Clutch is in, engagement early?
07-22-2005, 06:41 PM
#1
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Clutch is in, engagement early? Just got my Textralia in and install went fine...
It came with a new slave and I had a Mcleod adj master and was told to replace it with a stock unit (which I gladly did, not a big fan of the Mcleod).
I did not pre-bleed anything (after reading some now I wish I had)...
Anyway, after bleeding for a while the pedal pressure feels pretty soft, especially up top...and if I start the car everything is fine, I can get it into gear just fine.
However, when I let off the clutch pedal, it only takes about 1/2" release before it starts to grab. I am pretty sure this is way too early, but not positive??? Shouldnt it start to engage at least a few inches up (or even in the middle)???
Is this a bleeding issue?
It came with a new slave and I had a Mcleod adj master and was told to replace it with a stock unit (which I gladly did, not a big fan of the Mcleod).
I did not pre-bleed anything (after reading some now I wish I had)...
Anyway, after bleeding for a while the pedal pressure feels pretty soft, especially up top...and if I start the car everything is fine, I can get it into gear just fine.
However, when I let off the clutch pedal, it only takes about 1/2" release before it starts to grab. I am pretty sure this is way too early, but not positive??? Shouldnt it start to engage at least a few inches up (or even in the middle)???
Is this a bleeding issue?
07-22-2005, 07:38 PM
#2
https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-transmission/354030-clutch-break-question.html
If its going in and out of gear with out any trouble I would let it go for a litte bit and see if it gets better with break in.
If its going in and out of gear with out any trouble I would let it go for a litte bit and see if it gets better with break in.
07-24-2005, 08:39 AM
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I think a lot of it has to do with the clutch wearing. The clutch disc,pp and flywheel may only wear down a few thousandths but by the time you add in the leverage ratio of the pp springs on up to the pedal travel, you've gained way more distance.
As was explained to me by another fine member on this board, your pp has a leverage ratio(like a rocker arm). For instance with a rocker of 1.7 ratio, if you move the lifter .06" then by the time that movement goes through the rocker(.06 x 1.7) you'll be moving the valve .102". The pressure plate ratio is much higher though like around 6 or so depending on the manufacturer. So if your clutch wears say .03" then the pp fingers will move back toward the slave .18" (6 x .03). That's a difference you can definitely feel at the pedal as it WILL move the pedal engagement up.
As was explained to me by another fine member on this board, your pp has a leverage ratio(like a rocker arm). For instance with a rocker of 1.7 ratio, if you move the lifter .06" then by the time that movement goes through the rocker(.06 x 1.7) you'll be moving the valve .102". The pressure plate ratio is much higher though like around 6 or so depending on the manufacturer. So if your clutch wears say .03" then the pp fingers will move back toward the slave .18" (6 x .03). That's a difference you can definitely feel at the pedal as it WILL move the pedal engagement up.
07-24-2005, 08:53 AM
#6
Originally Posted by Dustin Butts
I think a lot of it has to do with the clutch wearing. The clutch disc,pp and flywheel may only wear down a few thousandths but by the time you add in the leverage ratio of the pp springs on up to the pedal travel, you've gained way more distance.
As was explained to me by another fine member on this board, your pp has a leverage ratio(like a rocker arm). For instance with a rocker of 1.7 ratio, if you move the lifter .06" then by the time that movement goes through the rocker(.06 x 1.7) you'll be moving the valve .102". The pressure plate ratio is much higher though like around 6 or so depending on the manufacturer. So if your clutch wears say .03" then the pp fingers will move back toward the slave .18" (6 x .03). That's a difference you can definitely feel at the pedal as it WILL move the pedal engagement up.
As was explained to me by another fine member on this board, your pp has a leverage ratio(like a rocker arm). For instance with a rocker of 1.7 ratio, if you move the lifter .06" then by the time that movement goes through the rocker(.06 x 1.7) you'll be moving the valve .102". The pressure plate ratio is much higher though like around 6 or so depending on the manufacturer. So if your clutch wears say .03" then the pp fingers will move back toward the slave .18" (6 x .03). That's a difference you can definitely feel at the pedal as it WILL move the pedal engagement up.
07-24-2005, 06:35 PM
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I went ahead and took the MC out and followed these instructions for bench bleeding it...
http://www.salug.org/~davidm/clutchbleed/
Props to Buschman for making that tutorial, I got a lot of air out of the system. I am going to hook the MC back up, but now I think I should bleed the slave before I do right???? I dont want to introduce more air into the MC when I hook it up to the slave...the MC is nice and solid now...
http://www.salug.org/~davidm/clutchbleed/
Props to Buschman for making that tutorial, I got a lot of air out of the system. I am going to hook the MC back up, but now I think I should bleed the slave before I do right???? I dont want to introduce more air into the MC when I hook it up to the slave...the MC is nice and solid now...
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07-25-2005, 08:54 PM
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Well, I bench bled the **** out of the mc and then bled it again after hooking it up to the slave with the MityVac like I said above and I still have a soft pedal and it engages right off the floor...
I can shift through gears fine, its a little stiff getting it into the gear but doesnt really require force...
However, I got on it and got the rpms high and my idea was just to shift out of gear and into neutral. Well, when I did this, the pedal went dead and I had to pull it back up. This is pissing me off...any more ideas?
I can shift through gears fine, its a little stiff getting it into the gear but doesnt really require force...
However, I got on it and got the rpms high and my idea was just to shift out of gear and into neutral. Well, when I did this, the pedal went dead and I had to pull it back up. This is pissing me off...any more ideas?
07-26-2005, 06:49 AM
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Do you guys have your braided steel pressure line(that runs from the MC to the slave) routed away from the exhaust? Also you need to insulate it to protect it from heat.
Your problems definitely are related to the MC somehow, I believe. When you press the clutch pedal and it gets stuck to the floor, that indicates a pressure loss in the system. If it was the slave there would be external leakage. So it must be an internal leak and it has to be in the MC. Put the McLeod MC back in.
Your problems definitely are related to the MC somehow, I believe. When you press the clutch pedal and it gets stuck to the floor, that indicates a pressure loss in the system. If it was the slave there would be external leakage. So it must be an internal leak and it has to be in the MC. Put the McLeod MC back in.
07-26-2005, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Dustin Butts
Do you guys have your braided steel pressure line(that runs from the MC to the slave) routed away from the exhaust? Also you need to insulate it to protect it from heat.
Your problems definitely are related to the MC somehow, I believe. When you press the clutch pedal and it gets stuck to the floor, that indicates a pressure loss in the system. If it was the slave there would be external leakage. So it must be an internal leak and it has to be in the MC. Put the McLeod MC back in.
Your problems definitely are related to the MC somehow, I believe. When you press the clutch pedal and it gets stuck to the floor, that indicates a pressure loss in the system. If it was the slave there would be external leakage. So it must be an internal leak and it has to be in the MC. Put the McLeod MC back in.
07-26-2005, 03:23 PM
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OK I solved my problem, but not with the P.O.S. stock master cylinder. I bench bled my old Mcleod which I thought I was told not to use by Andy at A&A. I am not sure if I heard that it is not necessary to use it or if you SHOULD NOT use it, but after I installed the Mcleod I got a nice stiff pedal all the way from the top down and my engagement was TOO HIGH NOW.
With the stock mc my engagement was right off the floor. So all I did was adjust it a few times and now my engagement is right where I want it about half way up. If it changes, then I can just re-adjust it.
I was always told the stock mc is way better than the Mcleod, but I beg to differ in this situation. A lot of people are having bleeding issues and soft pedals with the stock mc and all I can say is...after hooking up the Mcleod, I now have a nice firm pedal and engagement is wherever I want it to be. And thats what matters!
With the stock mc my engagement was right off the floor. So all I did was adjust it a few times and now my engagement is right where I want it about half way up. If it changes, then I can just re-adjust it.
I was always told the stock mc is way better than the Mcleod, but I beg to differ in this situation. A lot of people are having bleeding issues and soft pedals with the stock mc and all I can say is...after hooking up the Mcleod, I now have a nice firm pedal and engagement is wherever I want it to be. And thats what matters!
