Finally some dyno numbers for my 416.
07-02-2008, 04:12 PM
#1
Finally some dyno numbers for my 416. First off I would like to thank Ron at Vengeance, Brian at SDPC, Tony Mamo, Pat G, and Jason and Ryan at RPM. All great guys to work with and very helpful. This thing would not have come together with out all of them.
So, I finally got the car on the dyno today and it put down 540/495rw SAE. The motor has 1,200 miles on it and still has the thick 20/50 break in oil. No dyno tricks and I ran it at 185* with the heavy Z06 motor sports wheels on it. I would say this dyno is conservative. I will get a graph up momentarily. I just took a friends car up there to tune on Friday in like weather conditions and on a 346 with milled AFR 205, every bolt on, EWP, Mamo 90/90, 228/232, full exhaust his car only put down 445/418rw.
The red is the 416 and the Blue is the 383.
The hp exceeded my expectations but the tq is lacking in my opinion. I tried a bunch of fuel and spark alterations but this was the best I could do. Here is the combo. This is my daily driver.
SDPC 416
12.01 SCR 8.72 DCR
TFS 235's 68cc
YT UL rr's
Vengeance ported 90/90
Vararam
XER 244/248 .612/.615 114+4 installed 109.5 icl
Comp 850-16's
ASP UD
Kooks 1 7/8" 3" X w/o catts
Borla stinger singles
Tex OZ700
39* injectors
SD tune by me with EFI live. I maxed out my MAF.
That is the major stuff. Future changes include a custom cam from Pat G, and Tex twin disk, EWP. I think I can get this thing to go 570/515rw when the new cam and clutch go in with more miles and some Royal Purple 10w30.
The real story is how much I picked up over the 383 with the same cam and different heads. I am looking to go 9.9@137 on motor. With the 383 I went 10.8's@130 with 478/435rw so I think it is doable in the right weather.
So, I finally got the car on the dyno today and it put down 540/495rw SAE. The motor has 1,200 miles on it and still has the thick 20/50 break in oil. No dyno tricks and I ran it at 185* with the heavy Z06 motor sports wheels on it. I would say this dyno is conservative. I will get a graph up momentarily. I just took a friends car up there to tune on Friday in like weather conditions and on a 346 with milled AFR 205, every bolt on, EWP, Mamo 90/90, 228/232, full exhaust his car only put down 445/418rw.
The red is the 416 and the Blue is the 383.
The hp exceeded my expectations but the tq is lacking in my opinion. I tried a bunch of fuel and spark alterations but this was the best I could do. Here is the combo. This is my daily driver.
SDPC 416
12.01 SCR 8.72 DCR
TFS 235's 68cc
YT UL rr's
Vengeance ported 90/90
Vararam
XER 244/248 .612/.615 114+4 installed 109.5 icl
Comp 850-16's
ASP UD
Kooks 1 7/8" 3" X w/o catts
Borla stinger singles
Tex OZ700
39* injectors
SD tune by me with EFI live. I maxed out my MAF.
That is the major stuff. Future changes include a custom cam from Pat G, and Tex twin disk, EWP. I think I can get this thing to go 570/515rw when the new cam and clutch go in with more miles and some Royal Purple 10w30.
The real story is how much I picked up over the 383 with the same cam and different heads. I am looking to go 9.9@137 on motor. With the 383 I went 10.8's@130 with 478/435rw so I think it is doable in the right weather.
Last edited by Pray; 07-02-2008 at 05:20 PM.
07-02-2008, 09:48 PM
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Keep that cam!! I went thru 3 diff cams (Diff sponsers) in my 414 with TFS 235 heads and that came had more under the curve 35+rwhp 35+rwtq and little more peak 15+rwhp 20+rwtq then the bigger cams. My car makes 554rwhp 515rwtq at 11.8 comp. My cam is the same but mine is on a 112+2 LSA
07-02-2008, 10:49 PM
#7
Thanks guys.
Jeremy. This cam on the 114 is lazy in my opinion. It seems that on a 112 it is much better. I have seen three cars with similar or better numbers with this cam on a 112. Your numbers were my final goal for this engine. It may possibly make it there on a better air day with some more miles and thinner synthetic oil. I think the IRS eats up a little power as well compared to the live axle. You are making sick numbers though. The cam Pat G specd for me is a Comp LSL 247/255 .624/.624 112+2. Were any of your sticks close to those specs?
Full Force. Ambitious, possibly, but if you run the numbers I think it is well with in reach. The day I went to the track and ran 10.8's@130 it was about +500-+1,000 DA. We get -1,500 DA days some times. I ran that with a full tank of gas the exact way I drove it to the track. Heavy street rims with a DR. I also only had a 1.65 60ft and actually let out a little. (I didn't trust the tires) I was not power shifting either. I am going to pull the front sway bar, run a CCW drag pack and actually prep the rest of the car for the track. i.e. brakes, alignment, 1/4 tank of gas for the money run in good weather. A 1.45 60ft would have put me in the 10.4 range the day I ran. I expect the car to run 10.50's@135 on a regular basis in street trim. RobZ just ran a 10.22@133.5 with around 490rw. So with the stars aligned I think I can do it.
JeremyZ. I did alot of research and made sure all my parts matched as best I could get them. I also went to the best in the industry for advice. They were all more than happy to talk with me.
Jeremy. This cam on the 114 is lazy in my opinion. It seems that on a 112 it is much better. I have seen three cars with similar or better numbers with this cam on a 112. Your numbers were my final goal for this engine. It may possibly make it there on a better air day with some more miles and thinner synthetic oil. I think the IRS eats up a little power as well compared to the live axle. You are making sick numbers though. The cam Pat G specd for me is a Comp LSL 247/255 .624/.624 112+2. Were any of your sticks close to those specs?
Full Force. Ambitious, possibly, but if you run the numbers I think it is well with in reach. The day I went to the track and ran 10.8's@130 it was about +500-+1,000 DA. We get -1,500 DA days some times. I ran that with a full tank of gas the exact way I drove it to the track. Heavy street rims with a DR. I also only had a 1.65 60ft and actually let out a little. (I didn't trust the tires) I was not power shifting either. I am going to pull the front sway bar, run a CCW drag pack and actually prep the rest of the car for the track. i.e. brakes, alignment, 1/4 tank of gas for the money run in good weather. A 1.45 60ft would have put me in the 10.4 range the day I ran. I expect the car to run 10.50's@135 on a regular basis in street trim. RobZ just ran a 10.22@133.5 with around 490rw. So with the stars aligned I think I can do it.
JeremyZ. I did alot of research and made sure all my parts matched as best I could get them. I also went to the best in the industry for advice. They were all more than happy to talk with me.
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07-03-2008, 12:03 AM
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Pray,
Nice numbers...Get to the track soon! I am still leaning towards the TFS225's over the 235's (on a 416) so the midrange is stronger. I am trying to avoid the "lazy" feeling that I had with my old setup and what is sounds like you are experiencing with your setup. I am waiting to see what Patrick G recommends for my setup. Right now I have a 236/236 113+2 selected.
Nice numbers...Get to the track soon! I am still leaning towards the TFS225's over the 235's (on a 416) so the midrange is stronger. I am trying to avoid the "lazy" feeling that I had with my old setup and what is sounds like you are experiencing with your setup. I am waiting to see what Patrick G recommends for my setup. Right now I have a 236/236 113+2 selected.
07-03-2008, 01:39 AM
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250 255 640 640 113 and she rocks her *** off. Love the sound at a red light. People go crazy with the cutout open, lol! I have alwasy wondered how much I would have made with a 6sp! This is with 12-bolt, nitrous conv and heavy wheels!
07-03-2008, 07:51 AM
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The TFS 225s would have probably given you just a tad more peak tq and a few ft lb under the curve. Nice gains for cubes and heads only. I don't think there is too much to be gained by swapping the cam. Tremendous area under the curve on that graph...WOW. Congrats on a very solid build.
Dougie
Dougie
07-03-2008, 12:00 PM
#16
Thanks alot guys. I think it is doing pretty good with some room to grow. I am just happy that I put this thing together in my garage with my own two hands, tuned it my self, and it did this well. I would honestly only shooting for 535/500rw on this first combo the first time to the dyno.
I mainly tune on the street in third gear and this motor is on average 8 tenths faster from 2,500-6,700rpm or 40-102mph than the 383. I also utterly slaughtered a cams, intake, upper/lower pulley, full exhaust, 03 Cobra the other day. I gave him three cars and the hit, I spun, let off twice to not rear end him, and put 5 cars on him after that from 45-130.
I think I would have had more under the curve tq wise if I would have kept the LG Pro's. But we will never know. I don't know if the 225's would have gained me much either. These 235's CC'd out to 233cc's so they are not that big. They also have sick low and mid lift flow numbers. They do stall at .600 though. I really think the tq is in the cam. Just look how it did in the 383 as well. Pretty sorry in my opinion. The cam that Pat G specd for me is a LSL 247/255 .624/.624 112+2. It is not that much bigger and will help when I add my 250 shot. It puts the overlap at TDC and the lobes are tightend up. I does however have the same ICL, I am not sure what that does or doesn't do when comparing cams? I would give up 10rw down low to gain 20rw up top. The car is light and I only race above 4,500 any way. But if the cam is a bust I will go back to the 244/248 but on a 112 this time. I just think the current cam is too small since it is peaking at 6,100. It did hold it's power pretty well to 6,800 though. In the 383 it peaked at 6,600 but fell off hard.
I mainly tune on the street in third gear and this motor is on average 8 tenths faster from 2,500-6,700rpm or 40-102mph than the 383. I also utterly slaughtered a cams, intake, upper/lower pulley, full exhaust, 03 Cobra the other day. I gave him three cars and the hit, I spun, let off twice to not rear end him, and put 5 cars on him after that from 45-130.
I think I would have had more under the curve tq wise if I would have kept the LG Pro's. But we will never know. I don't know if the 225's would have gained me much either. These 235's CC'd out to 233cc's so they are not that big. They also have sick low and mid lift flow numbers. They do stall at .600 though. I really think the tq is in the cam. Just look how it did in the 383 as well. Pretty sorry in my opinion. The cam that Pat G specd for me is a LSL 247/255 .624/.624 112+2. It is not that much bigger and will help when I add my 250 shot. It puts the overlap at TDC and the lobes are tightend up. I does however have the same ICL, I am not sure what that does or doesn't do when comparing cams? I would give up 10rw down low to gain 20rw up top. The car is light and I only race above 4,500 any way. But if the cam is a bust I will go back to the 244/248 but on a 112 this time. I just think the current cam is too small since it is peaking at 6,100. It did hold it's power pretty well to 6,800 though. In the 383 it peaked at 6,600 but fell off hard.
Last edited by Pray; 07-03-2008 at 12:11 PM.
07-03-2008, 12:15 PM
#17
You would def have some very sick numbers with a 6 spd and a 10 bolt. Greg and Erik are masters of their professions. I wish I could afford any thing by either of them. I had to go all off the shelf. But I am by no means dissapointed. I was looking at a comp solid roller that was almost those same specs. Maybe later.
