Northwest Members - Head removal. One bolt away...I think

How do you remove this bolt? It is the bolt holding the power steering bracket on the driver side head. Do I need to take off the pulley too? There are two other bracket bolts I have already removed. Someone please tell me I am making this way more difficult than it is.

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4312.jpg

The damage is under this cylinder head. I already have the passenger side head off.

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4314.jpg

Should be a 15 mm open end wrench. If it is the same as an F-Body. you should not have to take the pulley off.

Well, I feel stupid. You are right, it is an open end 15mm wrench. Took me about 3 minutes to get it off. I was using a fatter wrench earlier that would not fit. Thanks!

No problem. Let us know how bad the Carnage is.

drum roll please

Does it look like one of my valves was playing tap dance on the top of the piston?

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4319.jpg

Here are a few pictures of the valves
http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4337.jpg

You can see where it was hitting the valve
http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4342.jpg

So, did this cause the rod failure or is it just coincidence?

IT's more likely that the extra rod clearance allowed the piston to stay at TDC longer and let the intake come down and hit it. How loose was that rod? Could the piston really turn that much?

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=130799&stc=1&d=1210133942

The valve would have to move a ton for the kiss to look like that. I think that is probably from detonation and not the valve kissing. If the valve kissed you'd have a big eyebrow across the piston in the same spot and not just a hash mark all over the place. If the valve was bent to shit and not even seated in the valve seat then yes I would believe that.

Marty

Ah, that makes sense. I may have to wait till the shortblock comes out before I can find out what happened.



How much more work is it to pull the shortblock from where it sits right now?

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4319.jpg

Is it me or does that piston look rotated clockwise about 15 degrees? Is that piston even connected to the crank?

Ryan

Do me a favor, put a wrench on the crank and spin the motor. See if that piston moves up and down right...

Ryan

I believe the verdict is a broken rod. I can easily push the piston into the cylinder.

Here is a picture of the hole on the driver side of the block.
http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4310.jpg

Looks like you have bigger problems. How come you are taking the heads off..?

The head gasket looks fine so there goes Bryans theory of a blown headgasket causing the cylinder to be water logged and causing a hydraulic failure. Its hard to say what happened especially that it happened during a normal starting crank up.

Is it me or does that piston look rotated clockwise about 15 degrees? Is that piston even connected to the crank?

Ryan

Why does the #3 hole (piston) look like the wash is all out of whack?

I got one here looks just like it. An Experianced eye could easily tell you that was not detonation ;) It is the valve kissing it as the rod keep trying to push it up the cylinder before exiting the side of the block. I do not see any water damage at all so that is definately out.

Rod failure again. Man that sucks.

My engine bent a rod on startup also. I didn't have any evidence of anything happening. The only thing I can figure is an injector stuck open. No contact occurred in mine that could be seen. There does seem to be evidence of contact on this one but that could of happened after the hydro event and the piston was able to rotate or be pushed higher in the bore. I've heard of a few Ls motors that bent rods on startup lately. I wonder if it is an injector issue or if the rods stretch to a point where they bend or break.

I got one here looks just like it. An Experianced eye could easily tell you that was not detonation ;) It is the valve kissing it as the rod keep trying to push it up the cylinder before exiting the side of the block. I do not see any water damage at all so that is definately out.

Rod failure again. Man that sucks.

How can the rod keep "pushing it up" if it is not even connected to the piston? Honestly that is not a remotely correct assessment of what happened.

Marty

How can the rod keep "pushing it up" if it is not even connected to the piston? Honestly that is not a remotely correct assessment of what happened.

Marty


Well, Just because its not connected to the crank, doesn't mean that its not pushing it up. That rod probly got wacked a couple hundred times as the engine was screaching to a hault. I'll guess that more than a few hits pushed it toward the top of the cylinder. Your first post didn't even note that the piston had rotated in the cylinder. You assumed that we were saying the valve had moved around?

So really you can keep your remotely correct assesment to yourself.


In my opinion, this is a classic example of rod failure due to rod failure.

Ryan K.

Time for one of my killer 408's :devil:

Well, Just because its not connected to the crank, doesn't mean that its not pushing it up. That rod probly got wacked a couple hundred times as the engine was screaching to a hault. I'll guess that more than a few hits pushed it toward the top of the cylinder. Your first post didn't even note that the piston had rotated in the cylinder. You assumed that we were saying the valve had moved around?

So really you can keep your remotely correct assesment to yourself.


In my opinion, this is a classic example of rod failure due to rod failure.

Ryan K.

Thanks buddy:thumb: Good luck with your racecar this year

Well, Just because its not connected to the crank, doesn't mean that its not pushing it up. That rod probly got wacked a couple hundred times as the engine was screaching to a hault. I'll guess that more than a few hits pushed it toward the top of the cylinder. Your first post didn't even note that the piston had rotated in the cylinder. You assumed that we were saying the valve had moved around?

So really you can keep your remotely correct assesment to yourself.


In my opinion, this is a classic example of rod failure due to rod failure.

Ryan K.

Ryan Nailed it on the head ;)

The rod usually breaks right under the piston at the pin. In the first rotionation it is not short enough to exit the cylinder. I have seen sone that never did exit the cylinder.

SO at this point it is still going up and down IN The cylinder and it is pushing on the skirt of the piston. This is when the marks are made you see here. The rod pushes the piston up and the the valve pushes it down. What happens next is the rod starts to bend from bottoming the piston out on the head or fatigue from the initail break and finally exits the bore swinging around and breaking the block ,other rod and piston, Oil pan and in many cases the cam shaft also.

Rod failure and complete devistaion. Always sad to see no mater who's engine it is. When Powder rods fail they fail spectacularly!

I was out of town for the last couple days but got back tonight and pulled the piston.

The metal shavings are from me drilling the piston to pull it out. The rod punched a hole in both sides of my block.
http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4347.jpg


http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4352.jpg


http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4353.jpg


http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s131/potacamos/IMG_4354.jpg