Street Racing & Kill Stories - Want to see how big a difference gears make?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpMEdn0mcg4

2001 Camaro SS vs 2000 Trans Am

Camaro - 345whp/360wtq - 4.10 gears, boltons, weak handheld tune

Trans Am- 395whp/???wtq - cam, boltons, custom tune

Can the trans am guy drive?
What are the specs on his cam?

Nice runs. :D

That T/A should be ashamed. Nice run for you tho!

The Trans Am guy can drive and all his shifts were dead on as were mine...

The only info I got from him on the cam is that it is a blower cam...Not sure of the specs beyond that...

50whp difference gets brought back to 1 CL due to 4.10 gears...

Wow that is close!

somethings wrong there cause gears dont make up for 50rwhp when i swapped to 3.73's i raced my buddy who id normally beat by 2 now i maybe added a car or so its a diffrence but not that much

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpMEdn0mcg4

2001 Camaro SS vs 2000 Trans Am

Camaro - 345whp/360wtq - 4.10 gears, boltons, weak handheld tune

Trans Am- 395whp/???wtq - cam, boltons, custom tune

nice rally really nice.:nod:

but i think i have gears but dont know how 2 tell.:bang:

nice rally really nice.:nod:

but i think i have gears but dont know how 2 tell.:bang:

Well first off are you auto or m6? Second what are your rpms at say 80mph? There's a way to tell, hopefully your speedos correct...

Nice runs, very close. I don't think gears can make up for a 50whp difference though, something seems off.

damn nice run man, what is your speedo at 70mph with the 410's? can you tell a difference in fuel economy with them?

somethings wrong there cause gears dont make up for 50rwhp when i swapped to 3.73's i raced my buddy who id normally beat by 2 now i maybe added a car or so its a diffrence but not that much

Tough to compare A4 to M6...

The Trans Am owner is a capable driver...He didn't miss a shift or blip the rev limiter...

We went from a 35mph roll which is ideal for my 2nd gear...3 honks...I was the one honking so I may have gotten a slight jump because of that, but nothing to get excited about.

I wasn't powershifting and I don't believe he was either, but even my granny shift is pretty damn fast.

Well first off are you auto or m6? Second what are your rpms at say 80mph? There's a way to tell, hopefully your speedos correct...

Nice runs, very close. I don't think gears can make up for a 50whp difference though, something seems off.

I'm M6...

I believe my RPM at 80mph are around 2000 or so when in 6th gear...I haven't looked to confirm, but I've got a long drive tonight so if I get an opening I'll check...

I have a Superchips tuner which has been set to 4.10 gears which means my speedometer should be correct...

This race was 35mph to the top of my 4th gear...If I hit 5th, the Trans Am would still be in 4th and would start to walk away from there...So this wasn't a topend run...This was a quick 35mph to maybe 118mph...

That's not a huge surprise, from 35mph you've got a pretty big advantage on him whether he's in 1st or 2nd(he's either got to lug 2nd or spin through 1st). Looked like he was pulling away pretty hard at the end. Good race either way.

damn nice run man, what is your speedo at 70mph with the 410's? can you tell a difference in fuel economy with them?

Somewhere around 1800 I think...Again, I haven't really paid attention to that, but I'll try and take a look tonight and I'll confirm what it's at later on this evening....


The car already had the gears installed when I bought it...

I average 21 mpg per tank full which includes mixed driving between freeway and around town......and I have a heavy foot

I took a 4.5 hour trip from western Washington over to eastern Washington last year....I averaged 29 mpg for the trip with the A/C cranked the whole way.

That's not a huge surprise, from 35mph you've got a pretty big advantage on him whether he's in 1st or 2nd(he's either got to lug 2nd or spin through 1st). Looked like he was pulling away pretty hard at the end. Good race either way.

Thanks...

He started in 2nd I believe...

The race was on my terms...He has more whp/wtq by a good amount obviously...35mph roll in 2nd is right in the middle of my powerband...We stopped at the top of my 4th because if I hit 5th he really would have walked away...

I should also mention that my 345whp/360wtq is somewhat of an estimate...

I dyno'd 334whp/350wtq on a dynojet earlier this year...

I added my MTi Lid as I climbed on the dyno and I really don't think it had any affect on my dyno run...

Since then I have also cut out all the extra baffling and crap for the free ram air mod which I felt a big difference on the topend of my powerband...

A Hypertech 160 t-stat was recently added and the fan temps were lowered to match...



Based off those things I have guesstimated that I'm now at 345whp/360wtq...

Kind of a ricer thing to do, but I don't feel like dropping $$$ for another dyno pull until I get a cam and LT's...

Well first off are you auto or m6? Second what are your rpms at say 80mph? There's a way to tell, hopefully your speedos correct...

Nice runs, very close. I don't think gears can make up for a 50whp difference though, something seems off.



its auto and does 2 thousand rpm at 80 exactly.
thanks:nod:

i don't think they make a HUGE difference...

i raced a guy with 3.73s and the same boltons as me.

both autos

both 3600 stalls i believe

he only got me by a car or less, if i remember right and i got 2.73s

eh idk if i believe gears give you as much as you think, but i guess this is just my experience

I should also mention that my 345whp/360wtq is somewhat of an estimate...

I dyno'd 334whp/350wtq on a dynojet earlier this year...

I added my MTi Lid as I climbed on the dyno and I really don't think it had any affect on my dyno run...

Since then I have also cut out all the extra baffling and crap for the free ram air mod which I felt a big difference on the topend of my powerband...

A Hypertech 160 t-stat was recently added and the fan temps were lowered to match...



Based off those things I have guesstimated that I'm now at 345whp/360wtq...

Kind of a ricer thing to do, but I don't feel like dropping $$$ for another dyno pull until I get a cam and LT's...

No LTs?? What bolt ons do you have?

I'm M6...

I believe my RPM at 80mph are around 2000 or so when in 6th gear...I haven't looked to confirm, but I've got a long drive tonight so if I get an opening I'll check...

I have a Superchips tuner which has been set to 4.10 gears which means my speedometer should be correct...

This race was 35mph to the top of my 4th gear...If I hit 5th, the Trans Am would still be in 4th and would start to walk away from there...So this wasn't a topend run...This was a quick 35mph to maybe 118mph...

Hmm I have 4.11's in mine and at 80 i'm at 2200-2300 roughly, you may have different gears in yours.

its auto and does 2 thousand rpm at 80 exactly.
thanks:nod:

Maybe an A4 guy can chime in, i'm not sure what rpm's vs speedo is in an auto, i'm a M6. Sorry.

60 is 1500
70 is 1700 i think
80 is 2000 i think

i'm an a4

That T/A should be ashamed. Nice run for you tho!


Ashamed of what exactly?? I have a very mild H/C car and he has a very strong light bolt-on car with gears-its about what I expected

and if you guys must know heres the specs of my cam 207/220 .571 .578 118.5 ICL--its a LPE GT2-3 yes very small I know, but I daily drive my car everyday and traffic gets pretty heavy around here so I won't get a bigger cam untill I get another vehicle.

Tough to compare A4 to M6...

The Trans Am owner is a capable driver...He didn't miss a shift or blip the rev limiter...

We went from a 35mph roll which is ideal for my 2nd gear...3 honks...I was the one honking so I may have gotten a slight jump because of that, but nothing to get excited about.

I wasn't powershifting and I don't believe he was either, but even my granny shift is pretty damn fast.


yea you got the jump mainly because my TCS kicked in right when I hit it and it cut my throttle a little bit, i figured this would be better than to risk having my ass end slide into you-and no i didnt powershift.

http://www.f-body.org/gears/

M6: 80mph should be around 2150rpm with 4.10's

Nice close race btw. :nod:

Tough to compare A4 to M6...

The Trans Am owner is a capable driver...He didn't miss a shift or blip the rev limiter...

We went from a 35mph roll which is ideal for my 2nd gear...3 honks...I was the one honking so I may have gotten a slight jump because of that, but nothing to get excited about.

I wasn't powershifting and I don't believe he was either, but even my granny shift is pretty damn fast.

Sorry to inform you but your gears didn't help you as much as you think. Gears only help you off the line and marginally at rolls starting at <25, after that its just different shifting points, no added accelereation. 35 is the worst possible place for a m6 with stock gears. Race from 45 and it should be a different race.

How is the OP making 345rwhp without LT's?

im getting me 4.10's....

60 is 1500
70 is 1700 i think
80 is 2000 i think

i'm an a4

so what gears do i have.
im confused.:confused:

Go to gear calculations on here under gears and axles and check your rpms. That will get you somewhere close. I have 4.10's in a m6 and I am around 1900 at 70 mph. You should be a bit higher.

Go to gear calculations on here under gears and axles and check your rpms. That will get you somewhere close. I have 4.10's in a m6 and I am around 1900 at 70 mph. You should be a bit higher.

can u do it 4 me i dont understand i would greatly apreciate it. my rims and tires are the stock ones.

Ashamed of what exactly??

Nothing to be ashamed of in that run. What the video doesnt show is that the TA was out by a car at the end. TA out horsepowered the SS regardless of gears or driver or whatever.

What do you guys expect 10 car lengths? Forgot about the ricer calculator conversion: 50whp = 2.5 car lengths.

The street is a dirty, filthy animal.

BTW, that particular TA can keep up with a 400+whp GTO.

No LTs?? What bolt ons do you have?

Car put down 334whp/350wtq on a dynojet with RandomTech cats that have been gutted, RandomTech y-pipe, Hooker Street Force Catback, and Superchips tune through the 4.10 gears....

1 minute before climbing on the dyno I added the MTi Lid....

Since the dyno I did the free ram air mod and added a Hypertech 160 t-stat...

I did not reset the ECU before climbing on the dyno and from what I've read that would possibly indicate that the lid had little/no affect on my dyno run...

Hmm I have 4.11's in mine and at 80 i'm at 2200-2300 roughly, you may have different gears in yours.

I checked it on my long drive after work yesterday...

I was at exactly 2000 rpm at 80 mph per my stock tach...

My speedometer has been adjusted with the Superchips Programmer to compensate for the gears...

Ashamed of what exactly?? I have a very mild H/C car and he has a very strong light bolt-on car with gears-its about what I expected

and if you guys must know heres the specs of my cam 207/220 .571 .578 118.5 ICL--its a LPE GT2-3 yes very small I know, but I daily drive my car everyday and traffic gets pretty heavy around here so I won't get a bigger cam untill I get another vehicle.


Yeah, you've got nothing to be ashamed of Nick....

It was a fun close run, and, as I already stated, if we had kept going beyond my 4th gear it would have been murder....





I dispute the idea that gears make no difference above 25mph as others have mentioned....1st through 4th gear it makes a noticeable difference IMO, and while my shift points do come up sooner than a stock geared M6, I am capable of shifting fast enough for it to not make a huge difference....

Apparently we need to find 2 stock M6 cars, 1 with 4.10s and one with the stock 3.42's to see what the true difference is..........but then everyone would start arguing about drivers.

yea you got the jump mainly because my TCS kicked in right when I hit it and it cut my throttle a little bit, i figured this would be better than to risk having my ass end slide into you-and no i didnt powershift.

I spun a little, but not enough to bring the car sideways or anything else...

I've got no TCS on mine for those that are wondering...

How is the OP making 345rwhp without LT's?

The 345whp/360wtq is a guesstimate based off a dyno run that was made earlier this year...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cRS2LNrbHY
http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/e36bimmer328is/2001%20Camaro%20SS/01CamaroDyno122107-1.jpg

When the dyno run was made my car had RandomTech cats that had been gutted, a RandomTech y-pipe, a Hooker Street Force catback, and the Superchips tune all running through the 4.10 gears...

Right before the car climbed on the dyno I added the MTi lid, but I did not reset the ECU and from what I've read that would indicate that the lid had little/no affect on my dyno run....

The car put down 334whp/350wtq as can be seen on the above sheet and in the video link above....

Since then I've added a Hypertech 160 t-stat, adjusted the fans to compensate, and completed the "free" ram air mod....

Taking into consideration that the lid probably had no affect on the dyno and the topend power freed up by the "free" ram air mod I guesstimate the car is now putting down 345whp/360wtq....




Ask yourself this, is it better for me to have 345whp/360wtq, or is it better for me to have less power than I claim and to have kept up as well as I did against the 395whp Trans Am

Honestly the only reason you guys were so close is you made him start at the worst spot for his car and your gears helped out right there. By the time I heard a shift he was pulling.

Honestly the only reason you guys were so close is you made him start at the worst spot for his car and your gears helped out right there. By the time I heard a shift he was pulling.

rodger is this u lol

Honestly the only reason you guys were so close is you made him start at the worst spot for his car and your gears helped out right there. By the time I heard a shift he was pulling.

Well he obviously wasn't in too bad of a spot if his TCS kicked on:engarde:

Well he obviously wasn't in too bad of a spot if his TCS kicked on:engarde:

My stock GTO can spin the tires over in 2nd at 35 mph, sometimes 3rd.

Honestly gears will give you about 2-3 tenths.

rodger is this u lol

Who the fuck is Rodger?

Who the fuck is Rodger?


my bad dude u got the exact same car as my friend my bad.

I dispute the idea that gears make no difference above 25mph as others have mentioned....1st through 4th gear it makes a noticeable difference IMO, and while my shift points do come up sooner than a stock geared M6, I am capable of shifting fast enough for it to not make a huge difference....



After first gear all gears do is change where your shift points are. Most don't race to the top of fourth. You race to a finish line/MPH. Your 2nd may 'feel' faster than his. The reason for this is that your 2nd is a half gear lower than his 2nd. When you shift his 2nd is going to feel faster than your third. Then he shifts and the process repeats itself.

Regardless if gears helped or not, James's car runs VERY hard for as little as it has, Ive seen that SS run down some pretty impressive vehicles. It is indeed a factory freak.

I've got an A4 with GM 3.73's installed. At 80, i'm at about 2700-2800 rpm. :(

http://www.f-body.org/gears/

M6: 80mph should be around 2150rpm with 4.10's

Nice close race btw. :nod:


Strange, I have 4.11 gears and at 70 mph I am at 2000rpm.

Tire sizes also effect RPMsat speeds as well, correct? Wouldn't say, 18s like mine decrease the MPH at 80? Larger tires, lower RPMS. If all you guys are stock, with differect RPM readings, then someones gears are off. Also, speedos need to be calibrated, thus why I can't give my actual speed rpm lol.

black bur your logic is flawed at best... Sure, when you shift into 3rd his 2nd is going to pull better, but by the time you have shifted into third youve already smoked him through 2nd, and when he shifts into 3rd you are going to start pulling again. In the same gear, two cars with 4.10s and 3.42s that are otherwise equal are not going to accelerate at the same rate, the geared car will win.

I dont see what makes you think that gears dont make a difference, theyre very effective, especially in M6 cars like ours that are geared pretty damn tall to begin with.

Furthermore, lets say that you are right (which you arent...) and you dont accelerate faster with gears. I have a 98 formula with a H/C/I LS6 that makes 430rwhp. Now, my cars no dog at low rpm, but when the tach hits 4500rpm the shit hits the fan all the way to 7200. For a car like mine a set of 4.10s will make a biiiiiig difference, especially on the highway roll racing.

black bur your logic is flawed at best... Sure, when you shift into 3rd his 2nd is going to pull better, but by the time you have shifted into third youve already smoked him through 2nd, and when he shifts into 3rd you are going to start pulling again. In the same gear, two cars with 4.10s and 3.42s that are otherwise equal are not going to accelerate at the same rate, the geared car will win.

I dont see what makes you think that gears dont make a difference, theyre very effective, especially in M6 cars like ours that are geared pretty damn tall to begin with.

Furthermore, lets say that you are right (which you arent...) and you dont accelerate faster with gears. I have a 98 formula with a H/C/I LS6 that makes 430rwhp. Now, my cars no dog at low rpm, but when the tach hits 4500rpm the shit hits the fan all the way to 7200. For a car like mine a set of 4.10s will make a biiiiiig difference, especially on the highway roll racing.

Agreed. Gears help you rev up faster, thus putting you in the powerband faster. I bet with your setup, it likes to pull hard as hell. But even stock cars feel a difference. My car is a completely different animal after I did the 4.10s. I believe there are even some videos around of full bolt on, geared F-bods taking down their cam only counter parts.

I have to dissagree with the poster who said gears dont make that big of a difference. My car had 4.10s in it when i bought it. The rear end broke and now i am back to 3.42s. I know my car is slower now than it was with the gears. I know seat of the pants isn't a race track, but from a roll my car feels like it lost at least 30hp to the wheels with the stock gears.

50whp difference and one has 2.73 gears the other has 4.10 gears in the "what looked like" an 1/8 mi. race??? I'll put money on the guy with 4.10's. And this is mexico where whp is negotiable :D.

however I don't want you LS1 guys getting 4.10's, ifya know what I mean ;-).

I have 3.73's in my a4 and at 70 I'm hitting about 2300 rpm or so...

I'm auto and at 80 its 2800 rpm's with 3.73, and gears do make a difference if your able to hook up. with my bolt ons i got the same result at the track as with just lid and the slp exhaust which was 13.3, trap speed was a little quicker. (w/3.23)I had 3.73's put in and it went 13.0 flat consistantly.

Regardless if gears helped or not, James's car runs VERY hard for as little as it has, Ive seen that SS run down some pretty impressive vehicles. It is indeed a factory freak.

Thanks Nick:cheers:

50whp difference and one has 2.73 gears the other has 4.10 gears in the "what looked like" an 1/8 mi. race??? I'll put money on the guy with 4.10's. And this is mexico where whp is negotiable :D.

however I don't want you LS1 guys getting 4.10's, ifya know what I mean ;-).

Trans Am has the stock 3.42 gears....Both cars are M6's

Race covered probably 1/6 of a mile....Where we run we have a 1/4 mile marked, but this rolling race started just after the typical starting line...



My favorite part of Mexico is the donkey show:D

black bur your logic is flawed at best... Sure, when you shift into 3rd his 2nd is going to pull better, but by the time you have shifted into third youve already smoked him through 2nd, and when he shifts into 3rd you are going to start pulling again. In the same gear, two cars with 4.10s and 3.42s that are otherwise equal are not going to accelerate at the same rate, the geared car will win.

I dont see what makes you think that gears dont make a difference, theyre very effective, especially in M6 cars like ours that are geared pretty damn tall to begin with.

Furthermore, lets say that you are right (which you arent...) and you dont accelerate faster with gears. I have a 98 formula with a H/C/I LS6 that makes 430rwhp. Now, my cars no dog at low rpm, but when the tach hits 4500rpm the shit hits the fan all the way to 7200. For a car like mine a set of 4.10s will make a biiiiiig difference, especially on the highway roll racing.

First that is not logic those are the laws of physics. Second I didn't say gears don't help, because they do. I said gears don't help you unless you start from a very slow roll or the line. Third who sets the rules of a race such that both cars start at the bottom of the same gear? Any one I know that roll races starts with their cars side by side at the same speed.

That being said, as long as you are going more than 25MPH you will both be in your "powerband". The gear ratios of your transmission will still be the same in both cars, and so when you shift you will both start the new gear at the same RPMs. You will be at different speeds going into the new gear, but will both begin it with identical RPMs. This means that after you hit the powerband in first both engines will have the same 'average' torque multiplier from the start of the race till the end.

james race my camaro when its finished.. i wont have the t56 any more but Nicks T/a is impressive indeed... walked me when we raced ;)









p.s. you guys wont like me when my cars finished :devil:

First that is not logic those are the laws of physics. Second I didn't say gears don't help, because they do. I said gears don't help you unless you start from a very slow roll or the line. Third who sets the rules of a race such that both cars start at the bottom of the same gear? Any one I know that roll races starts with their cars side by side at the same speed.

That being said, as long as you are going more than 25MPH you will both be in your "powerband". The gear ratios of your transmission will still be the same in both cars, and so when you shift you will both start the new gear at the same RPMs. You will be at different speeds going into the new gear, but will both begin it with identical RPMs. This means that after you hit the powerband in first both engines will have the same 'average' torque multiplier from the start of the race till the end.

wow you really do not know what you are talking about...alright:

gears in a transmission dont mean shit between final drive ratios. the final drive gear ratio sets the stage for how fast you will accelerate, and for those who care, decelerate.

the gear reduction basically acts as a torque multiplier on the rear wheels....i hate explaining this shit...

a 4.10:1 gear ratio in the rear will allow the 2.66:1 ratio 1st gear to accelerate, or run through the rpms a lot faster than a 3.42:1 ratio. and the process repeats itself through 2nd gear...3rd gear, 4th, 5th..and...you guessed it! 6th gear.

the hole driveline relies on the the final drive....cause if there was no rear guess what? you wouldnt be able to keep a constant speed, you would just get slower and slower with each gear reduction. because you would be stuck with those gear ratios in the transmission.....2.66 1.78 1.30 0.74 and 0.50

so by your logic..identical cars, final drive is 3.42 in one and 4.10 in the other....
same RPM, same gear from a roll they can take off and shift at the same time? WRONG!
if they were at the same rpm they wouldn't be able to stay next to each other at the same speed!

you have obviously never had experience with gear ratios, and simple machines like levers and shit. 4.10s will ultimately accelerate ALL gear ratios in the transmission faster, therefore making a car accelerate faster, simple gear reduction-torque multiplication math. and guess where the "average" torque multiplication comes from?

...THE FINAL DRIVE!

The more powerful car ran your race, with his traction control on, and you got the jump. The Trans Am STILL won the race... what did the gears do for you again!?

they helped him keep up with 50 more hp to the wheels. actually its more like 70 more hp because he only has 330ish, maybe 340 with his mods after his last dyno.

You will be at different speeds going into the new gear, but will both begin it with identical RPMs. This means that after you hit the powerband in first both engines will have the same 'average' torque multiplier from the start of the race till the end.

Torque multiplier by what, final gears? Differernt gears different problems, you are defeating your own argument.

Two cars equal hp and trans with differnet gears. The 4.11 will run quicker off the line than the 3.42. The 3.42 will have a higher mph limit (not faster) and the 4.11 will have a lower mph limit when all of the gear is ran out. The 4.11 will get to its max mph much quicker than the 3.42.

Yes gears do make a difference in how quick a car is with all else equal.

OP thanks for the vid.

The difference with my car with the 4.10's is I can stay in my powerband better, I shift at 6800 however I run out of gears fast. Most times I take it to the top of 4th, but I don't like trying to pull in 5th but can with no problem. My car runs like a raped ape above 3K rpm.

damn badass race... cant believe you hung with him so close must have been a real small cam

james race my camaro when its finished.. i wont have the t56 any more but Nicks T/a is impressive indeed... walked me when we raced ;)









p.s. you guys wont like me when my cars finished :devil:

I'm down...My only chance would be if you have the kind of traction issues you had last time you were out:D

I'm planning on a cam, LT's, and a custom tune the beginning of next year...If we don't get you out this year before the weather turns to shit then next year will be interesting.

The more powerful car ran your race, with his traction control on, and you got the jump. The Trans Am STILL won the race... what did the gears do for you again!?

You must be sharp as a marble...

I got a very small jump because I was the one doing the honking...They were timed evenly but obviously I know when I'm pushing the horn for the 3rd time and he has to wait to here it...SMALL JUMP

He kept his TCS on which prevented him from spinning badly...That assisted him...I spun a bit as I took off as well, but not enough to make a big stink over.

I was at a 50whp disadvantage and only lost by 1 CL...It would appear to me that gears made a big difference...

they helped him keep up with 50 more hp to the wheels. actually its more like 70 more hp because he only has 330ish, maybe 340 with his mods after his last dyno.


I'm assuming I gained 11whp/10wtq between the lid, gutted ram air, and t-stat....

Obviously don't know for sure....

I put down 334whp/350wtq without them....

The car pulls a lot harder in the higher rpms now that the ram air has been gutted so I know I freed up some peak hp by just doing that

Thanks...

He started in 2nd I believe...

The race was on my terms...He has more whp/wtq by a good amount obviously...35mph roll in 2nd is right in the middle of my powerband...We stopped at the top of my 4th because if I hit 5th he really would have walked away...

Obviously....

This is why you won. A cammed car, with stock gears, starting in 2nd gear @ 35mph = dead spot.....

:confused: So how did the gears help exactly?

Edit- Just for reference, when I was cammed with stock gears I would keep my car in 1st gear for any kind of roll race under 50mph.

Obviously....

This is why you won. A cammed car, with stock gears, starting in 2nd gear @ 35mph = dead spot.....

:confused: So how did the gears help exactly?

Edit- Just for reference, when I was cammed with stock gears I would keep my car in 1st gear for any kind of roll race under 50mph.


Read all the posts in the thread before you post...

The same thought has already been brought up and the response has been made that the Trans Am was in the powerband enough to spin a bit and have the TCS kick in...

I honestly never confirmed with Nick if he was in 1st or 2nd...I just assumed 2nd...

Either way, this thread is 4 pages in and your point has already been mentioned...

Obviously gears helped me...If they do nothing then they are a pointless mod.

I've posted other threads that you've responded to with retarded comments or shit that has already been discussed...

Go be a tool elsewhere.

Obviously....

This is why you won. A cammed car, with stock gears, starting in 2nd gear @ 35mph = dead spot.....

:confused: So how did the gears help exactly?

Edit- Just for reference, when I was cammed with stock gears I would keep my car in 1st gear for any kind of roll race under 50mph.

You would be in 1st for a 40mph roll? That trans must love ya. :D

Good kill LS1>

You would be in 1st for a 40mph roll? That trans must love ya. :D

Good kill LS1>

Wasn't really a kill since I lost:bang:

but thanks:D

Wasn't really a kill since I lost:bang:

but thanks:D


Oops. Better luck next time. :devil:

Read all the posts in the thread before you post...

The same thought has already been brought up and the response has been made that the Trans Am was in the powerband enough to spin a bit and have the TCS kick in...

I did thanks. The same thought has been brought up, I acknowledge that but guess what? It's my opinion and obviously theres a few others that feel the same way.



I honestly never confirmed with Nick if he was in 1st or 2nd...I just assumed 2nd...

Either way, this thread is 4 pages in and your point has already been mentioned...

Obviously gears helped me...If they do nothing then they are a pointless mod.

I've posted other threads that you've responded to with retarded comments or shit that has already been discussed...

Go be a tool elsewhere.

I wasn't trying to make a point. I never said gears do not help and are a worthless mod. I just dont agree with you saying that the gears, in this situation, helped or made a difference. Remember, the race was done on "your terms". So... its bound to have skewed results.
No thanks, I'll "tool" around a littler longer. :chug:


You would be in 1st for a 40mph roll? That trans must love ya. :D



Yes sir, would you like to see?

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/408-Turbo-TA-vs-r6-and-2_23436.htm

All rolls were 40ish mph and the 3 way with the bike was a 50mph roll, disregard what the video says, just listen to the short burst(s) and quick shift to 2nd.

Cammed, full exhaust, DR's, lid and tune. Trans didn't mind but the clutch sure did after a few runs (:barf:SPEC 3)

You must be sharp as a marble...

I got a very small jump because I was the one doing the honking...They were timed evenly but obviously I know when I'm pushing the horn for the 3rd time and he has to wait to here it...SMALL JUMP

He kept his TCS on which prevented him from spinning badly...That assisted him...I spun a bit as I took off as well, but not enough to make a big stink over.

I was at a 50whp disadvantage and only lost by 1 CL...It would appear to me that gears made a big difference...

When you figure out the difference between 'here' and 'hear' only then can you insult the intelligence of another.

And I'm sure the TCS helped him. Don't you know cars with traction issues go faster with traction control on... :rolleyes:

Nice runs. Way to keep up with way less power.

When you figure out the difference between 'here' and 'hear' only then can you insult the intelligence of another.

And I'm sure the TCS helped him. Don't you know cars with traction issues go faster with traction control on... :rolleyes:



I apologize for my one grammatical error...

Typing 60 WPM can occasionally cause some errors...

The other car prefers to race with TCS on...My statement is that he obviously wasn't too far out of his power band because he spun a bit and the TCS had to kick in momentarily...

Nice runs. Way to keep up with way less power.

Exactly :D

wow you really do not know what you are talking about...alright:

gears in a transmission dont mean shit between final drive ratios. the final drive gear ratio sets the stage for how fast you will accelerate, and for those who care, decelerate.

the gear reduction basically acts as a torque multiplier on the rear wheels....i hate explaining this shit...

a 4.10:1 gear ratio in the rear will allow the 2.66:1 ratio 1st gear to accelerate, or run through the rpms a lot faster than a 3.42:1 ratio. and the process repeats itself through 2nd gear...3rd gear, 4th, 5th..and...you guessed it! 6th gear.

the hole driveline relies on the the final drive....cause if there was no rear guess what? you wouldnt be able to keep a constant speed, you would just get slower and slower with each gear reduction. because you would be stuck with those gear ratios in the transmission.....2.66 1.78 1.30 0.74 and 0.50

so by your logic..identical cars, final drive is 3.42 in one and 4.10 in the other....
same RPM, same gear from a roll they can take off and shift at the same time? WRONG!
if they were at the same rpm they wouldn't be able to stay next to each other at the same speed!

you have obviously never had experience with gear ratios, and simple machines like levers and shit. 4.10s will ultimately accelerate ALL gear ratios in the transmission faster, therefore making a car accelerate faster, simple gear reduction-torque multiplication math. and guess where the "average" torque multiplication comes from?

...THE FINAL DRIVE!

You obviously aren't understanding what I'm trying to say. If you have different final drive ratios you CAN'T be in the same gear at the same RPM at the same speed. And the ratios inside the tranny have 10 times the importance of the final drive ratio, in regards to acceleration.

You obviously don't know what you are talking about. Saying the whole driveline relies on the final drive is like saying the whole driveline relies on the rear U-Joint. Just because it is a link in the chain doesn't mean its all important.

And you obviously haven't had ANY experience with gear ratios. The ENTIRE PURPOSE of the transmission is to reduce engine speed from one gear to the next. Just because a final drive makes every gear shorter doesn't necessarily mean you go faster. You still depend on the engine to make power. And how much power your engine is making depends on how many RPMs it is at. And guess what determines what RPMs you are at? The gear ratios inside your transmission.

The relationships between torque, horsepower, gear ratios, and acceleration are to complicated to try to explain over the net. I guess if you don't understand them I can't help you.

You obviously aren't understanding what I'm trying to say. If you have different final drive ratios you CAN'T be in the same gear at the same RPM at the same speed. And the ratios inside the tranny have 10 times the importance of the final drive ratio, in regards to acceleration.

You obviously don't know what you are talking about. Saying the whole driveline relies on the final drive is like saying the whole driveline relies on the rear U-Joint. Just because it is a link in the chain doesn't mean its all important.

And you obviously haven't had ANY experience with gear ratios. The ENTIRE PURPOSE of the transmission is to reduce engine speed from one gear to the next. Just because a final drive makes every gear shorter doesn't necessarily mean you go faster. You still depend on the engine to make power. And how much power your engine is making depends on how many RPMs it is at. And guess what determines what RPMs you are at? The gear ratios inside your transmission.

The relationships between torque, horsepower, gear ratios, and acceleration are to complicated to try to explain over the net. I guess if you don't understand them I can't help you.

dude, you are wrong. well you are right that it is difficult to type shit on here id rather explain it to you but YOUR LITTLE ignorant brain thinks that I dont know what im talking about. i have PLENTY of experience with automobiles.

you OBVIOUSLY arent understanding what I was saying. The entire speed of the vehicle "THEORETICALLY" relies on the final drive. I know how complicated they are, its just like everything else, they work together as a system. and you can change different elements in that system to make it more efficient. if they dont work together then they fail, its a fact of life. ever play a team sport before? if you dont work as a team you fail. same things applies to everything.

you keep contradicting yourself and making new posts changing your point of view after i proved you wrong. first you say that the gears in the transmission have 10 times mroe importance than the final drive....THEN you say just because its one link in the chain doesnt mean its all important. THATS how I know you dont know what you are talking about.

and no one else agrees with you. sorry i dont need help understanding something that i already absolutely know.

no shit the transmission gears reduce engine speed, and the final gear ratio determines the ACTUAL speed of the engine and wheel rotation, along with other factors such as tire size, tire material, friction from the road, etc etc etc.

there is alot more involved with REAL physics and how the real world actually works than just numbers punched into a computer.

You would be in 1st for a 40mph roll? That trans must love ya. :D

Good kill LS1>

jesus christ i was thinking the exact same thing--and yes James I was in 2nd gear-I don't remember what rpms i was at but ya I decided to leave the TCS on because I didn't want to risk sliding into you're car (as I stated earlier in this thread) the tradeoff is when it kicks in it cuts you're throttle for a second or 2 so you have to play a little bit of catch up, I really learned this the hard way when I raced that TT g35. It sucks but its better than crashing your car.

damn badass race... cant believe you hung with him so close must have been a real small cam

yes it is--but you don't always need a huge cam for a fast car-look at PewterScreaminMach --he's running 11's and puts down very similar numbers to my car.

When you figure out the difference between 'here' and 'hear' only then can you insult the intelligence of another.

And I'm sure the TCS helped him. Don't you know cars with traction issues go faster with traction control on... :rolleyes:

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y254/Daredevil_TA/YouWinThePrize1.jpg

Good race, looks like a good loss to me; you clearly see the T/A pulling easily on you. Must have been bad at higher speed.. You just started in a better powerband than him so you were close:nod:

Good race:thumb: