95 TA - The Beast

iTrader: (2)

I am doing a new buildup on my '95 Camaro LT1 convertible. It is getting a forged 383, 10:1CR, boosted with a Vortech S-Trim and Aftercooler setup, looking at 700-800hp at the flywheel.

My options pretty much look like either the Spec 3+ or the McLoed Street Twin (aluminum flywheel option). As a side note, the car will not be drag raced virtually at all, and will only see the track maybe once or twice a year, if even that, so it is primarily street driving.

Now, I know the Spec 3+ is just under half the cost of the Street Twin, but the kicker here is the wife will be driving this car as well (I also have a '95 TA that is supercharged and we take the kids on cruises as a family excursion during the summer, two kids in her car, two kids in mine). She has zero issues driving a Zoom HP (dual-kevlar), so I am wondering how are the manners of the Spec 3+?

Also, obviously, is it safe to assume the Spec 3+ will hold the power I will be making?

Honestly, I looked into other options and must say talking to Competition Clutches on the phone is a nightmare. They couldn't give me a straight answer on which clutch they make would be best suited to my application and thier HP holding ratings they were giving me for thier LT1 clutches were way off-base (as in they said thier dual kevlar will only hold 425-450hp, when I know for fact the Zoom dual-kevlar holds >550hp without issue as that was what I was making when I ran the car with a NA 383 setup), but thier description of thier dual-kevlar on thier website stated it will support 550hp for GM apps???

The only other company I could think of is Clutchnet, but I have not been able to find any feedback on thier clutch setups anywhere outside of a couple posts here, but that setup was not running high-hp like I will be...

Any and all input would be great...

95 TA - The Beast

iTrader: (2)

I also may add, the car will almost always have regular street tires on it, but if I switch to 17x11 rear wheels i will probably go with Nitto Drag Radials...

Again, much more concerned about holding power up top, as we both shift conservatively and don't beat on the cars...

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

The 3+ would be a perfect choice for this application. It is rated to over 900lb.-ft at the crank and is extremely drivable on the street. The effort is within 10% of the stock clutch and the engagement is as smooth as possible for a high-torque application due to the full-faced design of the disc. It can easily take track use too! Let me know if you have any further questions and I will be more than happy to assist you. Thanks,

SladeX

I just finished installing a SPEC 3+ clutch. I thought I had air in it or something, its so smooth and light on my foot compared to my previous Monster 3.5 and LS7.

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

Cool...I take it you are pleased! Thanks for the comments and support.

HSESWS6

iTrader: (3)

My SPEC 3+ held up to over a years worth of 9.6 second passes with 1.3X 60' behind a 383 LS1 with a 200 shot of N2O

BALLSS

with that kind of power my $02 would be the twin. A single disc like a 3+ will work but like single discs made with more aggressive disc material driveability on the street is somewhat compromised. The twin kit has organic disc material but has twice the mating surface. Like high stall TC's on automatics, street maners is a personal prefrence. what one would consider fine another may feel a aggressive disc sucks to drive on the street.

I also ran the ZOOM HP on my 383...did not last with track use but held OK on the street. Kevlar will glaze in stop/go traffic use.

pedal effort on a McLeod twin I drove was more than any single disc set up I have driven. Not bad but more. The new high power cars (camaro, stangs, etc) run a dual disc clutch IIRC.

ClutchNet may offer a disc like the 3+ or could make one. I run a CN now but it is a organic disc they made up for me using material no longer available. My track days are very limited now so it is OK but not the disc I would use if I went frequently. The PP mod for more clamp force is why, I feel, it holds as well as it does. SPEC also says they adjust the clamp force but did not explain how. CN did in detail and I assume SPEC and other companies who do modify the LT1PP do the same. I did find that CN builds a very good disc compared to other companies (spline, hub assembly)

so having replaced a few clutches and not making near the power you do...looking back I should have done a twin in the beginning and not looked back...YMMV :-)

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

*****, I am not sure what Twin you are referencing that has an organic disc material. None of our Super-Twin units use an Organic lining. Additionally, the Stage 3+ will have drivability similar to our Super-Twins. Have you ever owned one of our 3+ kits or driven one? If not, you really ought to give it a shot. As for information about our modifiations, though specifics of the changes we make are as secret as the colonel's recipe I have provided a link that evidences the increase's gained with our modification. See the 13th post for pictures and information from me.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-tr...-question.html

SladeX

I'm going to go with SPEC-01 on this one, the 3+ is near stock in feel and had 0 chatter from the get go.

To be honest, I thought I had air in the system or something was wrong with it because it felt so soft compared to the Tick + LS7 or Tick + Monster 3.5 I had previously.

On street, its a near dream to drive, clutch engagement is pretty soft feeling when going gear to gear. I tried shifting and letting the clutch "snap" closed and yeah it was grabbing hard. I drove on it for a good hour of street miles to keep up with my break in on the clutch. I've got probably 100 miles on it now of street driving/stop go.

BALLSS

Jeremy

I was refering to the McLeod Twin which in the attached link "appears" to have organic disc material

http://www.mcleodracing.com/images_products/5155.jpg

and yes I am familiar with the pics you noted in the link thread. We did speak by email about LT1 PP mods before and I understand SPECS position on explaining how you make this modification. I did further research on the machine you show in the pic and ellected to take another product.

No I have not driven a 3+ but did own a 2+ which for me did not last long. I am not bashing SPEC and have found your customer service to be top notch. I do not hold the same regard for your product but understand racing takes it's toll on any product.

In your own words driveability of a clutch is subjective to each person so my or your opinion can certainly differ. The more aggressive a disc material the better it holds but in turn wear on mating surfaces is higher as is driving charastics. There are trade off's.

For the OP making the kind of power he is my $02 would be a "twin" type clutch would be the "best". From there friction material comes into play between various manufacturers. Will the 3+ work, I would say yes but suspect it's lifespan would be shorter than a organic twin disc clutch and not be as smooth on engagement in street driving. Again my comments are subjective...YMMV :-)

SNLPerformance

iTrader: (15)

As you stated in the other post, you had a Tick Master with both the Monster and LS7 unlike the Spec. The Tick adds ~30% more pedal effort, so it's not a fair comparison. I know for a fact from bench testing that our Monster 11" and 12" Pressure Plates have less pedal pressure than a new Spec Super Single.

SladeX

Actually, I'm still using the tick! It's fairly valid comparison. Only the clutch has changed between the 3. I'd say the Monster was the stiffest, then the LS7 and the Spec. In all fairness though, I prefer the monster feel as you knew that thing wanted to grab, but it didn't chatter ever on me.

My preference is the harder effort, but I'll take a softer clutch these days as I do a lot more daily driving and stop and go than I used to.

I've tried out a buddies RAM clutch in his car and another with a centerforce. To be honest, those two felt stiffer than anything the monster+tick had. Both those guys had a stock master, though 1 guy made his adjustable.