General Maintenance & Repairs - Weird Panhard Bar Noise..

Alright, so the sound in the rear of my car i have kind of finally figured out, but can't figure out why it does it.
Awhile back, with my stock panhard bar, i noticed kind of a tapping noise from the rear while going over any sort of bump that would get the ass end of the car going up and down. Well i thought it was the panhard bar hitting the brace above it, so i bought a new ADJ Umi one and the sound (i thought) went away. All of a sudden, that same damn sound is back. It's like a tapping clunk clunk sound. really hard to explain.
So i get under the car, and just messing around trying to locate the sound, i have one of my buddies apply pressure on the bar towards the front of the car. Sound stops, while pulling the car side to side by the spoiler. Then i have him apply the pressure towards the rear of the car, the sound i'm hearing gets 3x as bad while swaying the car back and forth than with any pressure at all. This is the weirdest stuff ever..anyone have a clue?

Are the parking brake cables held by metal loops to the rear? Some cars didn't get them, and the cables bang on the panhard bar.

It's not that. It almost sounds like something coming from the rear end/axle.

Are the parking brake cables held by metal loops to the rear? Some cars didn't get them, and the cables bang on the panhard bar.

Those metel loops can sometimes get bent or moved to a different position and end up hitting things when you go over speed bumps or anything which will cause the rear axle to travel. I had the same exact problem and it was driving me nuts, I had just changed my rear axle fluid and moved the loops around in the process and figured that to be the cause. One of the loops was lightly grazing one of the panhard "mounts" or whatever you call it everytime the rear suspension was compressed.

Those metel loops can sometimes get bent or moved to a different position and end up hitting things when you go over speed bumps or anything which will cause the rear axle to travel. I had the same exact problem and it was driving me nuts, I had just changed my rear axle fluid and moved the loops around in the process and figured that to be the cause. One of the loops was lightly grazing one of the panhard "mounts" or whatever you call it everytime the rear suspension was compressed.

How do metal loops cause the rear axle to travel? I looked under the car and i didn't see any metal loops or anything, you should find a pic for me.

it sounds like it's coming from somewhere by the spring on the right side, but if you touch the panhard bar you can feel the vibration every time it makes the sound. i took the whole bar out and put it back on tightened it as tight as i could possibly go and no sound change at ALL.

and i see the metal loops, they aren't touching anything

Mine kind of rattles when coasting around not so sharp left curve around 30mph.
I've thought about wheel bearings?, but it also sounds like a "gear" type sound. What about a bad shock?

Maybe this will narrow it down. I got under neath again and you can feel the vibration of the sound while shaking left and right on the car, especially when you touch the panhard bar, but as well as the brace above it. All of the bushings look good, i'm going to take that top bar out now and see if the sound is still there, and make sure i tighten it good. it seems like it makes the sound evenly across the width of the car, on both sides.

check out this video, mine sounds just like this when i shake the car back and forth like he is, only...not quite as loud..
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v210/WARPNOVA/?action=view&current=MVI_0002.flv

here is another thing i found, i got under the car again and now the worst sound is no doubt coming from the wheels on BOTH sides. i then put the car in neutral with the e-brake on, and i have to shake the car 3x as hard to get it to make the sound. i'm getting a little further here, anyone have a clue?

the worst of the sound NOW, is from the wheels, no question. there is still a little sound coming from the bar but the sound in the wheels souns like the video above. earlier, before i moved my car i didn't hear anything from the wheels.

well when i changed my rear swaybar bushings and got a umi dbl adj phb the clunking went away. but i still have some squeeking. shit'll drive ya crazy man. i think it might be my springs. ive been livin in a hotel since april, so i cant really work on my car. well let us know when you find out what it is. good luck bro

Do you have a aftermarket rear too? The video, (I know it is not your car) sounds like it might be loose backing plates or something is loose in that area??? WHat are your aftermarket parts?

You said it went away when you switched bars, maybe you should try adjusting you bar some more?

It went away when i took the bar completely out. I think there is 2 seperate sounds, one from the wheels and one from the bar itself. It's frustrating me, i'm kind of confused about the whole deal.

Keep us posted.

I had a similar problem. I believe that when you lower your car the panhard naturally loosens. Like the guy above me said, try extending your adjus. panhard to a longer setting.

how exactly do you do that? do you have to have someone push on the side of the car or something? cause theres only one setting it's going to be on to get the bolt to fit in the hole right now.

Well I wouldn't suggest anything that would bend brackets, its just that when I removed the hardware on my stock one, it just fell out. I then installed a Hotchkis adjustable extended about 1"-2" longer than stock and then noises went away. Im just saying that if you can get it tighter without braking anything then do it. Lifting the rear axle may give you more room to play with.

I had a similar problem. I believe that when you lower your car the panhard naturally loosens. Like the guy above me said, try extending your adjus. panhard to a longer setting.

This is not right. The panhard bar will naturally "push" the rear end to the right of the car, thats why you get an adjustable one to recenter it.

how exactly do you do that? do you have to have someone push on the side of the car or something? cause theres only one setting it's going to be on to get the bolt to fit in the hole right now.

While this shouldn't make a difference for the noise, you did recenter the rear end by adjusting the panhard bar correct? (and you want to do this at ride height so its centered while driving obviously)

Back to the noise, it doesn't sound bushing related to be, more like metal on metal or plastic.
Sounds almost like exhaust or something that is dangling down.
Brace things like the exhaust, LCA's, torque arm and swaybar while someone pushes the car back and forth to see if you can feel anything or quiet the noise. I would be tempted to take things off one by one too see if there is any difference.

how exactly do you do that? do you have to have someone push on the side of the car or something? cause theres only one setting it's going to be on to get the bolt to fit in the hole right now.

I JUST FOUND MY NOISES LAST WEEK AFTER installing new lca's and phb from bmr trying to decrease bumps and rattles they got worse. kept shaking everything and looking to no avail. last week we got it on a lift that kept the suspension loaded and started shaking suspension parts the crush sleeves for the bushings in the lca's and phb are allowing 1/16 to 1/8 inch movement. so i call bmr they say you need to torque it down to 100 ft lbs because they supply american sleeve sizes for metric bolts. don't know if this is your problem or not but I am puuting on my new sleeves and getting them torqued down tonight. I will keep yopu informed.

knappbunch, where did you get the new sleeves? I have some play in my BMR stuff too.

slikrider, do you have a "on-car" adjustable bar or do you have to remove it to adjust it?

I have to remove the bar to adjust it. I can feel the sound in the bar as i push the vehicle side to side, ( grabbing onto exhaust.) on both the upper panhard bar support and especially the bar itself. But there is also ALOT of sound coming from each of the wheels, but the sound there goes away (at least makes it MUCH harder to simulate the sound) when the e-brake is applied. So really i have 2 sounds, but can only hear one distinct one while in the car going over any sort of bumps. Sometimes it's worse than others, sometimes i can barely hear it sometimes it sounds the back end is going to fall off.

knappbunch, where did you get the new sleeves? I have some play in my BMR stuff too.

called bmr told them the situation and had them send me new ones got them and was going to put them in last night but there was still a little play standard sleeve metric bolt( he idiots if you sell a car specific part maybe you should research and get specific parts.) that was directed at bmr. so i am going to get the 7/16 bolts today and put them in tonight.:bang: :D

I have to remove the bar to adjust it. I can feel the sound in the bar as i push the vehicle side to side, ( grabbing onto exhaust.) on both the upper panhard bar support and especially the bar itself. But there is also ALOT of sound coming from each of the wheels, but the sound there goes away (at least makes it MUCH harder to simulate the sound) when the e-brake is applied. So really i have 2 sounds, but can only hear one distinct one while in the car going over any sort of bumps. Sometimes it's worse than others, sometimes i can barely hear it sometimes it sounds the back end is going to fall off.

grab the torque arm and put your a#* in it pull it and push it hard while the suspension is loaded you should feel it move a little. that is probably the noise you here comming from the wheels.

I JUST FOUND MY NOISES LAST WEEK AFTER installing new lca's and phb from bmr trying to decrease bumps and rattles they got worse.
Should have searched through the suspension section for this. LCA and a PHB wont do anything for noise, and if they are rod ended they will only increase noise. If you want to get rid of rattles and have a better ride you need better shocks.

do you have subframe connectors?????? the stock control arm holes are slightly smaller than the sleeves on UMI's control arms..... so in order to get a bolt through, it ends up being smaller than the sleeve. I have this same problem with my UMI suspension.. subframes, control arms, relocations brackets, and panhard
strano springs

looks to me like the sleeve size on all the bushings just doesnt match up with the bolt size. These suspension companies telling us the bolts need to be torqued more so they dont rattle as much........ well im sick of it.

my rear end rattles pretty good, with every bolt tightened and control arm bolts torqued to 130ft. lbs....... tightening more is just going to cause premature bushing wear...... they should send every customer sleeve inserts to keep the parts from sliding around or just start matching up the bolt size to the sleeve itself...........

i am going to try rubber inserts on sleeves too large for the bolts to see if it quiets down let you know how it goes...

do you have subframe connectors?????? the stock control arm holes are slightly smaller than the sleeves on UMI's control arms..... so in order to get a bolt through, it ends up being smaller than the sleeve. I have this same problem with my UMI suspension.. subframes, control arms, relocations brackets, and panhard
strano springs

looks to me like the sleeve size on all the bushings just doesnt match up with the bolt size. These suspension companies telling us the bolts need to be torqued more so they dont rattle as much........ well im sick of it.

my rear end rattles pretty good, with every bolt tightened and control arm bolts torqued to 130ft. lbs....... tightening more is just going to cause premature bushing wear...... they should send every customer sleeve inserts to keep the parts from sliding around or just start matching up the bolt size to the sleeve itself...........

i am going to try rubber inserts on sleeves too large for the bolts to see if it quiets down let you know how it goes...

just drill out the holes slightly and put in 7/16 bolts if you read my previous posts in this thread you will see what i am saying.

just drill out the holes slightly and put in 7/16 bolts if you read my previous posts in this thread you will see what i am saying.


first of all how do you get a drill in there to drill out by the subframe connectors???? Im hearing my noises come from there. Also, what happens if you want to put the stock control arms back in.... the sleeve wont match up with the hole anymore.... they will make more noise than the aftermarket control arms.

i am hearing clunking from the front of my torque arm as well, can you confirm that the sleeve/bolt sizing is not correct there as well?

first of all how do you get a drill in there to drill out by the subframe connectors???? Im hearing my noises come from there. Also, what happens if you want to put the stock control arms back in.... the sleeve wont match up with the hole anymore.... they will make more noise than the aftermarket control arms.

i am hearing clunking from the front of my torque arm as well, can you confirm that the sleeve/bolt sizing is not correct there as well?

the torque arm on my car slides into a bushing at the tranny so the bolts dont't have crush sleeves since they are factory tranny bolts but I don't plan on puuting my stock arms back and if i did i would just have to rectify the crush sleve issue on the stock arms as to make the bigger sleveves fit in them.

This is a great thread keep it going guys. Great brainstorming here.

VERY PISSED put in new crush sleeves and bolts noise still there. will try again:bang::bang::bang:

The whole point of the bar is to center the rearend under the car. the top bar ties the 2 rear frame rails together so under a big load all the force isnt going into one rail. the reason the sound going away when you remove the PHB is because when you start pushing on the car side to side your letting the rearend sway under the car instead of moving whatever is making the noise.

my guess is worn c-clips (or the axles) letting your axles move (why it gets alot quieter with the e-brakes on)

i am thinking most of the clunking, rattling is coming from aftermarket control arms or control arm mounting

subframe connectors.... relocation brackets..... or a combination of both with aftermarket control arms

if you get a chance, check the adapter and bolt inside your relocation brackets to see if they match up......

i am thinking most of the clunking, rattling is coming from aftermarket control arms or control arm mounting

subframe connectors.... relocation brackets..... or a combination of both with aftermarket control arms

if you get a chance, check the adapter and bolt inside your relocation brackets to see if they match up......

I dont think it can be from aftermarket suspension. if suspension had problems there would have been recalls or product upgrades.

When backing up and turning at the same time you get a bunch of clunks. i had this exact same problem with a 2000 SS and it had stock suspension....rearend was the culprit.

If i were you. put your rearend up on jackstands and pull your rear cover off. then simulate whatever you have to do to make the car make its noises. that will give you a better idea if its something internal.

your reasoning seems to make since to me, i will get that cover off an snap a few pics. if the c-clips are bad can i just replace them or should i get a whole new rear end?

I actually just ended up taking the cover off, and i can simulate ALL the sounds i hear, the clicking sound when i shift between gears comes from where the drive shaft meets up to the rear end, and i just by moving the tires back and forth and in circles i can hear all of the other sounds coming from the inside of the rear itself. I wish i could snap some pics but i don't have camera, i really can't see anything but then again i know nothing about rear ends.

also, i did a search and 95% of the clunking people seem to get is while turning, i'm not getting any of that. It's just while going over bumps, especially at lower speeds.

I have the same noise you have...but I discovered it to be the exhaust was rubbing. I adjusted the muffler and it went away

u did grease the bushings right.

Read my post above, i found that the sound is coming from the rear end itself. no question.

Read my post above, i found that the sound is coming from the rear end itself. no question.

I've been watching this thread and running searches on related things.

I've had clunking for a long time now. Turns out that at least *some* of that was from a widened body-side LCA bracket from when I had the SFCs installed. I could not hammer the bracket ear back in, so I slipped a washer in there instead, and cranked it down nice and tight, and verified no gaps on either side (of both LCAs). That helped.

So the next day I re-checked the PHB (tight, no gaps, solid bushing sleeve contact), the axle side of the LCAs (ditto), and even cushioned the emergency brake cable from hitting the PHB.

I thought that would cure my ills, but it did not. I still have clunking/rattling coming from the back. I'm wondering if my stock 10 bolt might be the source as well.

Please keep us posted on what you do, and how you resolve this problem. I can't afford to replace the piece yet, but this noise is killing me. :(

(btw, 2002 with no engine mods or tweaks or tunes, and only 12,000 miles, most of which were "easy" miles, and no drag launches)

I took the cover off my rear end and the sound is definitely coming from the rear-end. There is an excess amount of play in the axle so something in there is definitely broke.

Am i going to have to get awhole new rear end? or could i just take it to a transmission shop or something and have them replace a few new parts?

find a person who can build good rearends and get new gears and an install kit have them set it up. my noise is finally gone after all the bolts in the phb and lca's are torqued and the right size.

find a person who can build good rearends and get new gears and an install kit have them set it up. my noise is finally gone after all the bolts in the phb and lca's are torqued and the right size.

I've shimmed the LCAs with washers (ensuring more contact between the LCA and body-side bracket, preventing it from moving around on the bolt), the PHB is a DA rod-ended piece from UMI, and everything is cranked down as tight as it's possible to make it, including an extra partial turn on the axle side of the LCA.

The emergency brake cable is zip-tied to the loop-hooks, and cushioned where it contacts the PHB.

The plastic flap that covers the fuel filler neck on the driver's side (which I just found yesterday), has had thin foam added to it's perimeter, and forced back in, so that no plastic contacts metal, instead, it's foam, if it moves at all, it does so silently now.

I STILL have rattles and clunks over rough roads. Namely things like rocky driveways (that use larger rocks), or manhole covers, that sort of thing.

I HAVE made improvements, but I still haven't found the source (or at least not every source) of what I'm looking for. :bang:

I don't even know where to look next at this point. :confused:

look at the bolts in reference to the crush sleeves even though you put washers in to get rid of side pla the standard sleeves will be bigger than the metric bolts on our cars and that little bit of movement makes a heck of a lot of noise. I hogged out my whole and put 1/2 grade 8 bolts in there and viola no noise.

had a noise coming from what seems to be the right rear of the car as well, going slow speeds over speed bumps as wel as going front drive (1st/2nd) into reverse and reverse back into gear... believe that it is the rear as well but will be sure to check everything else while I'm down there when ever I get a chace..

look at the bolts in reference to the crush sleeves even though you put washers in to get rid of side pla the standard sleeves will be bigger than the metric bolts on our cars and that little bit of movement makes a heck of a lot of noise. I hogged out my whole and put 1/2 grade 8 bolts in there and viola no noise.

I see what you are saying, but the thing is, most people who have such noises, either have Sub-Frame Connectors, or just bolts that are too loose (not torqued down enough). So they either go out and tighten them, or beat the bracket back in (in the case of SFCs), and then tighten them, and it goes away.

Which makes sense if you think about it, as I can't imagine that would have gotten out of testing and into production with a bolt too small if it was such a simple fix for so much noise.

Once you have proper clamp load, the LCA should not be able to move, and at that point it shouldn't matter if the bolt is 10 times too small, or just right.

Since I couldn't beat the bracket back in, I went with the shim method. And I know it did help some, it's just not the fix I'm looking for.

I tried drilling that hole out. I can't. How did you get a drill in there? I can't even get a ratchet, let alone a torque wrench, in there. A drill? Fuhgettaboutit. I tried a dremel in frustration, but that didn't work either.

drilled from the center of the car out using longer bit.

I found after switching to the UMI adjustable phr I developed a squeaky clunk after a few days. I could tighten the bolt on the chassis (passenger side) and it would go away for a day or two then return. Turns out the rod end had rotated slightly when the jam nut was tightened and it was binding on big suspension movements. That rod end must be straight vertical, any deviation will cause bind and work the chassis side bolt loose. Loosen jam nut, hold rod end in position with a big crescent wrench and tighten that jam nut good (maybe add a little loctite but I didn't need to). Make sure suspension is loaded when you do the work, I put the rear of the car on jackstands with the wheels off and it was easy to get to everything. This might be the problem you are having if you wiggle the car laterally and you can hear the squeak / clunk sound. I run the UMI control arms with bolt on relocation brackets so our setup is a little different but I hope this helps...

The sound IS NOT coming from the suspension,it's coming from the rear end. My question, is will i have to get a whole new rear end or could i get someone basically to fix the parts that suck? :)

look in your local phone book call some local shops and do some investigating you should be able to find someone in your area that rebuilds rearends and get the master install kit with some new gears and they should be able to put it back together for you. the noise is probably comming from the ring and pinion if you have been hard on it.

what you will pay for labor and parts, and to find a GOOD TRUSTWORTHY shop, its going to be quite a bit more than what i was asking for my factory rear.

read a few of the stories around the net of places that claim they can do it and peoples rears end up f'd up, it can happen...

I found a great guy loacally and he charged me 250.00 to put in my new art carr tranny and converter and install my 3.73 at the same time. some people are good and just like the work. hard to find but keep digging till you find one there is o ne in almost every town.

what you will pay for labor and parts, and to find a GOOD TRUSTWORTHY shop, its going to be quite a bit more than what i was asking for my factory rear.

read a few of the stories around the net of places that claim they can do it and peoples rears end up f'd up, it can happen...

problem is , i go get another used f-body rear and the probability of that one making noises/etc are high.

What were the findings of that guy in the video? Anybody know? I have that same sound when going into a steep driveway and a loud almost cracking noise from the rear passenger side when going over a pothole, manhole, road irregularity. I have a Vert with welded on BMR SFCs (they only run along each side) and Spohn front/rear sway bars. I have had this noise since before the Spohn front/rear sway bars though. Just took the differential cover off and looked around, as well as changed the fluid... everything seemed fine and it doesn't appear that the noise has anything to do with internal issues. Also getting a strange urrrr type noise from the rear area of the car when going between 1,000-1,500 rpm around 30-40mph.

bump. Anymore findings?

Just an update: I installed my stock panhard bar back on, the sound went COMPLETELY away. 1 month later, the sound is back in full force. WTF??

check the ftlbs of torque you have to tighten the crap out of them.