SprayedLT1

iTrader: (8)

I think my only winter project this year will be to upgrade the heads on my car. Right now they are completely stock.

I have a couple questions. I was considering a set of Darts, but I'm curious how they stack up out of the box against a set of ported stock heads, say AI or LE. I don't know what kind of budget I will be on when it's time to do work, but I know I won't have a lot. How will my money be spent more wisely

I'm thinking that if I get Darts, I will have more room to grow in the future by having them worked down the road, maybe even light work now, like pocket work and port matching.

My engine is a stock bottom end 355, forged flat tops, 280XFI cam. I run a 175 shot, and may run 2 stages of 100 each next year.

Any advice or experience?

94LT1Bird

iTrader: (4)

bang for buck...port the stockers....

if u get aftermarket heads....u also want to look into stuff like cumbustion chamber sizes.....bigger the cc....less compression ratio....which depending on ur build...could hurt or help u....

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

A few guys have tried the Darts and as cast it was "about as good as mildly ported iron heads" in other words if you want to be able to say you have Darts they are fine but if looking to spend that kind of money on a performance mod then maybe you should look elsewhere.

The chamber comment above is good too as they are a larger chamber.

Mattsz28

iTrader: (1)

Really, its all in your budget. I went with dart heads that I got at a super deal. When I got them I thought they looked like ****. I sent them out to my engine guy and he spent ALOT of time making them what they are now. They have ALOT of potential, but you need to maximize it.

I'm going to be one of those people caprice doesnt believe exsists and say that I bought the wrong part. I bought the wrong heads, all I wanted was a mild street 383. Now its going to be a lot more than mild. She'll still see the street though. I should have stuck with the heads I'm selling this week. They flow alright, I already had them, and it would have saved me 2g's in the end (I got the heads for 800$ and then biddy went to work. I should get pics, they look NASTY)

The question goes like this

How fast do you want to go?

How much money do you have?

slomarao

iTrader: (6)

Why not get AI Darts? no no, i understand about your budget. AI's 200cc heads and le3's are going to be tough to beat for the money. Both have put down great numbers in many different applications. I would really go for one of the two.

ChiTownHustler

iTrader: (3)

what about AFR or TFS

SprayedLT1

iTrader: (8)

AFR are expensive, and I only heard good about the TFS if theyre fully ported.

slomarao

iTrader: (6)

thats not true. Hop on camaroz28.com, lots of good results over there. All sorts of apps from FI to NA to N20.

BlackTA96

iTrader: (3)

how do yall feel about edelbrock heads?

James Montigny

iTrader: (13)

Personal opinion ...
I think Edelbrock sold their souls (and brand name) to the devil a few years back.


I think the OP's best bet for a forged 355 and that cam is to go with a stage II or III setup from LE or AI. (ported stock heads)
I like ported aftermarket castings, lots of meat in them to make them flow better (or rather
flow correctly to match the application) but the as-cast just don't seem to put down numbers to justify the spend.
Although, you'll find some interesting posts from TFS and AFR claiming otherwise if you search around.
I think I saw a rant from one of them on a Corvette board the other day.

Remember that "bigger" ports and higher flow numbers do not always mean better performance.
If you put 227cc castings with 300+cfm @ .700 flow rates on a 450hp motor, you're probably not going to
end up with an optimal setup. But if you talk to the person building you engine, designing you cam or even
the people selling the heads, you should be able to determine what will work best for you and your budget.

As mentioned above, also keep an eye on combustion chamber size.
Large chambers mean lower compression ratio. You'll have to mill them down to get the numbers right.
That means making sure that the milling doesn't cause you issues with the valve sizes you've chosen.
It's a headache best lest for the machinist to work out.

OutlawZ

iTrader: (4)

Do not forget that the AFR eliminator castings are putting up great out of the box numbers..... I do like the AI and LE setups but I also like the thick deck of the AFR head.... I think a good set of AFR's will **** on a set of Edelbrock LTanything heads....

most of the top LT1 cars in the country have AFR heads on them.....

There are the ones with the 215 RR heads that got lucky to get em before they stop making them and then there are those "like myself" that just have bad *** AFR 227's ported by a top guy....

For a 355 like the OP, a good setup of comp ported 210cc AFR's would be MORE than enough head..... hell even the 195cc heads are nice.... the eliminators flow like gangbusters....

flyinZ

iTrader: (15)

Why dont guys go with AFR's anymore, instead of TF's or Darts?? Hell, if nothing else, just buy a bare set and send to a particular porter..Sometimes you get better results that way

slomarao

iTrader: (6)

AFR's are $$$. TFS heads have recently been producing very good numbers. On the track and the dyno. You dont see many people using AFR much anymore, or at least i dont.

OutlawZ

iTrader: (4)

Hmmmmmm some of the fastest LTx's on the planet are using em..... maybe the people that aren't using them nowadays really don't want to go fast..... I have AFR's, Tony Shep has AFR's... I think Sikora has AFR 215 RR heads.... Pretty sure Jeff Gilbert has AFR's..... I don't know what Joey Kenville has...... probably AFR's.....

EliteCamaro94

im gonna be lookin at basically the same thing u have pretty soon here minus the spray. Im gonna be goin with a le2 head and cam package from lloyd elliot and its only like 1700 i think from what i remember on his website. Everyone has givin him good praises and i have seen vids of cars pullin 400 hp through an auto with that package. So pretty good numbers i think.

James Montigny

iTrader: (13)

Something to keep in mind is that many of those guys are running ported versions of the AFRs.
They're either doing so because they like the extra material in the casting or
it's what was available at the time of the build. AFR has been around a long time, IIRC they were the only
show in town for a while back when I had my 95.

Lloyd's a good guy. Talking to him generally leads people to the answers they need, even if the
correct answer is not a product he sells.

Keep in mind that 400rwhp is a great target for a stock bottom end, but once you've invested in a beefier
rotating assembly and had the motor built to tigher specs, you can shoot much higher.

EliteCamaro94

Keep in mind that 400rwhp is a great target for a stock bottom end, but once you've invested in a beefier
rotating assembly and had the motor built to tigher specs, you can shoot much higher.[/QUOTE]

Yeah thats very true, my car is just gonna be a street car DD so i gotta keep it emission legal and all that, at least until i buy a beater to drive around.

AChotrod

iTrader: (17)

Keep in mind that 400rwhp is a great target for a stock bottom end, but once you've invested in a beefier
rotating assembly and had the motor built to tigher specs, you can shoot much higher.[/QUOTE]

Stock ported heads will out flow the cam. A beefier cam will put down more power with the le2 heads but will loose streetability. then there's still the spray for when he needs more HP.
Id say go with ported stock heads. Stock heads are very capable on all 350/355s and all but the most radical 383s

1badzee

iTrader: (12)

I have the DART's as-cast and they looked beautiful. Perform great too

OutlawZ

iTrader: (4)

True.... But they aren't sitting on their laurels after coming out with the eliiminator castings... they have thick decks, and the port work out of the box is nice... I had mine handported after they had already been CNC'd...... mine have been performing beautifully.....