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I have an '02 V8 Camaro I got about a year ago. It is not passing emissions testing (Utah valley) because of missing catalytic converters and a missing air injector. The previous owner replaced the exhaust system from the exhaust manifolds on back, but apparently didn't put in an cats. I am trying to figure out what the simplest and cheapest solution is to get it ready to pass.
1) I have the original air injector, cats, manifolds and piping. I've talked to a few mechanics and they say they can put back in the original manifolds with the original cats, and connect to the aftermarket catback exaust. That's going to cost around $1000 in labor. (With new OEM cats it was going to be ~2000.) So far this seems to be the only option.
2) When the car was tuned, they must've disabled the secondary O2 sensors (after the cats) because they aren't connected to anything. They weren't sure what that would require. Will that be an issue? Can I just reenenable the sensors once they're installed, and the cats are in place?
Any advice, or direction on things to research would be appreciated.
Do you have an actual sniffer test, or is it just visual?
If its just visual buy some fake cats (http://www.frozenboost.com/dsm-inter...24333c97645f5a) in whatever size you need and have them welded or slipped in to your current y-pipe.
Going back to the stock stuff you will be losing a significant amount of power and sound.
You could also buy some real aftermarket cats to put on that setup as well, although that will be more expensive than the fake ones.
I'd rather put real ones in, because they may well use a sniffer. They also check the O2 sensors before and after the cats. I'd be happy to put in aftermarket cats as well, if I can afford it. The biggest problem here is I don't have the equipment or know how to do this myself. Mechanics are wanting to charge me ~$1000 just to put the originals back in. I've got to do something to make it legal again.
How much would aftermarket cats with better flow cost?
Are they legal? How much should a mechanic charge just to weld them in, if I buy them myself (or use the originals)?
I'd rather put real ones in, because they may well use a sniffer. They also check the O2 sensors before and after the cats. I'd be happy to put in aftermarket cats as well, if I can afford it. The biggest problem here is I don't have the equipment or know how to do this myself. Mechanics are wanting to charge me ~$1000 just to put the originals back in. I've got to do something to make it legal again.
How much would aftermarket cats with better flow cost?
Are they legal? How much should a mechanic charge just to weld them in, if I buy them myself (or use the originals)?
they should be bolt in part of an aftermarket y-pipe
Nothing you do with the current setup is going to be "legal" if there is a strict visual inspection in your state. You will fail with LT headers and relocated cats. You would have to use shorty headers or stock manifolds, and then cats in the factory location. LT headers move the cats further downstream, and this is not emissions legal in a strict state with visual inspections.
If it's just a sniffer test, you can simply install aftermarket cats into the current Y-pipe. If there is also an OBD scan test, then you'll have to make sure that the previous owner had the tuning done in such a way as to keep the SES off but not disable the rear O2 DTCs entirely, so that they will still flip to 'ready' status. You would need an OBD scanner to verify this, but if you don't have to take a scan test then this part doesn't matter.
I've just been checking here
As far as I can find there is nothing in the inspections procedure that requires them to check that the cats are in the same place. That may be technically required EPA regulations, but I think it won't matter for my states inspections.
For newer cars (1996->) the test mainly consists of an OBDII test. All the flags must be set to 'ready'.
My plan is to install aftermarket cats after the LT headers, and hook the AIR system back up - I'll just connect into the pipes just before the new cats. At that point I should be in compliance (according to the link above).
Questons:
1. Will the cats still get hot enough to work properly placed after the headers?
2. Prev. owner disable the secondary O2 sensors I believe. To get through the OBDII testing, what do I need to do? Do I just take it to an tuning place, and ask them to re enable the O2 sensors? How much should they charge for that? Is it something I can do myself?
3. Any other problems I may run into here?
There are really only a few alternatives: 1. Reinstall the stock system. Problem solved. 2. Find a tuner or buy a tuning program and set everything to pass OBDII (no sniffer) 3. Do #2, install aftermarket cats and rear O2's and hope for the best (sniffer).
There are really only a few alternatives: 1. Reinstall the stock system. Problem solved. 2. Find a tuner or buy a tuning program and set everything to pass OBDII (no sniffer) 3. Do #2, install aftermarket cats and rear O2's and hope for the best (sniffer).
I'm going to go for options 2 and 3 first. If that doesn't work I'll go back to stock. Now, I would be happy to get a tuning program and do that myself... but is that plausible? Will the program read in the current settings and let me change just what I want and nothing else? I'm comfortable with microchip programming in general, but don't know anything about car tuning yet.
Questons:
1. Will the cats still get hot enough to work properly placed after the headers?
Yes, they should.
2. Prev. owner disable the secondary O2 sensors I believe. To get through the OBDII testing, what do I need to do? Do I just take it to an tuning place, and ask them to re enable the O2 sensors? How much should they charge for that? Is it something I can do myself?
If there is currently no check engine light then you are good to go. If the previous owner had the rear 02s tuned out, then the computer automatically thinks they are working fine.
3. Any other problems I may run into here?
Only thing I can think of is fitment of the cats. There will be some cutting and welding required with your setup, and make sure the cats are small enough not to hit the floor board of the car when installed.
If there is currently no check engine light then you are good to go. If the previous owner had the rear 02s tuned out, then the computer automatically thinks they are working fine.
This is not necessarily true. If the previous tune was done in such a way that shut the DTCs off entirely for the rear O2s, then those codes will never flip to 'ready/complete'. The proper way would be to leave the test/DTC "on" but then change the SES to Type X/off. If the car came from a location that doesn't have any kind of testing, then they may not have been concerned with tuning in such a way as to ensure all the DTC tests would reach a "ready" status. Some states will allow a pass with one or two 'not ready' for various model years, in IL we can have two for '96-'00 cars and one for '01+ cars.
Yea, on second thought, I think I'm going to have to remove the LT headers anyway to install ports for the air pump if I want to make them (mostly) legal. So for now, I'll just put the stock ones on so I can pass emissions.
I've already failed the check once, and the reason given was failing the OBDII test. I'm assuming they just set the sensors to off or something. So, if I understand I'll need to get a new tune (I can't just renable them?) I've looked at software to do so and it's pretty expensive. If I go to a tuning shop, how much would they charge me if all I really want is to get the sensors reenabled?
Also, when I replace the headers with the stock manifold, do I need a new gasket (or anything else)? Or am I good to go with everything that's already there?
So if the only thing you failed was the OBD scan test, then perhaps they aren't even doing a visual inspection or a sniffer. If that's the case, then you don't actually need cats or an AIR system to pass, you just need the proper tuning to allow the DTCs to flip to 'ready' without commanding a MIL for the missing equipment.
Full custom dyno tunes are usually around $450-550, but many shops offer "basic tune" services that will deal with things like codes and other simple parameters for a cheaper fee - usually like $150-200 or so. Even a mail order tune would be fine for something like this.
So if the only thing you failed was the OBD scan test, then perhaps they aren't even doing a visual inspection or a sniffer. If that's the case, then you don't actually need cats or an AIR system to pass, you just need the proper tuning to allow the DTCs to flip to 'ready' without commanding a MIL for the missing equipment.
Full custom dyno tunes are usually around $450-550, but many shops offer "basic tune" services that will deal with things like codes and other simple parameters for a cheaper fee - usually like $150-200 or so. Even a mail order tune would be fine for something like this.
I agree with the first paragraph of this. If that's the only thing you failed, start there. I wouldn't waste the time and especially the money making the car less powerful if you might not need to.
I took my truck to a local tuner to have him tune the cats out on my truck so I wouldn't have to look at the SES light. Doing only that an no other tuning, he only charged me $40. Of course that varies from shop to shop.
As noted above, I would start with the tune to flip the DTC's to ready without commanding a MIL for the missing components. If there's only an OBD II test, that should solve the problem.
If they do a visual inspection or actually measure emissions via "sniffer", it's going to take more.
In Georgia, they run the OBD II test and do a visual inspection to confirm converters are on the car (unless you know a tech that's blind). One solution here is a tune for the proper DTC settings and the "Frozen Boost" converters.
Just in case anyone is interested who stumbles on this, they did do a visual inspection ( I'm in Utah valley). I ended up putting the stock cats back on for the time being to get through inspections. It took some effort because it was the first work on a car I've done, but I got through it all right. Learned a bunch in the process
It's been a few months, but my car is starting to run not well. It wasn't as good after the conversion, obviously, but not terrible either. Now it is giving 'multiple cylinder misfire' codes, and sometimes stalls when th rpms get low (like when coming to a stop, or into a slow turn).
Is this because I need to get a new tune? (Or go back to the stock one) I haven't done that yet.
Or is there likely something more going on?
I suspected the first - but it wasn't really that bad after I first switched things over, so I'm not sure. I know the O2 sensors are a lot closer now, so it I know it won't be optimal without re tuning, but I wasn't sure how big of a difference that would make.
06-01-2015, 06:05 PM
Need to put cats back in 2002 Camaro 
