Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

As far as I know, this one was NOT my doing!

There is a video of my startup attempt here: http://img190.imageshack.us/i/dscn0029.mp4/ I "say" I was at WOT, but I was pretty much playing with the gas the whole time trying to get it to idle.

As you all have seen I have been in the middle of a cam swap along with other mods...and as you all know, I dicked up the first attempt pretty bad.

I re-installed the cam, made it look EXACTLY like the timing pictures on shbox's website, ensured plug wires are incorrect order, all vacuum hoses are connected, everything is properly plugged in and grounded. I also have a fuel pressure monitor in my A Pillar which showed the following:

initial turn on...52psi
after primed...maintained 40, 41, 42, or 43 psi for a good minute or two
after that it VERY slowly bled off.
during crank....53psi

I popped off the schrader valve cap to make sure there was no air in the lines...

YES I HAVE GAS

it is definately getting air, spark, but not too sure about fuel.

I can get it to KINDOF start, but only if my foot is on the throttle good, and it is not actually running..the second I take my foot off, it dies.

I unplugged the TPS and it acted EXACTLY the same. I actually forgot it was unplugged for a min, but when I remembered I plugged it back in and there was absolutely no difference.

I forgot to mention in the video that it was while the TPS was unplugged...

The loud pops in the video are because I have open headers right now...

The car NEVER backfired once.

Valves are opening and closing, rockers and rods are nice and tight but not too tight...the crank hand turned smoothly before I put the belt on, with no binding...

Here is EVERYTHING I removed, added, or touched since day 1:

Deleted AIR, EGR, and EVAP

swapped cams

LS7 Lifters

7.2" Chromemoly Pushrods

SVO 30# Injectors

Powdercoated 52mm TB
(had to remove TPS and reinstall on new TB)

Polished Fuel Rails

Polished, Powdercoated, and Port Matched Intake Manifold

Powdercoated Valve Covers

Removed Heads to fix bolt in rear, replaced ALL valves

Installed poly motor mounts, new rear shocks, and new rear brakes...

had computer tuned to all specs by Madtuner

160* Thermostat

new cruise control cable, and throttle cable

Relocated ICM

New alternator

And of course removed all essentials for cam swap such as TC Cover, WP, HB, Hub, etc...

#1 was at TDC and the dots WERE lined up to the 12 and 12, and the dowel pin was to the 9 o'clock when I re-positioned the cam.

Does ANYONE know what the heck is wrong now???!!!

AChotrod

iTrader: (17)

Um........ your hilarious
http://shbox.com/ci/sprockets.jpg
its 6 o'clock on the cam sprocket, 12 on the crank and the cam in the 3 oclock position.

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

yeah. If cylinder # 6 is at TDC. If cylinder 1 is at TDC its 12/12 at the 9

http://shbox.com/1/cam_timing_ani.gif

AChotrod

iTrader: (17)

Yeah.
Copied from his site.

Install cam sprocket and timing chain. (1/2" bolts - torque to 18 lb. ft. I used some red threadlocker on them) Line up the dots on the timing gears. 12 o'clock for the crank gear and 6 o'clock for the cam gear. This will put the cam dowel at 3 o'clock and #6 TDC.
Assemble chain onto the cam sprocket with the chain slack dangling below. Holding the sprocket with the dot on the bottom, lower the chain under the crank sprocket and then pull up to engage the teeth and remove the chain slack. Slip the cam sprocket onto the cam dowel. You may have to turn the cam just a little to get enough slack to get it on. After you get the the sprocket on the dowel, insert one bolt through the sprocket into the cam. Check the alignment of the dots and redo the procedure if needed.

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

exactly..if you put #1 at TDC, it spins the cam sprocket 180 degrees from what it was at #6 TDC. so if you have 1 at TDC, your cam sprocket dot will be at the 12, and the crank sprocket will be at the 12, dowel pin at the 9. That link I posted in my last post shows that, and you will see what the hell I am talking about...that link is ALSO directly from his site

nomoneyz

iTrader: (15)

Might sound too easy but when I replaced my opti I had it barley off the pin and the car acted like yours. It wouldn't start and when it did it didn't stay and sounded ridiculous. might be something to check.

AChotrod

iTrader: (17)

Ok but thats the way its done per the manual. Are you sure they were lined up?

myltwon

iTrader: (1)

sounds like a timing issue to me whether it be valvetrain or ignition, like a wrongly installed cam or opti.

I've had both give me the SAME problem

AChotrod

iTrader: (17)

Im reading the manual right now and says and shows to install it 6, 12, 3 oclock at 1 tdc on the compression stroke wich also puts #6 at the top.

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

I installed the cam with it looking EXACTLY like the picture on shbox's site that I linked to...specifically the one with the cam sprocket dot at the 12, crank sprocket dot at the 12, and the dowel pin at the 9, and I ensured cylinder #1 was at TDC. I checked, and re-checked the alignment for the exact reason that I didnt wanna take this thing apart again. I SWEAR I took pics, but I cant find the damn things...

I could see it being the opti, but not sure. Are there any other issues y'all can think of before hand that it could be? bad map, bad tps, etc...I wanna eliminate everything I can before I tear this thing apart...again...

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

Then why would shbox have that diagram up saying if #1 is at TDC it will be at the freaking 12/12/9??? It shouldnt matter how it is in there as long as it is in the right spot, and ss.slp.ls1 sent me that link from shbox's site

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

and please dont mistake my frustration, its not at you guys, or doubting you guys its the frustration of this not going right two freaking times...this time I SWORE I had it right...

JohnnyFormula

Let me ask you this...

If there is no Cam in the car, there is no compression stroke. #1 and #6 at TDC you choose which one is on it's compression stroke by installing the cam accordingly....


Right? Or am I way off base here?

AChotrod

iTrader: (17)

Well Im sure it matters, I dont know why the site says it like that. Was #1 on the compression stroke?
This is word for word from the manual
remove WP, remoove hub and balancer.
Position the #1 cylinder at TDC on the compression stroke. CAUTION once this has been done, do not turn the crank shaft untill the timing sprockets have been reinstalled.
Install... loop the chain over the camshaft sprocket untill the timing mark is in the 6 oclock position(see illustration)

That is with the crank sprocket mark at 12 with #1 on the compression stroke TDC

Someone correct me if Im wrong????

AChotrod

iTrader: (17)

Well you can see it if the heads are off that #1 is on the compression stroke and TDC. And yes there is a compression stroke its when the piston goes up not down

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

I had the heads off and watched #1 go to TDC on the compression stroke. it was coming up, and then I turned the crank a hare more...the piston did not move...that TDC. but that animation I got showed that when it was at TDC like that, the cam dot was at 12, crank dot was at 12, and the dowel was at the 9.

I mean look at it and you tell me from this animation that ss.slp.ls1 sent me from shbox's website, is that not what it is telling me???

http://shbox.com/1/cam_timing_ani.gif

JB_97ws6TA

iTrader: (6)

yes that is what it is telling you but it is awfully hard to judge if the dots are aligned if you are a cam sprocket apart which is why most people, myself included, install the cam in the #6 TDC position. There would be a smaller margin of error for the sprocket to perhaps be off a tooth or something like that.

AChotrod

iTrader: (17)

I saw the animation and cant really say, but look at both the links I posted plus Im reading the manual, the directions are what I said. Seems you put the cam 180 degrees backwards to me.

JohnnyFormula

I'm definatly not trying to be a dick. But seriously asking,

there is two upward movements of the piston in the 4 cycle engine, one for combustion and one for exhaust. So if there is no cam, and you put the piston at TDC on #1 there is no way to have a compression or an exhaust stroke, (well besides the crank sprocket)

Again not trying to be a dick... how do you know it's on Compression stroke and not exhaust stroke without a cam? It would seem to me (and that's not really saying much) that it all depends on how you put in the camshaft after that.

JohnnyFormula

Also as I read this post it sounds like to me that it's talking about when you change the gears and chain don't rotate any of the shafts until they are hooked up together again?