rcM3

Its time to get started on this project. There are lots of great build-up threads on this forum and the momentum of these engines being put into e36s is really starting to get rolling around different boards and by aftermarket companies such as Vorshlag (just released the kit for LS1 swaps into e36s).

Ideally I'd like to make this thread a starting point for info about this swap - including information on parts, successful DIYs, and basic outlines for getting the job done.

My own aspirations include having a LS1 in my 98 BMW M3 and running smoothly between now and Spring 2009. I'm giving myself a nice big timeframe because I want to do a lot of gathering and planning ahead of time and not doom the project by getting ahead of myself.

Ultimately I want to make it my daily-driver. I've got a second vehicle I can stand to commute with while my BMW is apart.

To begin I'll list known complications with this swap, members who have successfully completed this swap and threads written about this swap. Please post up what you can add to these lists and I'll edit this first post to include them. Also post up potential solutions to complications and hopefully we can knock things out one by one.

This isn't going to be a one-week thread. It'll take a while, but optimally I'd like to update it gradually so that it ultimately can be a resource for anyone else that attempts this swap.


Complications that need to be addressed:

-Exhaust manifolds need to be low profile. (Has anyone done anything besides have a new one fabricated? Has anyone found an existing manifold that fits?
-----EDIT: So I'm going to try the sanderson headers: (http://www.sandersonheaders.com/prod...roducts_id=173) first. If they don't work, the only option seems to be going custom!

-Motor mounts need to be fabricated.

-Transmission cross-brace needs to be adapted/fabricated.

-Oil-Pan needs to be sourced/modified. Which ones have worked for other e36ers?
-----EDIT: Thaniel's pan is modified so that where it drops down is farther back. A lot of people seem to use stock oil pans which make the motor have to be mounted farther back (good for weight, possibly bad for keeping the BMW brake-booster)

-Steering-shaft is potentially in the way.
-----EDIT: Thaniel manages to keep his intact, I'll try to do the same.

-Driveshaft needs to be fabricated.

-Clutch-bleeding valve needs to be relocated

-What sort of wiring/engine management options are out there? How do you adapt the original BMW harness to be compatible with the new motor?

-EDIT:The factory brake booster seems to be in the way for many swappers. Thaniel managed to keep his (I'd like to do the same). Many others choose to go with a hydroboost system.

-ABS needs to be relocated/re-routed.

-Piping for HVAC (heating/cooling) needs to be recreated.
-----EDIT: Thaniel relocated his heater valve to the passenger side. Note that the smaller line coming from the motor is the OUT line even though this is counter-intuitive (hot coolant takes up more space).
-----EDIT: Here is a great thread where rao describes how to make A/C work with the LS1 swap: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=723277

-Piping for power steering needs to be re-created.

-What is the best position for the motor in order to most simplify the the project?
-----EDIT: Thaniel manages to keep his center and (relatively) low, while still using the factory steering shaft and brake-booster. I'd like to replicate this if possible.

-EDIT: C5 LS1 Accessories list from JoeZ: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=682908

-What else?


Relevant LSX in e36 threads and links:

Thaniel: https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-swaps/733641-my-ls1-e36-bmw-357i.html#post7260555
jcarp: https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-swaps/474890-ls1-into-95-318ti.html
rao: https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-swaps/725021-10-lbs-ls2-5-lb-bmw-56k-forget.html
LS1 Swapper:
Domesticated Euro:
MattP:
nash8503: http://www.nash8503.com/index.html
Steve VanS (e30): http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=699289
V8 Supra Builder (e34): https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-swaps/768900-invading-germany-lsx-into-bmw-e34-525-535-a.html
JoeZ: http://www.hasanmotorsports.com/
M3 Muscle: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=884820

Whodonit: https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-swaps/625183-ls-motor-bmw-e36-who-has-done.html

Vorshlag Beta build: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=675305
Vorshlag Kit info thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...2#post10689142
Vorshlag Stage 0 kit: http://www.vorshlag.com/product_info...roducts_id=141
New Age Hotrods kit: http://www.nahrods.com/products/index.php

hockos

you should see a guys BMW in Canada done the ls1 motor and put one of my manifolds from supercar manifolds .com on looks great, i can send you his profile if you like

rcM3

Great looking products on that site. Neat stuff, but not integral to a swap. Who's the user in canada though?

'JustDreamin'

I think you've got a great idea....

The mechanical side of the swap is fairly obvious (mounts / exhaust / etc) as to what's required. Vorshlag looks like they've got some of the bits and pieces available now. Granted, I don't like their prices (I think ALL of the BMW swap kits are ridiculously priced, but that's just me) but they do have the parts available.

I'd love to have somebody come up with an exhaust solution that doesn't involve custom headers, since they make the swap a bunch more expensive. Would also open up this swap to folks in Califorinia since they've got Smog ****'s to deal with.


I think the biggest question is integrating the electronics. The LSx motor is going to need its PCM (obviously). The older BMW's e36's ('95 and earlier) have less integrated controls (at least according to Vorshlag). Not sure what's required to make a later model run right. This is kind of the sticky wicket for the later models. I'd love to be able to do an E46, but the electronics (and a few other things like my garage is under construction and lack of a BMW e46 to do it to) is keeping me from diving in.

'JustDreamin'

Steve VanS

iTrader: (1)

See our E30-LS1 swap at:

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=699289

We have addressed a lot of the questions in post #1 above (headers, engine mounts, driveshaft, etc) The E36 is a similar but easier swap; its engine bay is a little bigger, and the Fbody oil pan fits (we had to modify a GTO pan)

rcM3

1st post edited to include a couple non-e36 LS1 swaps.

I'll try to spend some time going through each thread picking out details that are important.

NewAge

Are site my help with some of your questions

rcM3

I added it to the original post.

rao

iTrader: (18)

If you have questions I would be happy to help.

rcM3

I'm reading through threads and getting questions.

The first one I want to clear up is about the exhaust manifolds. Steve VanS used 'blockhuggers' from Sanderson on their e30 and raved about them.

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...9#post10386429

I would imagine there is at least a little more room in an e36 than an e30. Would these fit?

http://www.sandersonheaders.com/prod...roducts_id=173

Has anyone used a exhaust manifold on an LSx e36 that they didn't have custom made?

EDIT: I just read on JoeZ's site a reference to the Nash headers being designed for e36s specifically so the factory steering shaft can be retained. Can anyone verify this? rao?

Also, does using the Nash headers require the use of hydroboost? Thaniel makes do with the factory BMW booster, but uses JCarp's exhaust manifold.

rcM3

Where might one find one of the foam mock-ups of the LS1 people are using to test fitment?

As shown in the Steve VanS e30 thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=699289

I don't suppose getting one second-hand for a substantial discount would be possible?

EDIT: Found on Summit's site: http://store.summitracing.com/egnsea...p?N=115+400594

Steve VanS

iTrader: (1)

We used Sanderson CC1LS1 header on the LH side and LS150 on the RH side with their angled reducers. These are both block-hugger style for the LS series engines. Nice quality, great price!! They fit nicely into our E30 swap. Piece of cake for an E36, which is about 2" or more wider across the engine bay (E30 is 27.06" in-between frame rails). We could have even used the factory steering intermediate shaft with its rag joints...we have some nice pics in our thread

rcM3

Here's a direct link to the pictures ^ referenced:

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...&postcount=134

Why did you end up fabbing your own steering shaft?

I'm trying to figure out if its possible to leave the factory steering shaft in place (as rao did I think (looking for verification on this) and leave the factory brake booster in place (as Thaniel did). And if it is possible which exhaust manifold will I need to do it? Would a Sanderson setup work to leave both in place? (or just the steering linkage as you stated?)

Steve VanS

iTrader: (1)

Just use the Sanderson headers. See our pics in our buildup thread on Bimmerforums. Look at page 4; there's nice views from both sides, above & below of how the headers fit. You can probably use the stock E36 steering shaft. But be aware that you need to provide heat shielding / reflective blanket on items close to headers & exhaust -- we used the CC1LS1 header on the LH (driver side) and LS-150 on the RH side.

The factory booster may fit, or look into using a 6" dia double-diaphram vacuum unit (available for about $90.00 - look in StreetRodder magazine). It depends on how far back you set the engine.

rao

iTrader: (18)

I don't believe that those Sanderson headers would fit in an e36 until I see someone do it in an e36

It would be great if any off the shelf headers would fit - it is the most annoying part of the swap.

The Nash headers do require the use of the Hydroboost system and they allow the stock steering shaft to be retained.

rcM3

Thaniel just verified in his thread that he managed to use the factory brake-booster and factory steering shaft in his build. The valve-cover just barely clears the booster on the driver's side. He managed to keep ABS by moving the actuator. Additionally his motor is mounted center and level.

Its going to be my goal to do the same. I'll probably first give the sanderson headers a hopeful/pessimestic try first and if they don't work, move on to some custom manifolds.

rcM3

Just for reference: I confirmed that the factory brake booster in my M3 is the same as came in any other e36 (318, 325). So if it can be done in one, it should be able to be done any any other.

Thaniel

iTrader: (2)

Here are some pics showing engine location in my swap. I don't think I posted them anywhere because they didn't turn out well. The headers I used are V3automotive knock offs if I understand correctly (made by one of the V3 partners).

The headers, brake booster and engine mounts are all interrelated. Best I can tell if you go with one makers headers it pretty much sets what you do for the other two. It would be nice to have a cheaper header solution but custom Long tube headers are nice

rcM3

Long tube headers are nice, but they are $$$!

I am going to try the Sanderson blockhuggers first per the strong recommendations of Steve VanS. If they don't want to send me parts to mix and match like they did for Steve VanS's e30, I'll just go with the recommended CC1LS1 part on the driver's side and the LS150 on the passenger side. (BTW... the LS150 doesn't seem to be on Sanderson's site.)

If those don't fit my next option will be to try mounting the exhaust manifolds upside-down and backwards like people do on turbo setups.

We shall see!
--------------------

The next thing I want to straighten out is regarding which oil pan(s) I can use. This is a great thread by Philntx detailing lots of oil pans available for LSx motors:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-swaps/817787-lsx-oil-pans.html

Where (or from what cars) are people getting oil pans for e36-LSx cars and what modifications (if any) are necessary?

Steve VanS

iTrader: (1)

We used the LS150 header on the RH side for more clearance to the starter motor, and to make the RH exhaust pipe simpler than the LH. You can use CC1LS1 on both sides if you want "symmetrical" headers -- we figured different LH/RH is ok since the Fbody OEM headers are different.

We also used the 1.5" header tube size for easier fitting. The LS150 is buried somewhere on Sanderson's website, but is hard to find. In our header pic on page 4 of our thread on Bimmerforums, we show the 2 different header types we used. Talk to Jeremy at Sanderson.