How is the Cloyes timing chain?
01-13-2009, 02:36 AM
#1
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How is the Cloyes timing chain? Hi All,
well i'm checking for a oil leak so i'm removing my timing chain cover and I fig might as well change my timing chain right now mine has less then 30,000 and its a SA brand, I see auto zone has a Cloyes are they any good?
I don't want to order one because I wana have this done by Saturday...
or where else can I get on quick..
thanks guys.
well i'm checking for a oil leak so i'm removing my timing chain cover and I fig might as well change my timing chain right now mine has less then 30,000 and its a SA brand, I see auto zone has a Cloyes are they any good?
I don't want to order one because I wana have this done by Saturday...
or where else can I get on quick..
thanks guys.
01-13-2009, 03:16 AM
#2
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The only reason why you should replace your timing chain is if it has excessive play. At 30K miles I highly doubt there's anything wrong with your current one. Don't waste your money on **** that ain't broke. 
If you want to do the job then yes, Cloyes chains are what a lot of people in the LT1 world use. If replacing the chain you should also replace the crank and camshaft gears.
If you want to do the job then yes, Cloyes chains are what a lot of people in the LT1 world use. If replacing the chain you should also replace the crank and camshaft gears.
01-13-2009, 07:39 AM
#3
I was chasing an oil leak on my '96 Z-28 a few years ago, and thought exactly the same thing...You're in there, and since it's such a PITA to get there, do the chain and forget about it......
HOWEVER, I bought the Cloyes replacement set, since it's the only choice other than a GM part. I got almost everything back in place, and just wanted to turn the motor over a little, so I could index the "opti" for easier re-install. I temporarily put a keyway in the crank, put my crank socket on, and tried to turn the motor. I couldn't, as it was locked up tight!
I reversed my steps, until I found the issue. The cam gear wasn't machined the same as the OE gear, and it was locking up against the cam thrust plate screws. I contacted Cloyes, gave then all the measurements on my gear, they compared it to their prints, and said the gear was "right on the money"....
"But my engine won't turn over", I told them. "I don't know what to tell you", was their reply. Fortunately for me, I had access to the tool room where I worked, and was able to modify the Cloyes gear so its dimensions matched the OE gear, and it was OK after that.
FWIW, a timing chain CAN stretch quite a bit in 30,000 miles. My wife used to have a Caprice LTZ for a daily driver. I had a front cover oil leak develop in that car too, so I pulled the front cover to make the repair. I was shocked at how much slop was in the OE chain, and it was around 30-35,000 miles. I replaced the chain with a True Roller set, and then checked the ignition timing. It had changed by 3 degrees, due to chain slop.....
HOWEVER, I bought the Cloyes replacement set, since it's the only choice other than a GM part. I got almost everything back in place, and just wanted to turn the motor over a little, so I could index the "opti" for easier re-install. I temporarily put a keyway in the crank, put my crank socket on, and tried to turn the motor. I couldn't, as it was locked up tight!
I reversed my steps, until I found the issue. The cam gear wasn't machined the same as the OE gear, and it was locking up against the cam thrust plate screws. I contacted Cloyes, gave then all the measurements on my gear, they compared it to their prints, and said the gear was "right on the money"....
"But my engine won't turn over", I told them. "I don't know what to tell you", was their reply. Fortunately for me, I had access to the tool room where I worked, and was able to modify the Cloyes gear so its dimensions matched the OE gear, and it was OK after that.
FWIW, a timing chain CAN stretch quite a bit in 30,000 miles. My wife used to have a Caprice LTZ for a daily driver. I had a front cover oil leak develop in that car too, so I pulled the front cover to make the repair. I was shocked at how much slop was in the OE chain, and it was around 30-35,000 miles. I replaced the chain with a True Roller set, and then checked the ignition timing. It had changed by 3 degrees, due to chain slop.....
01-13-2009, 09:32 AM
#4
I was chasing an oil leak on my '96 Z-28 a few years ago, and thought exactly the same thing...You're in there, and since it's such a PITA to get there, do the chain and forget about it......
HOWEVER, I bought the Cloyes replacement set, since it's the only choice other than a GM part. I got almost everything back in place, and just wanted to turn the motor over a little, so I could index the "opti" for easier re-install. I temporarily put a keyway in the crank, put my crank socket on, and tried to turn the motor. I couldn't, as it was locked up tight!
I reversed my steps, until I found the issue. The cam gear wasn't machined the same as the OE gear, and it was locking up against the cam thrust plate screws. I contacted Cloyes, gave then all the measurements on my gear, they compared it to their prints, and said the gear was "right on the money"....
"But my engine won't turn over", I told them. "I don't know what to tell you", was their reply. Fortunately for me, I had access to the tool room where I worked, and was able to modify the Cloyes gear so its dimensions matched the OE gear, and it was OK after that.
FWIW, a timing chain CAN stretch quite a bit in 30,000 miles. My wife used to have a Caprice LTZ for a daily driver. I had a front cover oil leak develop in that car too, so I pulled the front cover to make the repair. I was shocked at how much slop was in the OE chain, and it was around 30-35,000 miles. I replaced the chain with a True Roller set, and then checked the ignition timing. It had changed by 3 degrees, due to chain slop.....
HOWEVER, I bought the Cloyes replacement set, since it's the only choice other than a GM part. I got almost everything back in place, and just wanted to turn the motor over a little, so I could index the "opti" for easier re-install. I temporarily put a keyway in the crank, put my crank socket on, and tried to turn the motor. I couldn't, as it was locked up tight!
I reversed my steps, until I found the issue. The cam gear wasn't machined the same as the OE gear, and it was locking up against the cam thrust plate screws. I contacted Cloyes, gave then all the measurements on my gear, they compared it to their prints, and said the gear was "right on the money"....
"But my engine won't turn over", I told them. "I don't know what to tell you", was their reply. Fortunately for me, I had access to the tool room where I worked, and was able to modify the Cloyes gear so its dimensions matched the OE gear, and it was OK after that.
FWIW, a timing chain CAN stretch quite a bit in 30,000 miles. My wife used to have a Caprice LTZ for a daily driver. I had a front cover oil leak develop in that car too, so I pulled the front cover to make the repair. I was shocked at how much slop was in the OE chain, and it was around 30-35,000 miles. I replaced the chain with a True Roller set, and then checked the ignition timing. It had changed by 3 degrees, due to chain slop.....
01-13-2009, 12:12 PM
#5
How much "slop" are you talking about? I think if you put a straight edge on the gears and pull the slack and measure the distance from the chain to the straight edge, something like 1/2" (don't quote me) is acceptable. I agree with the above statement that not much will happen in 30k miles.
The chain I took out of my 30,000 mile LT-1, as well as the brand new Cloyes replacement both had about 1/8" of "play". The OE chain I took out of my wife's Caprice (small block 350) had about 1/4-3/8" of slop, whereas the Cloyes "True Roller" I replaced it with, had "zero" slop.
01-13-2009, 01:51 PM
#6
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ok I got everything off and the oil leak is coming from the water pump gear shaft seal
when I rebuilt my motor I didn't change the seals that had 30,000 miles so i'm going to put all new seals on the cover..
next the SA chain I have on there is differant then the stock chain its smaller links and the stock chain is alot stiffer where when you try to bend it the hard way it don't flex as much as the SA chain, i'm going to look at Cloyes chain today they have one in stock its like $9.00 plus kregen has one its a seal power ? but they have to order it so I don't know how that one looks and its $17.00
hummm
when I rebuilt my motor I didn't change the seals that had 30,000 miles so i'm going to put all new seals on the cover..
next the SA chain I have on there is differant then the stock chain its smaller links and the stock chain is alot stiffer where when you try to bend it the hard way it don't flex as much as the SA chain, i'm going to look at Cloyes chain today they have one in stock its like $9.00 plus kregen has one its a seal power ? but they have to order it so I don't know how that one looks and its $17.00
hummm
01-13-2009, 04:51 PM
#7
Slagger, I don't know what an "SA" chain is, however LT-1 timing sets (chain and gears) aren't cheap. I paid something like $140 for my Cloyes set 4-5 years ago, and that was at "wholesale".
Also, LT-1 timing sets aren't interchangable with standard small block Chevy timing sets, which sell for a lot less money.
Also, LT-1 timing sets aren't interchangable with standard small block Chevy timing sets, which sell for a lot less money.
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01-13-2009, 04:54 PM
#8
Slagger, I don't know what an "SA" chain is, however LT-1 timing sets (chain and gears) aren't cheap. I paid something like $140 for my Cloyes set 4-5 years ago, and that was at "wholesale".
Also, LT-1 timing sets aren't interchangable with standard small block Chevy timing sets, which sell for a lot less money.
Also, LT-1 timing sets aren't interchangable with standard small block Chevy timing sets, which sell for a lot less money.
01-13-2009, 06:58 PM
#11
My Cloyes doesn't have the provision for the water pump drive sprocket.
Typically double roller chains eliminate the sprocket so an electric water pump is necessary. I also needed to trim the back side of the timing cover to get the chain to fit. It had almost ZERO slack once installed.
Typically double roller chains eliminate the sprocket so an electric water pump is necessary. I also needed to trim the back side of the timing cover to get the chain to fit. It had almost ZERO slack once installed.
01-13-2009, 08:15 PM
#13
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SA was the brand name I got from Ebay it is American made and I check out the one in auto zone and its pretty much the same (Cloyes) and it don't look as strong as the stock chain, i will have to post some pictures but anyway I decided to go with the stock chain from the dealer it will be in tomarrow and it cost $51.00 + tax
Thanks Guys.
Thanks Guys.
01-13-2009, 08:19 PM
#14
SA was the brand name I got from Ebay it is American made and I check out the one in auto zone and its pretty much the same (Cloyes) and it don't look as strong as the stock chain, i will have to post some pictures but anyway I decided to go with the stock chain from the dealer it will be in tomarrow and it cost $51.00 + tax
Thanks Guys.
Thanks Guys.
01-14-2009, 06:13 PM
#15
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Yeah it made me think and I checked out my old Camshaft gear it is the oringal and you can see the wear it has 204,000 miles on it my Crank sprocket has under 30,000 and it looks good so what I did was new GM chain that I picked up today and I ordered a Cloyes Camshaft gear.
01-14-2009, 08:00 PM
#16
Yeah it made me think and I checked out my old Camshaft gear it is the oringal and you can see the wear it has 204,000 miles on it my Crank sprocket has under 30,000 and it looks good so what I did was new GM chain that I picked up today and I ordered a Cloyes Camshaft gear.
Would you replace brake pads and rotors on only one front wheel?
