Bastard LTx Build Thread - For real this time :) (NOW WITH MOAR PICZ)
04-13-2015, 10:47 AM
#22
What kind of fuel pump, in-tank or sumped?
I really like my 80e, and I think weight wise its not much, ~40lb more than a 400. Lockup and OD are pretty legit.
But, I could have def gone 3.00 gearing and TH400 with no issue. In some cases I wish I did, 3.73s are sucky for my app.
I really like my 80e, and I think weight wise its not much, ~40lb more than a 400. Lockup and OD are pretty legit.
But, I could have def gone 3.00 gearing and TH400 with no issue. In some cases I wish I did, 3.73s are sucky for my app.
04-13-2015, 12:23 PM
#23
Greg at FTI has me a **** hair away from pulling the trigger on a glide w/9" SST stall...
Lol.
Am I crazy??? TH350, TH400, and Glide all share the same final ratio so cruising will be similar. Glide is basically like starting in 2nd gear in a TH400 so it may bog a tiny bit, but with the 4k+ stall I will be running anyway that's not a huge deal either. It is smaller, lighter, eats less power, and holds a ton more hp per dollar then a TH400...
Decisions, decisions...
Lol.
Am I crazy??? TH350, TH400, and Glide all share the same final ratio so cruising will be similar. Glide is basically like starting in 2nd gear in a TH400 so it may bog a tiny bit, but with the 4k+ stall I will be running anyway that's not a huge deal either. It is smaller, lighter, eats less power, and holds a ton more hp per dollar then a TH400...
Decisions, decisions...
Last edited by Puck; 04-13-2015 at 03:44 PM.
04-13-2015, 02:25 PM
#24
if you get the glide, you can forever use it for turbo or FI down the road or anything else. Like you said, a th3/4l65 become rebuild targets eventually based on power.
if you have a 4l80e, i'd go with it to get done more importantly. denmah has had good success with that valve body kit on his builds...
if you have a 4l80e, i'd go with it to get done more importantly. denmah has had good success with that valve body kit on his builds...
04-13-2015, 03:43 PM
#25
if you get the glide, you can forever use it for turbo or FI down the road or anything else. Like you said, a th3/4l65 become rebuild targets eventually based on power.
if you have a 4l80e, i'd go with it to get done more importantly. denmah has had good success with that valve body kit on his builds...
if you have a 4l80e, i'd go with it to get done more importantly. denmah has had good success with that valve body kit on his builds...
As long as I don't try to run 3.23s w/ a 3k stall behind a 400hp car like the classic car guys do, the first gear wont be too bad. A lot of glide horror stories are from mismatched combo's like that from people who only got one because they look cool on a build sheet and came in those cars from the factory. They need a lot of stall and a lot of gear to get moving...
The 80e is a giant beast of a trans but it is over $1,500 more then the TH400 setup, and in my case I won't see much street driving so I dont really NEED the extra gear or the lockup. He also said the more efficient glide will run quite a bit cooler then the TH400, even while lacking an OD and lockup.
I called on my lunch break, but they are ~40 minutes away so he invited me over to tour the shop and talk a bit more about all my options. Whats nice is that they supply race proven transmissions, converters, and drive shafts all in house so its a one-stop shop.
04-13-2015, 07:02 PM
#26
A powerglide will absolutely suck if you are running N/A with 600-650hp. Go launch your car in 2nd gear right now and let me know how that works, lol. That's what the 1st gear in a powerglide is like. They are meant for BIG power.
04-13-2015, 08:36 PM
#27
It's not optimum for right now, but if I spray or boost in the future I will just need a restall.
I don't think it will be as bad as most people think. They eat half as much hp as a TH400 and rev quicker. Car is 3200 but I can get it down to 3000-3100 pretty easily.
04-14-2015, 06:49 AM
#29
.Headed to FTI later today to talk more with Greg and see if he really thinks a glide is OK for only 650hp and 3100#'s. There are a few different first gear options besides the stock 1.76, so maybe that is what he was thinking...although that makes the shift dropoff bigger and negates one of the glide benefits in the first place...
Kind of hard decision since I'm just about on the border. Right now a built TH350 would probably be quickest, but not as reliable. If I make more power down the road though, then I'm into bigger trans territory.
04-14-2015, 04:56 PM
#31
Bit of an eye opener today at how different opinions can be compared to what you see on forums. I talked to three trans guys without mentioning any preference and being sure to mention power, weight, gearing, cam, driving habits, etc...two were admittedly from the same company, one was a competitor. All three said they would go with a Powerglide, hands down, for a car that is mostly for bracket racing and limited street duty. Consistency was the key.
One admitted the TH350 would likely be quicker for me but not last as long and wont be as consistent, especially if I spray in the future, and recommended a Glide. The other two both basically said the TH350 was too weak for frequent drag use at 600+hp, agreed that the TH400 is good for a 50/50 street strip car...but also recommended Glides in my case.
I reiterated my worries - asking if the car was too heavy (~3200lbs) and did not enough power for a glide (600-650) - and they all agreed that it won't be a problem. They have customer cars with similar power and weight that run Glides and are quicker then I could hope to be and still drive them to cruise ins and car meets. I basically was TRYING to get them to sell me a more expensive TH400 (came in looking at the Level 4.5 TH400 good to 900hp).
After touring the assembly line and seeing the employees working on transmissions from start to finish (everything from a stock rebuild 700r4 to a pro stock 3,000hp capable powerglide), and checking out the trick CNC machine where they custom make their own proprietary billet valve bodies and trans parts (cool as hell!), I put in my order.
Long story short, they are building me a fresh Lvl 3 PG good to 1200hp with trans brake and all the fixings short of an aftermarket case. Pairing it with a custom built billet SS8 8" non-lockup stall w/ CNCd stator and mechanical diode, built to flash between 5000-5200 at my power and weight (yikes. They said I need that much stall to get moving with the glide, especially at my power level and weight).
Long term goal is to dip in the 9's on motor...then maybe reflash the stall to tighten it up and hit it a 200 shot to see where the chips fall on the LT1 boards
.
Street car stuff
.
One admitted the TH350 would likely be quicker for me but not last as long and wont be as consistent, especially if I spray in the future, and recommended a Glide. The other two both basically said the TH350 was too weak for frequent drag use at 600+hp, agreed that the TH400 is good for a 50/50 street strip car...but also recommended Glides in my case.
I reiterated my worries - asking if the car was too heavy (~3200lbs) and did not enough power for a glide (600-650) - and they all agreed that it won't be a problem. They have customer cars with similar power and weight that run Glides and are quicker then I could hope to be and still drive them to cruise ins and car meets. I basically was TRYING to get them to sell me a more expensive TH400 (came in looking at the Level 4.5 TH400 good to 900hp).
After touring the assembly line and seeing the employees working on transmissions from start to finish (everything from a stock rebuild 700r4 to a pro stock 3,000hp capable powerglide), and checking out the trick CNC machine where they custom make their own proprietary billet valve bodies and trans parts (cool as hell!), I put in my order.
Long story short, they are building me a fresh Lvl 3 PG good to 1200hp with trans brake and all the fixings short of an aftermarket case. Pairing it with a custom built billet SS8 8" non-lockup stall w/ CNCd stator and mechanical diode, built to flash between 5000-5200 at my power and weight (yikes. They said I need that much stall to get moving with the glide, especially at my power level and weight).
Long term goal is to dip in the 9's on motor...then maybe reflash the stall to tighten it up and hit it a 200 shot to see where the chips fall on the LT1 boards
.Street car stuff
. Last edited by Puck; 04-16-2015 at 09:48 AM.
04-14-2015, 08:48 PM
#33
Cool you went with the glide, don't hear of too many uses of it outside of high hp boosted cars and older chevys(mostly impalas). Always interested in seeing people break away from the typical mold and really push the envelope. Its easy to play it safe and cookie cutter mod your car, takes real ambition and ***** to break away from the pack.
definitely a huge fan of your build.
definitely a huge fan of your build.
04-14-2015, 10:50 PM
#35
(sorry for the novel)
Both the glide and the stall are from FTI. Their company is the real deal. Stall was custom spec'd based on my cam specs, vehicle weight, estimated power, and gearing. They did not leave a single stone unturned and wanted to know EVERYTHING about my car, how I planned to drive it, and what kind of racing I did.
I was absolutely blown away by the tour of their shop, I had no idea they did so much from scratch in house. There were big blocks of billet aluminum on the CNC with a bin next to it churning out crazy in house designed billet valve bodies, balancing machines with employees hard at work perfectly balancing convertors, and people everywhere running around busy as hell. No less then 6 boxed and palletized transmissions were on the floor ready to be shipped out, and it looked like a mall on a Saturday - no joke. I wish I could have taken pictures but I did not want to be rude...I have been in a lot of different machine shops in my life but this one takes the cake. Smooth assembly line from start to finish, with some BIG DOLLAR stuff being worked on. He showed be a pair of billet case Glides that were going into 3,000hp rail cars and I think I jizzed myself.
Yea, I'll copy this thread there.
Thanks, I am getting really excited for this out of the box LTX build. I know its been years and I got bored with it multiple times since I started, but when all is said and done I did not pull any punches. Craig Gallant heads, Llyod Elliot specc'd solid roller race cam, max effort ported Supervic, 4150 Accel 1350cfm throttle body, 24x setup for lots of RPM, one of the best Powerglides money can buy, and a nasty *** 8" 5k stall. All done carefully over a long period of time with tons of research but still keeping a budget. I feel that on my budget, without winning the lotto I couldn't have done better.
I knew in the back of my mind that peak TQ would be north of 5k and warrant a bigass stall for the best times, but I always thought I would go with a 4200-4600 to pretend its streetable. I almost choked when he was strongly recommending the 5-5.2k 8" stall instead of the 4600 9", but I just grinned and said **** it, go for it. That's really what you need to get a ~3k-3.2k lb car moving with a glide, and a lot of the hate they get are from street cars with 3.23 gears, 3800lbs, and 500hp. Multiple different shops assured me that even with only 600-650hp and a 3100-3200lb car, with the right gear and stall my car will move the **** out with a glide - I just have to be willing to run the "big boy" stall and some nice gears to get her moving. 2nd gear in a TH400 is 1.48, which is still quite a bit softer then the ~1.76-1.82 (?) first gear of a PG so its not as bad as a lot of people may think. At least I will be able to dead hook and focus on the stall and shift points to hopefully get some quick and consistent ETs out of this old boat anchor LT1.
I was absolutely blown away by the tour of their shop, I had no idea they did so much from scratch in house. There were big blocks of billet aluminum on the CNC with a bin next to it churning out crazy in house designed billet valve bodies, balancing machines with employees hard at work perfectly balancing convertors, and people everywhere running around busy as hell. No less then 6 boxed and palletized transmissions were on the floor ready to be shipped out, and it looked like a mall on a Saturday - no joke. I wish I could have taken pictures but I did not want to be rude...I have been in a lot of different machine shops in my life but this one takes the cake. Smooth assembly line from start to finish, with some BIG DOLLAR stuff being worked on. He showed be a pair of billet case Glides that were going into 3,000hp rail cars and I think I jizzed myself
. Yea, I'll copy this thread there.
Cool you went with the glide, don't hear of too many uses of it outside of high hp boosted cars and older chevys(mostly impalas). Always interested in seeing people break away from the typical mold and really push the envelope. Its easy to play it safe and cookie cutter mod your car, takes real ambition and ***** to break away from the pack.
definitely a huge fan of your build.
definitely a huge fan of your build.
Thanks, I am getting really excited for this out of the box LTX build. I know its been years and I got bored with it multiple times since I started, but when all is said and done I did not pull any punches. Craig Gallant heads, Llyod Elliot specc'd solid roller race cam, max effort ported Supervic, 4150 Accel 1350cfm throttle body, 24x setup for lots of RPM, one of the best Powerglides money can buy, and a nasty *** 8" 5k stall. All done carefully over a long period of time with tons of research but still keeping a budget. I feel that on my budget, without winning the lotto I couldn't have done better.
I knew in the back of my mind that peak TQ would be north of 5k and warrant a bigass stall for the best times, but I always thought I would go with a 4200-4600 to pretend its streetable. I almost choked when he was strongly recommending the 5-5.2k 8" stall instead of the 4600 9", but I just grinned and said **** it, go for it. That's really what you need to get a ~3k-3.2k lb car moving with a glide, and a lot of the hate they get are from street cars with 3.23 gears, 3800lbs, and 500hp. Multiple different shops assured me that even with only 600-650hp and a 3100-3200lb car, with the right gear and stall my car will move the **** out with a glide - I just have to be willing to run the "big boy" stall and some nice gears to get her moving. 2nd gear in a TH400 is 1.48, which is still quite a bit softer then the ~1.76-1.82 (?) first gear of a PG so its not as bad as a lot of people may think. At least I will be able to dead hook and focus on the stall and shift points to hopefully get some quick and consistent ETs out of this old boat anchor LT1.
04-14-2015, 10:59 PM
#36
Now that I finalized my trans choice I will be emailing BP automotive to order a custom plug and play harness. Also adding a shifter to the "Still Need" section...Gate style (not ratchet) w/ trans brake button.
Last edited by Puck; 04-16-2015 at 09:36 AM.
04-16-2015, 09:32 AM
#37
Just have to measure the AN ports on the current fuel rails to see if I need to replace two, or all four of the current adapters on them. I think they were 10AN feed/8AN return and I will be running a smaller 8AN feed/6AN return setup so might be able to keep two of them.
Also still not positive where I am mounting my regulator, so going with plain straight adapters and hose ends for it for now. If I decide to put it in front of the rails I'll probably need a pair of 90*s, but I can just grab those later from the local speed shop.
Also still not positive where I am mounting my regulator, so going with plain straight adapters and hose ends for it for now. If I decide to put it in front of the rails I'll probably need a pair of 90*s, but I can just grab those later from the local speed shop.
04-17-2015, 11:28 AM
#38
Fuel setup, regulator, and Superdamper all purchased. Went with braided AN from the stock hardlines, 8AN into a dual 8AN Y-block feeding the back parallel, coming out 6AN on the front of the rails to an A1000 regulator then back through 6AN return. Plenty of fuel, although I will probably be around 90% DC on my injectors thats no biggie. That whole 80% "rule" is more for old crappy 80s injector technology that cant keep a proper spray pattern at high DC.
Still waiting on BP to email me back for my harness, then I basically just need carb hat and LS lid setup+chris1313 ram air.
I've got some -8AN straight to -10AN flared fuel rail adapters FS cheap if anyone needs. I downsized the feeds from -10AN to -8AN and don't need these monsters.
Still waiting on BP to email me back for my harness, then I basically just need carb hat and LS lid setup+chris1313 ram air.
I've got some -8AN straight to -10AN flared fuel rail adapters FS cheap if anyone needs. I downsized the feeds from -10AN to -8AN and don't need these monsters.
04-17-2015, 01:17 PM
#40
Working on my car again - my '93 Z28, with 95 LT1 block, converted SBC intake w/ 4150 TB, and LS ignition+computer. Little bit of everything lol. I am going to keep track of everything and post updates in this thread. Goal is to have it on an engine dyno within the next month or two for break-in, then put it in the car for a dyno tune not long after that. Hoping for ~625-650 on the engine dyno, although RWHP numbers won't be as impressive since I'm planning on a big and heavy 4L80e or TH400 with non-lockup stall. **EDIT** Going with a glide and 8" 5k stall .
The motor itself was finished almost 2 years ago but has been sitting on a stand after losing interest and a bunch of different things coming up. It sat for a long time just needing a computer system, damper, and fuel setup for the motor to be complete.
As far as parts, this is where I am at and what I still need:
***Updated 4/17/15***
Ordered and/or Arrived:
- 24x double roller setup w/ Billet timing cover
- D581 truck coils w/ brackets(will make something to reuse the factory ugly brackets for now.)
- 411 PCM
- LS Air Filter
- Built 1200hp capable t-braked Powerglide
- Custom FTI SS8 Billet 8" 5k stall
- Complete fuel system from hardlines back
- ATI Superdamper
Pending:
- Custom Harness. Going with BP automotive custom 24x harness. Emailed and awaiting response.
Still need:
- Carb hat. Looking at an Evo Pro, but if the price is right I'd take an Evo 1/procharger hat or similar. Not interested in those low profile POS's.
- Lid+base. looking for a Fast Toys 104mm lid. Tune will be SD so I want a nice big lid that will go straight to the carb hat, no MAF or anything in the way.
- Chris1313 Ram air. Had one on lock but seller didn't want to ship. Non-AC
- LT1 crossmember for TH350/PG with trans mount relocation
- Shifter. Gate style, not ratchet. Needs to have button on the **** for trans brake.
If anyone has any leads on anything in the "Still Need" section, please let me know!
Kind of excited to finally see what this thing can do.
.The motor itself was finished almost 2 years ago but has been sitting on a stand after losing interest and a bunch of different things coming up. It sat for a long time just needing a computer system, damper, and fuel setup for the motor to be complete.
As far as parts, this is where I am at and what I still need:
***Updated 4/17/15***
Ordered and/or Arrived:
- 24x double roller setup w/ Billet timing cover
- D581 truck coils w/ brackets(will make something to reuse the factory ugly brackets for now.)
- 411 PCM
- LS Air Filter
- Built 1200hp capable t-braked Powerglide
- Custom FTI SS8 Billet 8" 5k stall
- Complete fuel system from hardlines back
- ATI Superdamper
Pending:
- Custom Harness. Going with BP automotive custom 24x harness. Emailed and awaiting response.
Still need:
- Carb hat. Looking at an Evo Pro, but if the price is right I'd take an Evo 1/procharger hat or similar. Not interested in those low profile POS's.
- Lid+base. looking for a Fast Toys 104mm lid. Tune will be SD so I want a nice big lid that will go straight to the carb hat, no MAF or anything in the way.
- Chris1313 Ram air. Had one on lock but seller didn't want to ship. Non-AC
- LT1 crossmember for TH350/PG with trans mount relocation
- Shifter. Gate style, not ratchet. Needs to have button on the **** for trans brake.
If anyone has any leads on anything in the "Still Need" section, please let me know!
Kind of excited to finally see what this thing can do.
Well... That didn't take long! Stay on it Puckster!
