402 w/ 250/258 .580/.580---heads??
03-01-2007, 05:37 PM
#1
402 w/ 250/258 .580/.580---heads?? I just ordered my LS2 402 from SDPC with -14cc pistons. The cam I got with it is a 250/258 with .580/.580 lift on a 108 LSA. I know, it is going to be pretty wicked.
My question is this...what heads should I go with? I am going to be going with budget heads if I do heads right now so I am pretty much stuck between Patriot Performance Stage 3 LS6 or Stage 3 LQ9 heads or TSP's LS6 heads. I would mill them down to about 64cc and run a .040 cometic gasket and am aiming for 10.5-11.0:1 compression.
Now, here is another question. I would really like to be able to stash come cash away and invest in some ETP 245s later on down the road and would really like to run my stock 98 LS1 heads for now. Would it be possible to have the shop mill my stock LS1 heads down to about 64cc and run an upgraded spring/spring kit? That way I could still have a running car with some nice power and have time to save up for the heads I'd really like. I would still be running the .040 head gasket with the stock LS1 heads.
Let me get some feedback on this, the motor should be here by Tuesday and I'd like to have an idea of what I'm doing with the heads pretty soon. Thanks!
My question is this...what heads should I go with? I am going to be going with budget heads if I do heads right now so I am pretty much stuck between Patriot Performance Stage 3 LS6 or Stage 3 LQ9 heads or TSP's LS6 heads. I would mill them down to about 64cc and run a .040 cometic gasket and am aiming for 10.5-11.0:1 compression.
Now, here is another question. I would really like to be able to stash come cash away and invest in some ETP 245s later on down the road and would really like to run my stock 98 LS1 heads for now. Would it be possible to have the shop mill my stock LS1 heads down to about 64cc and run an upgraded spring/spring kit? That way I could still have a running car with some nice power and have time to save up for the heads I'd really like. I would still be running the .040 head gasket with the stock LS1 heads.
Let me get some feedback on this, the motor should be here by Tuesday and I'd like to have an idea of what I'm doing with the heads pretty soon. Thanks!
03-01-2007, 09:37 PM
#4
[QUOTE=SVT THIS]I just ordered my LS2 402 from SDPC with -14cc pistons. The cam I got with it is a 250/258 with .580/.580 lift on a 108 LSA. I know, it is going to be pretty wicked.
My question is this...what heads should I go with?
TEA 225's would be killer, but pricey. That cam seems odd to me, not much lift...I would think 402 would want .630 lift or so. I agree more CR is called for, and L92's would be a great choice. Stock L92's with upgraded springs are only $1100 from SDPC. You would likely have to change the cam, since the only thing we know for sure is that L92's are super sensitive to cam choice.
Spend the $1100 for L92's with .650 lift spring package, get a new cam per recommendation from SDPC or WCCH, or other people doing cams with L92's right now....then you can use the $528 L76 intake/TB/rails/injectors. Cheap and nasty!
My question is this...what heads should I go with?
TEA 225's would be killer, but pricey. That cam seems odd to me, not much lift...I would think 402 would want .630 lift or so. I agree more CR is called for, and L92's would be a great choice. Stock L92's with upgraded springs are only $1100 from SDPC. You would likely have to change the cam, since the only thing we know for sure is that L92's are super sensitive to cam choice.
Spend the $1100 for L92's with .650 lift spring package, get a new cam per recommendation from SDPC or WCCH, or other people doing cams with L92's right now....then you can use the $528 L76 intake/TB/rails/injectors. Cheap and nasty!
03-01-2007, 10:36 PM
#5
I was told that the L92 heads will not work with the current LS6 intake setup I have. I plan on going with a different intake setup once finances permit, but for now, the LS6 intake is all I can afford. I'd love to go with the L92s, but like I said, I was under the impression I would have to use the L76 intake with it.
So, I guess I could save up some cash or wait for taxes and go with the L92/L76 setup all at once. By then, there may be some more cam info out on the L92s.
Since cash flow is small for now but I would still like a set of heads to hold me over until I can afford cash wise and time wise for a seperate head/intake install, should I go with Patriot Performance stage 3 6.0l heads or should I try and go with TSP CNC LS6 heads with some upgraded valves?
If I went with the PP Stage 3 6.0l heads, what do I need to have them milled to with a .040 cometic gasket to get 11:1 compression? What about 11.5:1?
Same question with the TSP LS6 heads? What about my stock 98 LS1 heads?
Is 11:1 or 11.5:1 going to be okay with 91 octane? The car is a daily driver and 91 octane is the highest I can get around here and I'd like to avoid knock as much as possible.
Lastly, I just put stock sized injectors in the car about 5000 miles ago. Bryan at SDPC told me that if I wasn't going to go with a power adder that they should be fine for a while. What do you all think about this? Would I be fine holding off till summer to upgrade the injectors when I do the last head/cam install or am I going to be in trouble?
Thanks for the info guys, I appreciate it.
-Mitchell
So, I guess I could save up some cash or wait for taxes and go with the L92/L76 setup all at once. By then, there may be some more cam info out on the L92s.
Since cash flow is small for now but I would still like a set of heads to hold me over until I can afford cash wise and time wise for a seperate head/intake install, should I go with Patriot Performance stage 3 6.0l heads or should I try and go with TSP CNC LS6 heads with some upgraded valves?
If I went with the PP Stage 3 6.0l heads, what do I need to have them milled to with a .040 cometic gasket to get 11:1 compression? What about 11.5:1?
Same question with the TSP LS6 heads? What about my stock 98 LS1 heads?
Is 11:1 or 11.5:1 going to be okay with 91 octane? The car is a daily driver and 91 octane is the highest I can get around here and I'd like to avoid knock as much as possible.
Lastly, I just put stock sized injectors in the car about 5000 miles ago. Bryan at SDPC told me that if I wasn't going to go with a power adder that they should be fine for a while. What do you all think about this? Would I be fine holding off till summer to upgrade the injectors when I do the last head/cam install or am I going to be in trouble?
Thanks for the info guys, I appreciate it.
-Mitchell
03-01-2007, 10:42 PM
#6
Go with the stock 98 heads if you don't want to spend money now. You can mill those down a lot more because they start at 66cc. Mill them down to 59cc or so and let her rip (11.5:1 CR). You'll still see over 450rwhp in a 6-speed.
Then, I'd go with a ported FAST 90 + TFS 225s.
Then, I'd go with a ported FAST 90 + TFS 225s.
03-01-2007, 10:47 PM
#7
I think that is what I'd like to do. To me though, that power number seems somewhat small. I mean, it is a lot of power by all means, however, 346's with smaller cam-only setups (MS3, TRex) are seeing more than 450rwhp. That is kind of discouraging =(
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03-01-2007, 11:24 PM
#9
The pistons are a -14cc dish.
Should I call SDPC earrrrly tomorrow and have them send me a differently spec'd cam? I could buy some dual springs to account for more lift and put them on my stock heads when I mill them down.
So, with a LS2 402 with an LS6 intake, and stock 98 LS1 heads milled to 59cc's and springs capable of .650 lift what cam should I be looking at? I would like to produce close to 480rwhp. I live about 30min away from Ed Wright's shop and I can have him tune the car for me so I imagine I could handle a pretty aggressive cam.
The reason I went with such a low lift cam to start with was the fact that I was NOT going to be doing the heads right away so I wouldn't have good springs. Poor reason, I know. Anyways, I wouldn't mind getting some dual springs so I could run a higher lift cam if it would produce significant power over the cam I am already getting.
Jake Fusion, Patrick G, Predator Z??? Help me please! If you can chime in before 8:00am so I can call SDPC I'll be eternally grateful!
Should I call SDPC earrrrly tomorrow and have them send me a differently spec'd cam? I could buy some dual springs to account for more lift and put them on my stock heads when I mill them down.
So, with a LS2 402 with an LS6 intake, and stock 98 LS1 heads milled to 59cc's and springs capable of .650 lift what cam should I be looking at? I would like to produce close to 480rwhp. I live about 30min away from Ed Wright's shop and I can have him tune the car for me so I imagine I could handle a pretty aggressive cam.
The reason I went with such a low lift cam to start with was the fact that I was NOT going to be doing the heads right away so I wouldn't have good springs. Poor reason, I know. Anyways, I wouldn't mind getting some dual springs so I could run a higher lift cam if it would produce significant power over the cam I am already getting.
Jake Fusion, Patrick G, Predator Z??? Help me please! If you can chime in before 8:00am so I can call SDPC I'll be eternally grateful!
Last edited by SVT THIS; 03-02-2007 at 12:02 AM.
03-02-2007, 02:59 AM
#11
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Patriot Stage 2 LS6's (pat-2033)
spec's... 59cc Ls6 head stage 2 port with 2.055" intake / 1.57" exhaust and .650" patriot gold springs.
Note: the Patriot 6.0L heads start at a 72cc and you would need to have them milled. The 2033's are instock at different locations (summitt) and are already milled to a 59cc chamber size.
I would suggest going with a slightly higher lift cam, or maybe a set of 1.75" rockers (harland sharp, crane, or comp) to increase the lift on that cam from .580" to .597" (1.75's give you 3% more lift then the stock 1.7" rockers).
Note: 1.8" rockers would put the cam you spec'd up to .614"
The heads are around $1300 come with the gold .650" springs and flow around 304cfm at .600" (just where a set of 1.75's would put you). In the future if you want to upgrade to a set of AFR or ETP's the 1.75's would be able to be used on those heads as well.
The smallest stage 3 head that patriot offers in a prebuilt set is the 64cc 2015 (2.08" intake 1.60" exhaust stage 3 LS6 head).
Spec page from Patriot's web site.
http://www.patriot-performance.com/w...05234&DID=1225
spec's... 59cc Ls6 head stage 2 port with 2.055" intake / 1.57" exhaust and .650" patriot gold springs.
Note: the Patriot 6.0L heads start at a 72cc and you would need to have them milled. The 2033's are instock at different locations (summitt) and are already milled to a 59cc chamber size.
I would suggest going with a slightly higher lift cam, or maybe a set of 1.75" rockers (harland sharp, crane, or comp) to increase the lift on that cam from .580" to .597" (1.75's give you 3% more lift then the stock 1.7" rockers).
Note: 1.8" rockers would put the cam you spec'd up to .614"
The heads are around $1300 come with the gold .650" springs and flow around 304cfm at .600" (just where a set of 1.75's would put you). In the future if you want to upgrade to a set of AFR or ETP's the 1.75's would be able to be used on those heads as well.
The smallest stage 3 head that patriot offers in a prebuilt set is the 64cc 2015 (2.08" intake 1.60" exhaust stage 3 LS6 head).
Spec page from Patriot's web site.
http://www.patriot-performance.com/w...05234&DID=1225
Last edited by Bring the Noise; 03-02-2007 at 03:10 AM.
03-02-2007, 08:53 AM
#13
Originally Posted by ONEBADWS6
What do I know I only have the slowest N/A LS2!!!!
03-02-2007, 09:49 AM
#15
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480 rw on stock heads is out of reach imo. the injectors will probably be maxed even with the stock heads on there also.i would suggest either saving alittle while or borrowing some funds and do it right the first time.if you can't get any money anytime soon however i would use the stockers milled down with a good set of springs and get a different cam,something like what i have or alittle bigger if you don't care to lose some tq for the extra hp.if you add up what a set of patriot heads or whichever one you are thinking about getting would cost you along with a set of injectors then the price would be similar to the l92 heads with upgraded springs and the 76 setup.as said though you will need a different cam with the l92/76 setup as well,something like a 234/244 114 or so probably.
03-02-2007, 11:10 AM
#17
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the l92 heads would definately be the way to go but you have to run the l76 intake that goes along with them the livernois 243 heads make the same if not more power then afrs and tfs heads definately a bad *** head for the money and that .580 lift definately need no less than .630 good duration numbers i would be lookin for a 110 - 112 lobe sep though
03-02-2007, 02:36 PM
#18
Originally Posted by 1bad lad
the l92 heads would definately be the way to go but you have to run the l76 intake that goes along with them the livernois 243 heads make the same if not more power then afrs and tfs heads definately a bad *** head for the money and that .580 lift definately need no less than .630 good duration numbers i would be lookin for a 110 - 112 lobe sep though
Jesus christ man use punctuation!
If you want to go with some budget heads with room to upgrade later, you might try and pick up a set of the Dart heads. You get great flow as cast and can always send them into TEA at a later time to put a nice CNC job on them and make killer power.
Also cam only 346's don't make 450 rwhp. Maybe 1 or two cars do...but N/A cam only ls1's usually make 385-425 peak rwhp depending on cam and supporting mods.
If you want a fast car look at average hp and area under the curve, not just peak numbers.
Marty
