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Old 01-11-2011, 01:29 AM   #1
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Default Started car without any oil?? Damages?

Welll short and simple got into an accident and did not realize what the damage was to the car did not see oil or anything leaking around tried starting the car and it fired up and it knocked horribly. Well turns out the front of the oil pan completely broke so all the oil was gone what damage could have possibly been done? Car ran for about 2 3 seconds tops and it was immediately killed. Could bearings have been shot or ? I'm assumming there was still bits of oil residue on all the bearings so 2 or 3 seconds of just starting it up couldn't have caused that much harm right? What should I be looking for while I replace the oil pan. Im hoping no major damaged occurred. Thanks for the help in advance.
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Old 01-11-2011, 02:49 AM   #2
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If it's only 2-3 seconds and there isn't another underlying issue within the motor it should be fine. If it had just happened then there was still some oil on the engine parts. Even if it hadn't just happened you should be fine, when you first start a cold engine there isn't oil coating the parts, granted it's only for a moment. Think of 2-3 seconds as like 50 cold starts.
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Old 01-11-2011, 03:06 AM   #3
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Agreed with the above post. 2-3 seconds only, no revving, you should be fine. On second thought, how's the rest of the car, seeing you were in an accident and all?
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Old 01-11-2011, 03:55 AM   #4
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No oil wouldn't hurt, but my guess is the accident did as it's knocking. I would be more worried about having sucked up dirt and **** with the pan ripped off than I would about running with no oil for a few seconds. The only time no oil for a few seconds hurts is when your running WOT.
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Old 01-11-2011, 06:36 AM   #5
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Well as long as the engine can retain oil, i would refill with some straight weight, run until warm, then flush and re fill (change filter too). Make sure the oil pan is clean and inspect the oil.

If you see any shiney glint then thats bearings....
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Old 01-11-2011, 06:45 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gocartone View Post
No oil wouldn't hurt, but my guess is the accident did as it's knocking. I would be more worried about having sucked up dirt and **** with the pan ripped off than I would about running with no oil for a few seconds. The only time no oil for a few seconds hurts is when your running WOT.
Um...NO. I'm not gonna touch most of what you said, but chances are the knocking has NOTHING to do with the motor being hurt from the wreck other than the oil pan.

OP, the sound you probably heard was a combination of little/no oil on the bearings, dry lifters, etc. It might be ok, but I'd expect the worst and hope for the best. 2-3 seconds CAN kill it. Maybe not right away, but soon enough, it can. Could be 10 miles, or 1000 miles, can do harm though.
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Old 01-11-2011, 08:09 AM   #7
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I typically wouldn't think that 2-3 seconds with no oil would hurt an engine but the fact that you said it started knocking is what scares me. Maybe it ran longer than you thought....? Either way, get a new oil pan and see what happens. Hopefully the motor is fine.
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Old 01-11-2011, 08:20 AM   #8
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OP, the sound you probably heard was a combination of little/no oil on the bearings, dry lifters, etc. It might be ok, but I'd expect the worst and hope for the best. 2-3 seconds CAN kill it. Maybe not right away, but soon enough, it can. Could be 10 miles, or 1000 miles, can do harm though.[/quote]


I agree. I have heard cars start fresh after doing an oil change make a "knocking" type noise which is usually the clacking of a dry oil pump for a couple seconds.
Thats usually the people that dont fill thier oil filter with oil before putting the new one in.

You should be ok
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Old 01-11-2011, 08:26 AM   #9
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^Old Mitubishi 2.2L motors used in many DSM type cars were notorius for blowing bearings if the filter was not pre filled.

In almost every case, if I can prefill or prelube the filter I do then helps with not having no oil starts. Also when building motors I always prime the oiling system before the inital start since there is so much to do while the engine is running for the first time.
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Old 01-11-2011, 09:12 AM   #10
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If you are running a good quality synthetic such as royal purple of schaeffer 9000 that has a good base oil, you can run your engine for quite a while with no oil in it, just because of the lubricating properties that a good oil has, if you are running garbage oil such as Pennzoil or Quaker State, the lubricating properties are completely different and 2 seconds can scar bearings, i just took a lubrication class about 3 weeks ago for work and they did oil analysis and lubrication demonstrations and all sorts of crap for my work and it was amazing how completely different oils were, all i can say is after that class royal purple will be the only oil i ever use, and no royal purple wasnt the one putting the class on haha.
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Old 01-11-2011, 12:08 PM   #11
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If Pennzoil and Quaker State are so bad, why has it been used in millions of cars for thousands of miles without any issues. I think you're over exagerating about the difference between those oils and Royal Purple. Besides I've heard a lot more bad things about Royal Purple than all the other oils out there, so I wouldn't put it my lawnmower let alone my car.
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Old 01-11-2011, 02:54 PM   #12
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To OP, if it really was 2-3 sec, I would say it should be fine. If you don't prime (fill) the oil filter when doing an oil change, you'll hear the knocking sound until the oil is sucked through the filter, usually for 2-5 sec. It is not a HEAVY, "horrible" knock, though. Some people (esp lube shops/dealer) rarely (never!) prime the filter and the motors run fine for 100's of thousands of miles soo... As for your "horrible" knocking, could it have been something bent/broken (y pipe, accessory/alt etc) banging about?
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Old 01-11-2011, 03:08 PM   #13
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I wonder if anyone in this thread has ever taken an engine apart. I've taken stuff apart thats sat for 20+ years and the bearings still had oil on them, lifters still had oil in them.

To me it's pretty obvious that the damaged pan or pieces of it is probably touching the crank and making the noise.

You want to see my point? When you take the old pan off to put a new one on, take a rod cap off. I guarantee the bearing isn't dry, it'll have about the same amount of oil on it as a new engine would have assembly lube on it. Thats even after you ran it 2-3, even 10 seconds.
And if I'm wrong post a picture.
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Old 01-11-2011, 03:26 PM   #14
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^ Def a possibility. I tend to agree about the oil still being in the bearings and not being "dry" after the oil leaked/drained out.
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Old 01-11-2011, 06:51 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jays_SSZ28 View Post
I wonder if anyone in this thread has ever taken an engine apart. I've taken stuff apart thats sat for 20+ years and the bearings still had oil on them, lifters still had oil in them.

To me it's pretty obvious that the damaged pan or pieces of it is probably touching the crank and making the noise.

You want to see my point? When you take the old pan off to put a new one on, take a rod cap off. I guarantee the bearing isn't dry, it'll have about the same amount of oil on it as a new engine would have assembly lube on it. Thats even after you ran it 2-3, even 10 seconds.
And if I'm wrong post a picture.
I agree, for people that fill the oil filter with oil your just wasting your time down there.
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Old 01-11-2011, 07:12 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooMuchMoney View Post
I agree, for people that fill the oil filter with oil your just wasting your time down there.
I do fill my filter with oil BTW.
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Old 01-11-2011, 07:14 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jays_SSZ28 View Post
I wonder if anyone in this thread has ever taken an engine apart. I've taken stuff apart thats sat for 20+ years and the bearings still had oil on them, lifters still had oil in them.

To me it's pretty obvious that the damaged pan or pieces of it is probably touching the crank and making the noise.

You want to see my point? When you take the old pan off to put a new one on, take a rod cap off. I guarantee the bearing isn't dry, it'll have about the same amount of oil on it as a new engine would have assembly lube on it. Thats even after you ran it 2-3, even 10 seconds.
And if I'm wrong post a picture.


Thats a good point depending on where the pan was broken and how bad it was broke the pickup might still be in oil and the crank was scraping on the bent/broken pan.
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Old 01-11-2011, 07:16 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jays_SSZ28 View Post
I do fill my filter with oil BTW.
It dose not hurt to, its just your wasting your time.
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Old 01-11-2011, 07:40 PM   #19
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It dose not hurt to, its just your wasting your time.
No...your not. At all. Cold/dry starts are where most engine wear comes from. Its called shearing. Its not a good thing, obviously.
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Old 01-11-2011, 07:43 PM   #20
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Quote:
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No...your not. At all. Cold/dry starts are where most engine wear comes from. Its called shearing. Its not a good thing, obviously.
I agree with the cold/dry starts but I still think the whole oil in your oil filter is a myth....dose anyone have any proof on this.
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Old 01-11-2011, 07:43 PM
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