A/C compressor
08-25-2007, 10:15 PM
#2
It's really not that difficult, if you take your time on each step. Did you have any specific area of concern, or just in general? I could walk you through the basics, if that is what you wish to do.
What year is your car? The reason that I ask is that one of the things that you are going to have to do is replace the dryer, so you will have to know where it is located.
Also, do you have a set of gauges, which will be required.
What year is your car? The reason that I ask is that one of the things that you are going to have to do is replace the dryer, so you will have to know where it is located.
Also, do you have a set of gauges, which will be required.
08-26-2007, 11:02 AM
#3
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Sorry its a '94 Formula.
The a/c works, but the compressor is making a horrible noise (sounds like a motor thats thrown a rod!!).
I've been getting quotes for $150 + just to install the compressor, so i'd like to put that money towards some long tubes and do the work myself. A buddy has a set of gauges I can use.
What I need to know really is can I, with limited tools and work area, accomplish the task easily. I have ramps, sockets, wrenches, basic mechanics tools, etc., but no specialty stuff. And can it be done over a weekend (its my daily driver, but I do have a work van if nessesary).
One other thing, I was price comparing last night, and there are two prices for the compressor, one for automatic and one for stick, what is the difference? (mine is auto).
Thanks
Sara Lou
The a/c works, but the compressor is making a horrible noise (sounds like a motor thats thrown a rod!!).
I've been getting quotes for $150 + just to install the compressor, so i'd like to put that money towards some long tubes and do the work myself. A buddy has a set of gauges I can use.
What I need to know really is can I, with limited tools and work area, accomplish the task easily. I have ramps, sockets, wrenches, basic mechanics tools, etc., but no specialty stuff. And can it be done over a weekend (its my daily driver, but I do have a work van if nessesary).
One other thing, I was price comparing last night, and there are two prices for the compressor, one for automatic and one for stick, what is the difference? (mine is auto).
Thanks
Sara Lou
08-26-2007, 01:06 PM
#7
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lol, the air on my 94 formula is not working either, got it checked out, seems to just be the lines have leaks since the car sat for a year...getting it fixed monday or tuesday...
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08-26-2007, 05:13 PM
#8
Wow, lots of requests, all in different states. First, the disclaimer: I assume no responsibility for what you may do. All I offer are options that may work.
(Just for the lawyers in the audience).
I am assuming that all systems are R134a systems. If you have an R12 system, you need to go to a licensed professional. I don't remember what year the transition occured. Some work can be done (such as the physical replacement of the unit) but filling must be done by the pro.
I will start from the back first, and end up at Sara Lou.
GreenBlood, if you don't run your a/c periodically, the lubricant fails to circulate, the seals dry out, and then you get the leaks you are describing. Since you are paying to get it fixed, you should be good to go.
camaro-94-z28, you need to find out why it quit working first. You should not go into parts replacement mode until you know. For example, if you replace the compressor, when the problem was actually a leaky hose, you just wasted money. I suggest that you (or a friend) put a can of leak detector in and see if you can find a leak. It normally contains a red dye, which will show up (normally) at a junction of hoses, at the rear of the compressor, or any joint in the system. After you find and fix the problem (by replacing the hose, for example) you can move to the refill stage (follows).
3pnt4maro, I am not sure what "almost gone" means. I will make the assumption that yours is making the noise that Sara Lou's is making, and respond accordingly.
Whew. Sara Lou, since you asked the original question, I will start a separate post for you.
(Just for the lawyers in the audience).
I am assuming that all systems are R134a systems. If you have an R12 system, you need to go to a licensed professional. I don't remember what year the transition occured. Some work can be done (such as the physical replacement of the unit) but filling must be done by the pro.
I will start from the back first, and end up at Sara Lou.
GreenBlood, if you don't run your a/c periodically, the lubricant fails to circulate, the seals dry out, and then you get the leaks you are describing. Since you are paying to get it fixed, you should be good to go.
camaro-94-z28, you need to find out why it quit working first. You should not go into parts replacement mode until you know. For example, if you replace the compressor, when the problem was actually a leaky hose, you just wasted money. I suggest that you (or a friend) put a can of leak detector in and see if you can find a leak. It normally contains a red dye, which will show up (normally) at a junction of hoses, at the rear of the compressor, or any joint in the system. After you find and fix the problem (by replacing the hose, for example) you can move to the refill stage (follows).
3pnt4maro, I am not sure what "almost gone" means. I will make the assumption that yours is making the noise that Sara Lou's is making, and respond accordingly.
Whew. Sara Lou, since you asked the original question, I will start a separate post for you.
08-26-2007, 05:41 PM
#10
Well, Sara Lou, I wish I had your response this morning. I just came back from an fbody meet, I could have checked out some 94s and seen why the price is different. Such is life. I suggest that you pose the question to the supplier, and get a better answer than "the part number is different". Sorry.
Yes, you can do it in the work environment you described. Because your system is still sealed, you will be able to save some money. If the system is totally empty of refrigerant, you would have to replace the dryer as well. It contains a dessicant that removes moisture from the system. If the system is open, it quickly becomes full of moisture and the dessicant no longer works, requiring you to replace it.
OTOH, you will have to remove the refrigerant in the pressurized system. The correct way to do it is to pump it out into an approved container. The incorrect way is to relieve it through the schaeder valve on the low side of the system (diagram to follow). Your call.
Now, assuming that the refrigerant has been removed (you can check with the gauges, diagram to follow) you can begin the disassembly. There should be two hoses connected to the rear of compressor, and one electrical wire. One of the hoses is the low side (pre-compressed) and one is the high side (post-compressed). The wire goes to the clutch, turning it on and off.
The following pertains specifically to a 97, which is what I own. It should be almost identical to a 94, if not exactly the same.
You should have the new compressor sitting next to you. You will be opening up a sealed system. The time it is open should be minimized, to prevent moisture from entering the system. The new compressor should have a bottle of oil included with it. It should also have a pair of seals for the hoses you are going to remove. Also, have at least one (preferably two) measuring cups or flasks of some type. If you have two, make sure they are identical.
Step-by-step in next post.
Yes, you can do it in the work environment you described. Because your system is still sealed, you will be able to save some money. If the system is totally empty of refrigerant, you would have to replace the dryer as well. It contains a dessicant that removes moisture from the system. If the system is open, it quickly becomes full of moisture and the dessicant no longer works, requiring you to replace it.
OTOH, you will have to remove the refrigerant in the pressurized system. The correct way to do it is to pump it out into an approved container. The incorrect way is to relieve it through the schaeder valve on the low side of the system (diagram to follow). Your call.
Now, assuming that the refrigerant has been removed (you can check with the gauges, diagram to follow) you can begin the disassembly. There should be two hoses connected to the rear of compressor, and one electrical wire. One of the hoses is the low side (pre-compressed) and one is the high side (post-compressed). The wire goes to the clutch, turning it on and off.
The following pertains specifically to a 97, which is what I own. It should be almost identical to a 94, if not exactly the same.
You should have the new compressor sitting next to you. You will be opening up a sealed system. The time it is open should be minimized, to prevent moisture from entering the system. The new compressor should have a bottle of oil included with it. It should also have a pair of seals for the hoses you are going to remove. Also, have at least one (preferably two) measuring cups or flasks of some type. If you have two, make sure they are identical.
Step-by-step in next post.
08-26-2007, 05:49 PM
#11
Originally Posted by camaro-94-z28
i already took mine to the shop he said its the compersor and clutch he said 800$ but if i can do it for cheaper i will
AFA prices, I have no idea what these parts cost for your car. Perhaps Sara Lou can help you on that issue, IDK.
08-26-2007, 06:05 PM
#12
First, a diagram of a complete system. We are only concerned about the compressor and the high/low side schaeder valves, which is where you will connect the gauges.
http://www.familycar.com/ac1.htm (generic system, but they are all the same).
Scroll down to the diagram. Note the red lines (denoting the high pressure side) and the blue lines (denoting the low pressure side). Your gauges will have the same color hoses, one to each gauge, plus a yellow line, which goes in the middle. The yellow line goes to the can of refrigerant. Find the schraeder valve for each side (low side tap, high side tap) and connect the appropriate color hose. Verify that the pressure is zero. (read the instructions for your gauges as to how to use them. For example, some have valves, some do not.)
O.K., we now have an empty system. Let's get on to the mechanics.
Remove the serpentine belt.
Unplug the electical wire going to the clutch.
Jack the car up; this work is best done from below.
Remove the hoses. They should be at the back of the compressor, secured by a plate with one bolt each. Remove the old seals and plug the end of each hose to prevent bugs from trying to make their home in your system.
Unbolt and remove the rear compressor mount.
Remove the compressor-to-front-bracket bolts and nuts and lower the compressor from the engine compartment, being careful to not lose any fluid from the openings at the back where the hoses were connected.
http://www.familycar.com/ac1.htm (generic system, but they are all the same).
Scroll down to the diagram. Note the red lines (denoting the high pressure side) and the blue lines (denoting the low pressure side). Your gauges will have the same color hoses, one to each gauge, plus a yellow line, which goes in the middle. The yellow line goes to the can of refrigerant. Find the schraeder valve for each side (low side tap, high side tap) and connect the appropriate color hose. Verify that the pressure is zero. (read the instructions for your gauges as to how to use them. For example, some have valves, some do not.)
O.K., we now have an empty system. Let's get on to the mechanics.
Remove the serpentine belt.
Unplug the electical wire going to the clutch.
Jack the car up; this work is best done from below.
Remove the hoses. They should be at the back of the compressor, secured by a plate with one bolt each. Remove the old seals and plug the end of each hose to prevent bugs from trying to make their home in your system.
Unbolt and remove the rear compressor mount.
Remove the compressor-to-front-bracket bolts and nuts and lower the compressor from the engine compartment, being careful to not lose any fluid from the openings at the back where the hoses were connected.
08-26-2007, 06:19 PM
#13
Now you are ready to install the new compressor.
First, pour the oil from the old compressor into one of your measuring containers. Pour the exact same amount of the new oil into the new compressor. Some compressors come with the oil already installed, be certain and read the instructions. Also, I am assuming that the new compressor already has a clutch installed.
This is the simple part. Reassemble in the reverse of the disassembly. Just take your time, do it right the first time. When you are done, take a break. Have a soda, water, or your beverage of choice. Mine is Sprite Zero, but that's just me.
Note, if your system was open prior to starting all this, you now need to replace the dryer. Again, leave the system open for as short a time as possible.
At this point, the correct thing to do is to take it to the pro, have a vacuum drawn on it for a period of time, then refill.
The incorrect thing to do is to go ahead and refill it yourself. Your call.
The following describes how to refill a system with refrigerant:
http://members.tripod.com/~jbabs714/autoac.htm
Start down near the bottom, where it says "WARNING: Your vehicles a/c system will not need every bit of 3 cans..." This shows the refill process. You MUST use gauges. Do not use the "feel for condensation" method.
If you followed this to the end, you should now have cold air blowing through your system.
As with any instructions, be sure and read from start to finish, making sure that you understand what to do, prior to starting this work.
Best of luck, hope this helps.
First, pour the oil from the old compressor into one of your measuring containers. Pour the exact same amount of the new oil into the new compressor. Some compressors come with the oil already installed, be certain and read the instructions. Also, I am assuming that the new compressor already has a clutch installed.
This is the simple part. Reassemble in the reverse of the disassembly. Just take your time, do it right the first time. When you are done, take a break. Have a soda, water, or your beverage of choice. Mine is Sprite Zero, but that's just me.
Note, if your system was open prior to starting all this, you now need to replace the dryer. Again, leave the system open for as short a time as possible.
At this point, the correct thing to do is to take it to the pro, have a vacuum drawn on it for a period of time, then refill.
The incorrect thing to do is to go ahead and refill it yourself. Your call.
The following describes how to refill a system with refrigerant:
http://members.tripod.com/~jbabs714/autoac.htm
Start down near the bottom, where it says "WARNING: Your vehicles a/c system will not need every bit of 3 cans..." This shows the refill process. You MUST use gauges. Do not use the "feel for condensation" method.
If you followed this to the end, you should now have cold air blowing through your system.
As with any instructions, be sure and read from start to finish, making sure that you understand what to do, prior to starting this work.
Best of luck, hope this helps.
08-26-2007, 06:26 PM
#14
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Originally Posted by koolaid_kid
AFA prices, I have no idea what these parts cost for your car. Perhaps Sara Lou can help you on that issue, IDK.
This info is great Kid, I feel I can accomplish this task, I just needed to know if it was do-able with limited equipment. Your help is outstanding and easy to follow.
Thanks
Sara Lou
08-26-2007, 08:06 PM
#16
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well by almost gone this is what i mean...when I had it working last summer it ran ok as long as you werent in traffic...i have had a tune(lower fan turn on) since then with a 160 thermo and some water wetter...well i had to take the motor out an do a complete rebuild in january...hence the system got opened up for several months during the rebuild..I then attempted to refill the system a few weeks ago, before I knew i would need to get the system vaccuumed..I bought the refrigerant and hooked it up but the compressor wouldnt turn on to take the r134...I attempted to jump the compressor to get it to turn on, which I now know would have been a fruitless effort if i had been able to get it to operate, seeing as it has to be vaccuumed first...but the compressor would not operate and thats where i stand..
now what exactly do i need to do at this point...have the system evacuated and then the compressor will work?? I hope the compressor is still fine but i dont know what effects having the system open for several months will do to the compressor...Should the compressor work fine if it was vaccuumed and refilled or is the compressor gone since it has been open
now what exactly do i need to do at this point...have the system evacuated and then the compressor will work?? I hope the compressor is still fine but i dont know what effects having the system open for several months will do to the compressor...Should the compressor work fine if it was vaccuumed and refilled or is the compressor gone since it has been open
08-26-2007, 08:15 PM
#18
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When I bought the car it had the 'noisey compressor', so I never used it and after a couple of weeks it stopped working anyway.
Last week I decided to 'play around' with the a/c to find out what the problem was. As stated, the compressor had stopped working, but after a couple of tries with the 134a it kicked in and took a charge. The air was cold and working good, but the compressor was still noisey.
So based on that, I would try vacuuming the system and try refilling, you may get lucky. There's a place up the road here that advertises vacuum and refill for $89.95.
Sara Lou
Last week I decided to 'play around' with the a/c to find out what the problem was. As stated, the compressor had stopped working, but after a couple of tries with the 134a it kicked in and took a charge. The air was cold and working good, but the compressor was still noisey.
So based on that, I would try vacuuming the system and try refilling, you may get lucky. There's a place up the road here that advertises vacuum and refill for $89.95.
Sara Lou
08-26-2007, 08:25 PM
#19
Well, if the system was open for any length of time, you absolutely must replace the dryer. The dessicant is full of moisture, and probably is the source of your blockage. There is a pressure switch located on the low side somewhere (my meager book does not show where it is located) and if it does not see sufficient pressure, it refuses to allow the clutch to lock. I would replace the dryer, take it and have the vacuum applied to it (in the old days, they said 24 hours, but no one wants to tie their equipment up that long) and give it a try.
Just having it open should not affect the compressor, unless you dunked it under water.
Most likely, however, you had also a low refrigerant condition, which is why it would get warm in traffic. A separate issue, unfortunately.
Just having it open should not affect the compressor, unless you dunked it under water.
Most likely, however, you had also a low refrigerant condition, which is why it would get warm in traffic. A separate issue, unfortunately.
08-26-2007, 08:31 PM
#20
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yeah it was low i know which is why it got warm..it needed to be re charged last year i just didnt do it...the compressor stayed completely dry and there was no change from the time it was working until we took it out and put it back in..it just sat in a garage for a couple of months..the low pressure thing is prob why it would not engage..i was thinking that was prob a built in feature to protect the compressor..where can i get the dryer at and how hard is it to replace..any info on where its located(diagram)..i am not familiar with ac systems at all unfortunately..
and thanks in advance for the detailed answers
and thanks in advance for the detailed answers