competitors product with no basis. ESPECIALLY since the car was an unlocked auto and STILL produced very good numbers. I dont think the comments could have been made without malicious intent. If they were, it certainly shows said attacks were made by someone with little knowledge.

Brian Tooley
09-26-2006, 10:34 AM
I appreciate your concern about our products, but I think maybe it would be best if you worried about your own products. The graph was printed with the wrong date because the computers date was wrong. If you'd like discuss each others products we can do that, I have Mike Tokar's supposed super duper TEA ported Dart's here that flow FAR, FAR from what you quoted.

I appreciate your concern about our valve job, it has been dyno tested time & time again. Infact we have dyno tests in next months GM High Tech incase you'd like to see some results. Our CNC LS6 heads have been tested many times. If you have any questions on them you might also talk to Casey @ the School of Automotive Machinist. He recently flow tested one at over 315cfm @ .600 lift! Not bad for a set of $1000 heads that pickup 50+ flywheel horsepower with stock compression! Rest assured our valve job works just fine on that set of heads just like every other set that ships. The beauty of our seat & guide machine is that we can reproduce a valve job design consistantly everytime, and even make instant angle changes.

Attempting to discredit other vendors products... Nice... :eyes:

If you'd like to discuss this, feel free to contact me personally, instead of attempting to discredit my products on the internet.



Jason
Texas Speed
www.texas-speed.com

Well Jason, I asked a couple of questions about what might be causing this guys low torque, and you attacked my product by saying it flows "FAR, FAR" less then we say. I didn't talk about your LS6 heads that we had in here that had a HOLE in the pushrod pinch where it had been ported through, I didn't talk about the very same type of heads that have broken the intake rocker boss off the head at GMMG, nope, I just asked a couple of questions, based on problems I have seen in the past with our own products before we got a handle on some issues. I was simply trying to give some clues as to what might be causing problems.

So if you would like to go tit for tat on who has better products and the most problems, bring it.....

VINCE
09-26-2006, 10:45 AM
Bye Bye

Billdog350
09-26-2006, 02:43 PM
My 00....Long time no see! Those seat skins look good, I can't wait to get them installed.

This is pretty funny, I'm looking at the torquer cam, along with some LS6 heads I just picked up (and I'm planning on having decked!). Steve said he was doing heads and cam for you, I didn't know it was the same setup I was considering!

Good numbers....I'm aiming for 425-450rwhp and tq with my M6.....so it sounds like I'll be pretty close since you're using an unlocked coverter in your numbers.

my 00 vette
09-26-2006, 04:43 PM
Those are great numbers for an unlocked auto anyway you slice it. If you want bigger dyno numbers simply find out why the convertor wont lock....That is a problem in itself anyway. If the convertor doesnt lock it could be a bad lock up clutch and it WILL cost you a tranny eventually if you drive it without lockup up in Overdrive.

As for TEAs comments: This is an obvious attempt to discredit a competitors product with no basis. ESPECIALLY since the car was an unlocked auto and STILL produced very good numbers. I dont think the comments could have been made without malicious intent. If they were, it certainly shows said attacks were made by someone with little knowledge.

The car locks the converter on teh street just can't lock on the dyno through the computer I was told. I guess it doesn't matter on Dyno #'s. I was just curious to what I was losing.

WS6FirebirdTA00
09-26-2006, 05:49 PM
The car locks the converter on teh street just can't lock on the dyno through the computer I was told. I guess it doesn't matter on Dyno #'s. I was just curious to what I was losing.

You can lock it on the dyno with tuning software, FWIW, but thats the only way (that I know of)

98camaroLS1M6
09-26-2006, 06:04 PM
How high was it being revved?

The 90/90 will show most gains from 5500rpm and above, so if the stock shift point and rpm limter are in place I wouldn't expect much gain.

And from the dyno results I've seen the 90/90 should match a LS6 100% if not a little better all the way from 2000rpm up, right until it starts making more.

If you have stock cubes, the fast will kill low-end, not worth it unless your an M6 looking for every bit of performance at the track. This intake is meant for stroker motors. Stick with an ls6 intake

my 00 vette
09-26-2006, 06:20 PM
My 00....Long time no see! Those seat skins look good, I can't wait to get them installed.

This is pretty funny, I'm looking at the torquer cam, along with some LS6 heads I just picked up (and I'm planning on having decked!). Steve said he was doing heads and cam for you, I didn't know it was the same setup I was considering!

Good numbers....I'm aiming for 425-450rwhp and tq with my M6.....so it sounds like I'll be pretty close since you're using an unlocked coverter in your numbers.

Glad you're happy with the skins. I think if you have headers and LS6 intake you in for 425-430. Fun cam. Pulls nice with my 100 shot too. Keep me posted.

cantdrv65
09-26-2006, 06:21 PM
If you have stock cubes, the fast will kill low-end, not worth it unless your an M6 looking for every bit of performance at the track. This intake is meant for stroker motors. Stick with an ls6 intake

No it wont. You'll actually gain throughout the band with the Fast 90.....especially with a properly ported Fast, as done by Tony M.

my 00 vette
09-26-2006, 06:22 PM
You can lock it on the dyno with tuning software, FWIW, but thats the only way (that I know of)


Slowhawk tried to lock it a few times and would not. Maybe something is wrong with the converter. Nothing he did or didn't do. All the products/installation and tuning went great. Connecticut Corvette did the install. Nice work Steve. Make an appointment and save some money.

HOSS
09-26-2006, 06:31 PM
If you have stock cubes, the fast will kill low-end, not worth it unless your an M6 looking for every bit of performance at the track. This intake is meant for stroker motors. Stick with an ls6 intake
I didn't lose anything.

'Trust'
09-26-2006, 06:51 PM
Holy gianorous graph batman!!! Good numbers man, seems similar to mine!

Slowhawk
09-26-2006, 07:22 PM
Sorry it took so long to find this. The torque #'s are low because we were blowing through the converter.It's not the Combo,just a bogus torque reading.For some reason my computer has problems locking 00 cars.I'll have to look into it.If it was locked the HP and torque would be up alot. :)

Here is the graph.No tricks,right off the street from tuning.

300bhp/ton
09-27-2006, 02:30 AM
If you have stock cubes, the fast will kill low-end, not worth it unless your an M6 looking for every bit of performance at the track. This intake is meant for stroker motors. Stick with an ls6 intake
I assume you are making this assuption based on NOTHING??? Can you provide any proof to back up your claim?


http://www.tpis.com/plog/resserver.php?blogId=1&resource=img006.jpg
http://www.tpis.com/plog/resserver.php?blogId=1&resource=img009.jpg

DannoWS6
09-27-2006, 07:19 AM
Every body knows that numbers through autos on stalled cars are not a good means to measure performance. Every converter is different and regardless when you lock one up the torque will suffer thats the nature of the beast. You can't attribute the TQ #'s solely on the heads in this setup, thats not the reason for the lower #'s.

Even if slowhawk could get the lockup perfect he probably wouldn't see much more. Plus this is in a Vette so the IRS will hurt a little as well.

Those are respectable numbers for the setup. Don't worry she'll move.

My recommendation on the FAST intake on this car....Do it. Even if you lost a little down low (which you will NOT), the torque multiplication will negate those effects.

Billdog350
09-27-2006, 10:48 AM
Glad you're happy with the skins. I think if you have headers and LS6 intake you in for 425-430. Fun cam. Pulls nice with my 100 shot too. Keep me posted.

What's your take on drivability on that cam? I guess since you have an auto it'll be totally different. I'm looking for something I can still use in 6th gear with stock rear end on the highway....so 1500rpm drivability is key. I heard the torquer 2 can be dropped right in with minimal tuning...but obviously larger gains from more tuning....Steve is talking with slowhawk directly so I'm confident they'll pick the right cam for me. :devil:

Slowhawk
09-28-2006, 06:29 PM
What's your take on drivability on that cam? I guess since you have an auto it'll be totally different. I'm looking for something I can still use in 6th gear with stock rear end on the highway....so 1500rpm drivability is key. I heard the torquer 2 can be dropped right in with minimal tuning...but obviously larger gains from more tuning....Steve is talking with slowhawk directly so I'm confident they'll pick the right cam for me. :devil:

This Cam is more of a topend setup.It was a bitch to get the car to idle right due to the low vacuum,but I think it's good so far.

Steve is talking to me about a few Cams so I don't know which one is your's.The Cams are ussually picked by mods and drivability the customer expects.

my 00 vette
10-01-2006, 12:31 PM
If I were to add a 90/90 ported nitake and ported TB what do you think its worth for power. Looking to see what this would do before thinking about the new short block. If I could put down 430 RWHP then I would be good for a while.

SteveDoten@ARH
10-02-2006, 07:28 PM
this thread really took off; I did another Vette with the TSP LS6 heads back in April, the owner installed a fast90 before visiting Slowhawk for the tune, made 446rwhp(MS3, Kooks)although that was through a M6/3.42's, different animal

Matt, get that Vette up to NED and bring back some low 11sec time slips, time for the cage :headbang:

my 00 vette
10-02-2006, 07:40 PM
I think we should get a few together and go up. What do you say?

my 00 vette
10-02-2006, 07:45 PM
I also have to admit that this car is a blast to drive. Put it in 1st and hammer it and pop into 2nd at 6500 and boil the tires off it. Can't help it. Will have to stop eventually as tires are not cheap.

Zach@Texas-Speed
10-06-2006, 09:47 AM
I also have to admit that this car is a blast to drive. Put it in 1st and hammer it and pop into 2nd at 6500 and boil the tires off it. Can't help it. Will have to stop eventually as tires are not cheap.


Glad to see that you are having fun with your setup!! The driveability should be great with that cam as well as the sound too. Like Danno said, automatic cars are inconsistant with dyno numbers, they truly shine at the track. I'm sure if you get a tire on that car you will be satisfied with how it gets you down the track. Let us know track times for sure!!

Zach

my 00 vette
10-17-2006, 06:37 PM
If I swap over to Fast intake and T/B could I pick up 25 rwhp?