Ultra-Z

Hey guys,
I dont post alot but I do alot of reading on here and have tons of respect for all opinions given. I have been debating for the longest time to go all motor or forced induction. I drive an 02 Camaro SS 35th anniversary car with a stock LS motor. I have thought about going with an F14 cam ported LS6 heads then finishing it off with all the bolt ons. The other thing I was thinking of doing was forced induction either a procharger d1sc or a single turbo setup. im not worried about how much this would cost but what would be the most reliable; for this car is a daily driver in the summer, spring months. I LOVE the sound of turbos and superchargers but then I LOVE the sound of a cammed LSx motor. what should I do?!

prostock_bigblock

iTrader: (11)

Faster= Turbo.

beardWS6

iTrader: (1)

Build it big. then spray it! I did!!

bichin95redta

I did an all-engine build. 383 stroker, forged rotating assembly, F.A.S.T. 90MM intake, Roberts 90MM T/B, F.A.S.T. fuel rails, F.A.S.T. 36# injectors, AFR 225 Mongoose heads, Comp billet cam, 234*/240*, .598/.609, 112* LSA, Kooks long-tubes, Kooks ORY, Spec billet steel flywheel, and Spec Stage IV clutch.

If I had it to do all over again, I'd go forced induction...probably an intercooled turbo set-up. To get an all-engine car to make anywhere near the power of a forced induction car, you'll either have an unstreetable monster, or you'll have to tone it down some, and spray it. All-engine cars pretty much require high compression to make power, and that pretty much rules out forced induction.

Forced induction cars make sick, insane power, and yet are still very streetable. I wouldn't get a serious (lots 'o boost) forced induction set-up without a forged rotating assembly. They are two very different animals; each requiring intelligent, well thought-out component selection.

I'm finding out that all-engine cars, at least mine, have more low-speed/low RPM driveability issues, are touchy, and require a PERFECT tune to run right. Forced induction just sits there until you need it. When you don't need it, and you're just cruisin' around, they are very tame on the street. Yeah, I love the "rumpety-rump" from my cammed stroker, but these low speed driveability issues are driving me insane. Even with those issues solved, I'm no match for the forced induction guys, and my car is no slouch. Now, in order to keep up, my only choice is to spray it. I may be wrong, but over the long-haul, I think forced induction cars will prove more durable than a sprayed, all-engine car.

A forced induction, forged rotating assembly set-up will probably cost somewhat more than a forged rotating assembly all-engine car to build, but over the long-haul, I think it would be worth it. I went for a ride in an '02 Camaro SS turbo car, and I was amazed! You know how N/A cars start to fall on their face towards the top of the RPM range in each gear? This thing didn't....it just kept right on a pullin' like a freight train. I had a case of perma-smirk for a week.

NassyVette

iTrader: (22)

If cost isn't an issue this is a no brainer...TURBO.

ls1muscle

iTrader: (16)

Forced induction = $$$

Be prepared to spend 25k to do it right.

BlackHawk T/A

iTrader: (3)

Another thing to consider is weight. An NA car will be quite a bit lighter in the front and will be able to handle the corners better.

Also low vacuum from running long duration camshafts can be a downside.

Driveability with FI is going to be better if you can live with the extra weight.

And about cost: often times when you add up heads/cam/intake/valvetrain/pump/chain/labor you would be surprised that it may not be too far off from a low-end FI setup.

michael402z06

iTrader: (15)

if you have the money go forced induction. most people don't do it because the money.

SHINER

iTrader: (18)

I dont think so...MAybe 10K at the max...


Anyways a N/A motor i believe is a healthier motor, its the safest way to go. get a 408 and spray the hell outta it.

Ksett

I would sell your longblock and put the money towards a 402 setup with nice heads. When you get used to the power you can add a 200 shot and still be reliable.

Gauge

iTrader: (3)

If you want streetable, reliable power I'd do SC. Centrifugal superchargers (i.e. Prochargers) put very little strain on the motor until you wind them up, and then they're able to put down a very respectable amount of power. A SC'd car will typically be able to slap around all but the craziest N/A cars and without breaking much of a sweat. Plus, if you ever decide to get a little wilder with your build, you basically just need to make a few changes so you can turn up the boost. You want several hundred more horsepower? It's doable. Not so with an N/A car.

And, despite what people may say, I am fully convinced that a mild Procharger build will outlast a sprayed car quite easily. Plus, I would imagine it would be more prone to a slow wearing out of the rings or bearings vs. a sprayed car which would probably experience very sudden and catastrophic failure.

I started an N/A car. I'm changing gears and getting ready for a Procharger. Turbos are great, too, but the Procharger is going to be a tad more reliable, and I always associate turbos with imports for some reason.



EDIT -- And, let's not forget that spray is only there when you have a full bottle and you've turned it on. Forced induction is just a foot stomp away at all times. "Bottles are for babies. Real men get blown."

cws T/A

iTrader: (3)

The Ohio Forced Inductions Kit is something you should look at
https://www.ohioforcedinduction.com/98-02_F-body.html

Bolt on and go kit and it retains air conditioning . To top off the power it produces on stock vehicles its also an awesome looking kit for those who like to pop the hood at car shows. Its even avalible in stainless steel.

30th t/a

iTrader: (51)

let me just say you & I are in the same boat. Im about 99.9% sure im going back to turbo. I will be buying the turbo-zone truck kit. cheap (for a turbo kit) and it uses truck manifolds which are very durable and wont crack like tubular turbo headers. i was thinking of a 402 with AFR225's & 90mm setup but I like how with the turbo it makes more power, more torque, its drive & sounds like a stock ls1 but when you jump on it its a totally different car. its like 2 cars in 1. with the 402, its gonna be loud all the time and that can get annoying on the ear. I know my old h/c setup making 455rwhp sure did.

30th t/a

iTrader: (51)

this is is exactly what I experience. and I still had my 4.10 gears. i couldnt imagine what it would be like if I had 3.42's. my old twin turbo pulled till next week. it never stoped pulling. it was actually kinda scary, thats how I know I need to stay FI.

30th t/a

iTrader: (51)

no way $25,000. i went FI with twin turbos with forged pistons & rods and with everything including labor & tune, it was $13,200

$25,000, yea if you went with the most expensive everything.

staringback05

iTrader: (8)

<-----SEE WHAT REAGAN HAS TO SAY

bichin95redta

staringback05....I'm pissin' my pants laughing here! I didn't know Ronnie was an all-engine guy.......

ls1muscle

iTrader: (16)

So, you think that a forged shortblock, heads, cam, intake manifold, other valvetrain, fuel pump, fuel rails, fuel lines, turbo, injectors, intercooler, intercooler piping, wastegate, blow off valve, turbo exhaust manifolds, rebuilt transmission, clutch + flywheel, bellhousing, driveshaft, rearend, driveshaft safety loop, (boost, wideband, fuel pressure) gauges, isn't going to be over $10k?

That's not even including suspension, wheels/tires, or any labor and tuning involved with this process. His car is pretty much stock.

prostock_bigblock

iTrader: (11)

I am going with a twins very soon, and I am expecting to make atleast 550rwhp on stock short block and I calculated all the expenses and i went out with around 6000$ installed with the fuel sysetem including heads and gasket to drop the compression. 3 or months later I will drop a fresh forged short block and I am still under 10k.

30th t/a

iTrader: (51)

ive been turbo. you dont NEED fuel rails, you dont NEED a 12 bolt, you dont NEED a driveshaft loop, you dont NEED aftermarket heads or cam. rebuilt tranny? not everyone wants a 1000rwhp turbo car. you can make 500-550 easy without this stuff. I will say you SHOULD have a 12 bolt, but my 10 bolt has takin alot of abuse. but im not at the track doing 5000rpm launces either.

i took my stock short block & had forged rods & 8.5:1 mahle pistons, stock crank, new rings & bearings. stock heads with 918 springs, ls6 intake, ARP head bolts stock everything else! racetronix intake & mototron 65lb injectors stock 6 speed with a spec 3 clutch. i made 535/591 with 12 psi. found my boost leak and I was making 18psi. the car ran awesome.