Nitto's dry vs. waterbox?
09-08-2007, 06:11 AM
#1
Nitto's dry vs. waterbox? Got brand new Nitto's and I suspect water is getting between the tread and a 7-8 second burnout looks like somebody smokin' a cigarette ... should be putting on a smoke show, but, it just ain't happening. Would I be better off avoiding the waterbox altogether? I've been going around it and backing just to the edge of it, then, doing the burnout through 1st and 2nd really hard. Would I be better off just doing a dry burnout? 
I'm obviously new and trying to learn to do a burnout. Though I've tried twice to stall it to 1600 rpm 9A4 w'Yank SS360 T/C) and launch easy, it just sits there and spins ... frustrating.
I'm obviously new and trying to learn to do a burnout. Though I've tried twice to stall it to 1600 rpm 9A4 w'Yank SS360 T/C) and launch easy, it just sits there and spins ... frustrating. 
09-08-2007, 01:04 PM
#4
Rich ... Hey! What's up ... how's the wife and kid?
red1999z28 > ... tires are 275/40/17's and I've been dropping the tire pressure down to 17-18 psi (hot) ... 15-16 psi cold. being drag radials, the cold pressure is not going to be that much different like street tires are between hot and cold.
red1999z28 > ... tires are 275/40/17's and I've been dropping the tire pressure down to 17-18 psi (hot) ... 15-16 psi cold. being drag radials, the cold pressure is not going to be that much different like street tires are between hot and cold.
09-08-2007, 01:43 PM
#6
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Sounds like you may actually be doing your burnout in the water box itself. Try this. Back in, give em just a quick and real easy spin in the edge of the water, then pull out acouple feet and do your burnout. All a dry burnout is going to do is tear on your car, esspecially if your track preps back to the burnout box. Nittos should smoke like a bastard in 2nd. 
BTW: If your running skinnies (even ones with street tread), just drive right on through the box. I've never seen them pick up enough water to make a differance.
BTW: If your running skinnies (even ones with street tread), just drive right on through the box. I've never seen them pick up enough water to make a differance.
09-08-2007, 04:32 PM
#7
Thanks brother. 
I only backed up to the edge of the waterbox, like you're saying. There's several problems with our local track. I made my runs on Wednesday night when a lot of import FWD cars race. And, of course, they drive right through the box and create damp conditions at the tree. 
The track only treats with VP and not VHT unless there is a major event coming up, i.e., points races, Florida Nationals, etc. Still, on an easy launch, I should be able to at least cut 1.8's
I think my only hope on Wednesday or Friday nights is to just not stall it at all, then, ease into the gas while I feather the accelerator until I can get into 2nd gear (A4). Once I get into 2nd, it pulls really hard ... just gotta' get my 60' time down.
And, I may have been running a little TOO low on the tire pressure. I'm gonna' start next time at about 20 psi and work my way down. If all else fails, I'm buying 15's and some 315/50/15's. Any pointers are always welcome.
I only backed up to the edge of the waterbox, like you're saying. There's several problems with our local track. I made my runs on Wednesday night when a lot of import FWD cars race. And, of course, they drive right through the box and create damp conditions at the tree. The track only treats with VP and not VHT unless there is a major event coming up, i.e., points races, Florida Nationals, etc. Still, on an easy launch, I should be able to at least cut 1.8's
I think my only hope on Wednesday or Friday nights is to just not stall it at all, then, ease into the gas while I feather the accelerator until I can get into 2nd gear (A4). Once I get into 2nd, it pulls really hard ... just gotta' get my 60' time down.
And, I may have been running a little TOO low on the tire pressure. I'm gonna' start next time at about 20 psi and work my way down. If all else fails, I'm buying 15's and some 315/50/15's. Any pointers are always welcome.
Last edited by JEB99TA; 09-08-2007 at 04:37 PM.
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09-08-2007, 06:30 PM
#8
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Lots of good advice here but here are some snippets you may not know.
Drive around the waterbox. Don;t drag the front tires into the water only to launch in it at the starting line.
Drive around the water box then back into the box pull forward about 10 ft then do you burnout.
When doing your burnout Get the tires spinning starting in 2nd gear then give it a shift to third as it gets ready to touch the limiter.
You should get a nice large poof of smoke but your not in this for a smoke show. Nitto's get greasy with to big of a burnout. A nice haze comming off the tire is about all you need.
Now that you have gotten the tires hot leave it floored let loose on the line lock roll forward and relsea the throttle. Then obviously get on the brakes.
" If you keep doing 2nd gear burnout your going to kill the transmission "
You may need to adjust the procedure a bit but getting a non contact thermometer would be good and start measuring tire temp. See what works. bring a buddy with you. Remeber a tire will gain 2-3 psi with a burnout.
Drive around the waterbox. Don;t drag the front tires into the water only to launch in it at the starting line.
Drive around the water box then back into the box pull forward about 10 ft then do you burnout.
When doing your burnout Get the tires spinning starting in 2nd gear then give it a shift to third as it gets ready to touch the limiter.
You should get a nice large poof of smoke but your not in this for a smoke show. Nitto's get greasy with to big of a burnout. A nice haze comming off the tire is about all you need.
Now that you have gotten the tires hot leave it floored let loose on the line lock roll forward and relsea the throttle. Then obviously get on the brakes.
" If you keep doing 2nd gear burnout your going to kill the transmission "
You may need to adjust the procedure a bit but getting a non contact thermometer would be good and start measuring tire temp. See what works. bring a buddy with you. Remeber a tire will gain 2-3 psi with a burnout.
Originally Posted by JEB99TA
Thanks brother. I only backed up to the edge of the waterbox, like you're saying. There's several problems with our local track. I made my runs on Wednesday night when a lot of import FWD cars race. And, of course, they drive right through the box and create damp conditions at the tree.
The track only treats with VP and not VHT unless there is a major event coming up, i.e., points races, Florida Nationals, etc. Still, on an easy launch, I should be able to at least cut 1.8's
I think my only hope on Wednesday or Friday nights is to just not stall it at all, then, ease into the gas while I feather the accelerator until I can get into 2nd gear (A4). Once I get into 2nd, it pulls really hard ... just gotta' get my 60' time down.
And, I may have been running a little TOO low on the tire pressure. I'm gonna' start next time at about 20 psi and work my way down. If all else fails, I'm buying 15's and some 315/50/15's. Any pointers are always welcome.
I only backed up to the edge of the waterbox, like you're saying. There's several problems with our local track. I made my runs on Wednesday night when a lot of import FWD cars race. And, of course, they drive right through the box and create damp conditions at the tree. The track only treats with VP and not VHT unless there is a major event coming up, i.e., points races, Florida Nationals, etc. Still, on an easy launch, I should be able to at least cut 1.8's
I think my only hope on Wednesday or Friday nights is to just not stall it at all, then, ease into the gas while I feather the accelerator until I can get into 2nd gear (A4). Once I get into 2nd, it pulls really hard ... just gotta' get my 60' time down.
And, I may have been running a little TOO low on the tire pressure. I'm gonna' start next time at about 20 psi and work my way down. If all else fails, I'm buying 15's and some 315/50/15's. Any pointers are always welcome.
09-08-2007, 09:08 PM
#9
Does anyone here understand the point of the water box? I may be misreading some of these posts......
Back in the day, cars that were running real sticky tires had trouble heating them up. When they tried to do their burn, the car wouldn't sit still. So the water box was developed. Get the tires wet so they can get them spinning to heat them up. Any other tires, or cars, do not need the water box. If you can do a regular burnout on the street, then you don't need to use the water box. And if you have anything other than skinnies on the front of the car, PLEASE drive around the water box. Regular tires will drag water up to line and leave it there for you and the car behind you.
Thanks, drive thru.
Jeb, don't take this the wrong way, I had to learn too. I'm just irritated about all the b/s advise you're getting from people who shouldn't be giving it. You have car putting 400+ hp to the ground through an auto. You don't need water to get 275 Nittos warm. The motor will do fine by itself. Hope this helped.
Back in the day, cars that were running real sticky tires had trouble heating them up. When they tried to do their burn, the car wouldn't sit still. So the water box was developed. Get the tires wet so they can get them spinning to heat them up. Any other tires, or cars, do not need the water box. If you can do a regular burnout on the street, then you don't need to use the water box. And if you have anything other than skinnies on the front of the car, PLEASE drive around the water box. Regular tires will drag water up to line and leave it there for you and the car behind you.
Thanks, drive thru.
Jeb, don't take this the wrong way, I had to learn too. I'm just irritated about all the b/s advise you're getting from people who shouldn't be giving it. You have car putting 400+ hp to the ground through an auto. You don't need water to get 275 Nittos warm. The motor will do fine by itself. Hope this helped.
09-08-2007, 09:40 PM
#10
I've made the same mistake of getting too much water on the tires. In my experience, the most of the advice given above is pretty sound. If I try a dry burnout, I get bad wheelhop. So I go around the waterbox, back in, pull forward ten feet or so, use first to get 'em going, then go to second. I've also tried putting it in drive as some have suggested.
The local guy in the burnout box is really good at guiding me back just enough and waving me forward - that helps a lot.
The local guy in the burnout box is really good at guiding me back just enough and waving me forward - that helps a lot.
09-09-2007, 06:47 AM
#11
Before, when I was going around the waterbox and backing into the edge of it, I was only pulling forward about 2-3 feet away when starting my burnout, so, I'll try the 10-feet-out thing before starting the burnout. I'll try it that way. Now that it was mentioned, it makes sense to do that.
I can pretty much melt the tires down with a dry burnout and spin 'em for days. Think I'll try it without the water next time. Got a good suspenion, so, wheel hop isn't an issue ... don't need water to avoid wheel hop.
I'll do it both ways and see what works for me the best.
As for 2nd gear burnouts killing the transmission, I have a 4L65E FLT Level 5 that folks are pushing 700-800 RWHP through and they don't seem to be having problems after literally hundreds of launches. I did read somewhere about how in 1st, 2nd, and 3rd ... something about some of the clutches or something-or-other doesn't engage, so, I don't think shifting to third would do much ... except it might start 'pulling down' the burnout as the tires heat up and are the stickiest ... probably would kill the burnout. It was said only starting out in 4th (OD) would save life on your tranny.
... appreciate all the advice ... keep it coming!!!!
I can pretty much melt the tires down with a dry burnout and spin 'em for days. Think I'll try it without the water next time. Got a good suspenion, so, wheel hop isn't an issue ... don't need water to avoid wheel hop.
I'll do it both ways and see what works for me the best.
As for 2nd gear burnouts killing the transmission, I have a 4L65E FLT Level 5 that folks are pushing 700-800 RWHP through and they don't seem to be having problems after literally hundreds of launches. I did read somewhere about how in 1st, 2nd, and 3rd ... something about some of the clutches or something-or-other doesn't engage, so, I don't think shifting to third would do much ... except it might start 'pulling down' the burnout as the tires heat up and are the stickiest ... probably would kill the burnout. It was said only starting out in 4th (OD) would save life on your tranny.
... appreciate all the advice ... keep it coming!!!!
09-09-2007, 09:26 AM
#12
the 2nd gear and 4th gear are on the same band I think is what ls1 curious is saying. I have seen freinds tear up good tranny's from 2nd gear burnouts.
I back in to the waters edge and pull forward with my door open to make sure I am out of the water before I even turn my tires over as to not throw it up on my inner fenders to drip back down on my tires.
I do a 2nd gear burnout but with a 6 spd and after some smoke comes up, I let off the line lock and let it spin forward while reducing power to make it bite while coming out of the burnout.
with your power , try half stepping it off the line to let the tires byte. then hitting it all the way. Once my Nittos are byting , THey dont break loose.
I know on the street , my car and freinds like mine with automatics can half step in a quick motion and hook very well with Nittos. They dont like to be shocked like the mt drag radial.
THat tire will hook much better at the track for you if you can get some. m/t 275x40x17 drag radials is what I mean.
I back in to the waters edge and pull forward with my door open to make sure I am out of the water before I even turn my tires over as to not throw it up on my inner fenders to drip back down on my tires.
I do a 2nd gear burnout but with a 6 spd and after some smoke comes up, I let off the line lock and let it spin forward while reducing power to make it bite while coming out of the burnout.
with your power , try half stepping it off the line to let the tires byte. then hitting it all the way. Once my Nittos are byting , THey dont break loose.
I know on the street , my car and freinds like mine with automatics can half step in a quick motion and hook very well with Nittos. They dont like to be shocked like the mt drag radial.
THat tire will hook much better at the track for you if you can get some. m/t 275x40x17 drag radials is what I mean.
09-09-2007, 11:58 PM
#13
Originally Posted by AINT SKEERED
with your power , try half stepping it off the line to let the tires byte. then hitting it all the way. Once my Nittos are byting , THey dont break loose.
I know on the street , my car and freinds like mine with automatics can half step in a quick motion and hook very well with Nittos. They dont like to be shocked like the mt drag radial.
THat tire will hook much better at the track for you if you can get some. m/t 275x40x17 drag radials is what I mean.
I know on the street , my car and freinds like mine with automatics can half step in a quick motion and hook very well with Nittos. They dont like to be shocked like the mt drag radial.
THat tire will hook much better at the track for you if you can get some. m/t 275x40x17 drag radials is what I mean.
09-10-2007, 12:37 AM
#14
typically on d/r i go around the box and burnout dry! get a good 1-2 shift in my auto and i wait till the speedo gets to around 70...sit for abo8ut 2 seconds then let off the brake and gas quickly after...
if your trying to leave on the nitrous and the nittos prolly wont hook, get some real d/r
try burning out dry might help some...
also not stalling it up will make you leave harnder normally....
if your trying to leave on the nitrous and the nittos prolly wont hook, get some real d/r
try burning out dry might help some...
also not stalling it up will make you leave harnder normally....
09-10-2007, 08:31 AM
#15
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Back when I was cutting 1.6x 60' times on Nitto's I needed to get them *hot* (especially in cold weather) to get them to do anything resembling a hook.
I used the waterbox for my Nitto's and for my M/T DR's and it has always worked well for me. The waterbox IMO is what allowed my 10 bolt to last as long as it did, dry burnout starts at the track and my posi would have taken a **** when I still had it.
I used the waterbox for my Nitto's and for my M/T DR's and it has always worked well for me. The waterbox IMO is what allowed my 10 bolt to last as long as it did, dry burnout starts at the track and my posi would have taken a **** when I still had it.
