Dr. Jeckel

iTrader: (12)

Considering everything else is equal and the only changes would be the Cam and Head gasket, which setup would put up better numbers at the track?
I am going to do TSP 5.3L stage 2.5 Heads with my current cam and a .045 cometic gasket, but I am considering swapping out my T2 for a cam such as the MS4 at the same time and running a stock(.054) GM head gasket(for PTVC). I don't want to have to flycut...sorry guys.
The increased compression that the T2 allows, because of the thinner gasket should help low and midrange alot, but would the MS4 still make better numbers at the track?
The drivetrain setup would included a moser 12 bolt with 3.91 gears, 15 inch draglites with 275/50-15 DR's and a RAM HD clutch.

Thanks, James.

chewy99ws6

iTrader: (8)

I would go MS4, I have the MS3 and love it

Dr. Jeckel

iTrader: (12)

I was kinda looking more of a technical type of answer ....like;

"The T2 would make better overall torque and horsepower and therefore win"

or

"The MS4 would pull the T2 on the big end, while only giving up a small amount of power down low"

...these are the two outcomes I would think would occur, but trying to see which one is correct.

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

MS4 is beter for a track only car, it needs a steep gear to keep it in that great powerband too.

Dr. Jeckel

iTrader: (12)

MS4 on a 111 LSA (240/242 .649/.61 is the closest I could get for the calculator to read it) with .052 gasket yields a 10.85 SCR and 7.86 DCR

T2 on a 112 LSA with .045 gasket yields a 11.04 SCR and 8.22 DCR

Can anybody give some kinda technical critique between the two setups and the possible outcomes I thought might occur?

Beaflag VonRathburg

iTrader: (176)

What about an intermediate cam like the Tourqer 3? I don't know what the SCR or DCR would work out to be, but it would be a step up from your current cam. Patrick G is the man you want to ask. He knows all about this stuff in extreme detail.

Dr. Jeckel

iTrader: (12)

Kinda hoping Patrick G. would put his 2 cents in

...two votes for my current cam, not the expected answer, reasons why?

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

The MS4 holds the valves open longer and has more overlap. It is a track cam all the way compared to the torquer.

Both are great track cams though.

Dr. Jeckel

iTrader: (12)

I don't want to sound like a jerk, but I'm getting just general blanket statements for pretty specific questions (atleast I believe they are).

I know that the MS4 is made for all out horsepower and that my Torquer is not. Question is which "setup", between these two, is gonna make the faster car in the quarter mile and I really am wanting technical data or facts to back the statement up.


btw, T3(had to use 232 - .643) shows the same DCR as the T2....wonder if DCR only calculated off of duration?

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

LOL, I gave you technical facts as to why the MS4 will go faster down the strip. Let me repeat myself again. The MS4 holds the valves open a while longer than the torquer and it has more overlap. The high duration and high overlap period allow this cam to breath a lot more for a much longer period. The longer you hold a valve open the more air that gets sucked into the engine which results in more fule being injected which results in a stronger explosion which results in more power to your rear wheels. The high overlap in the MS4 will aid in sucking more fresh air into the engine, end result: more air=more power.

You just need gear it right to keep the MS4 in its powerband to keep it hauling *** in all gears.

DCR is calculated using the position of the piston when the intake valve is at .006 on the closeing side of it.

if you want to try to see how they nehave differently, run the numbers through the DCr calculator and you will see the valve events.

Dr. Jeckel

iTrader: (12)

Thanks Brad, I know the increased duration allows the valves to stay open and more overlap allows more time to pull air into the cylinders, thus creating more power.
So even though the DCR is way down and it is obviously gonna make less torque through the low-midrange, you believe the MS4 with a stock head gasket will out perform the T2 setup, did I sum it up correctly?

Wanna make guesstimate on e.t. difference?

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

DCR isnt really going to make much of a difference up high, you did say this is a track only car so dont worry about the low end power, your gear will keep the rpm's up high through the entire 1/4 mile.

If you take the same engine and and compare these 2 cams, the MS4 is a top end monster while the torquer will yield more down low power.

I believe there would be a significant difference of ET's between the 2 cams, how much is hard for me to say.

Dr. Jeckel

iTrader: (12)

Just found out my comparison is somewhat pointless, as I was reading I found a post where TSP said the 5.3 stage 2.5's will not work with the MS4 without flycutting. They will however work with the LS6 stage 1 heads; 11.71 SCR, 7.76 DCR.

camarokid94

iTrader: (2)

i dissagree... he has a full weight race car. he will need all the TQ he can get to get out of the hole. thats where a race is won or lost. ask any racer whats more imporatant the first 60ft or the last 60ft to gettting you ET down. 60ft always wins. i would go the the smaller and thinnner gasket. better DDablity too. easier on the drivetrain not spinning high RPMs mainly clutch