going to be spraying a 300 in three stages need some advice
01-05-2009, 05:52 PM
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going to be spraying a 300 in three stages need some advice ive got my intake coming this week from nitrous outlet and its plumbed for 3 stages. i have 2 window switches a two stage and a one stage to control the nitrous and have a msd timing twister to pull the timing. should i run my regular na tune and then pull timing accordingly or should i keep a seperate nitrous tune for the car when its going to be on spray and just load it before racing. the car is a steet/strip car, but not a daily at all. am im not planning on running the 300 all the time, just when i need it, as its primarily a street setup.
sorry for the long paragraph but im in the woods here and need some help figuring this out. thaks guys
sorry for the long paragraph but im in the woods here and need some help figuring this out. thaks guys
01-05-2009, 09:52 PM
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its on 3 stages because its mostly a street car. and if i only need a 100 to beat someone thats all ill use, but if i need 300 then i can use all three stages
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01-06-2009, 08:20 AM
#8
There are absolutely so many benifits to going triple stage and thus why I do it also. Just think about adding another 150hp up top where you can safely add it with out skyrocketing torque. It's a way to be quicker/faster with any given motor compared to an all in one off the line hit. why do think the big daddy racers run 4 and 5 stages. Of course traction is another good point, as is saving our running gear. Also, we may not want to run a 350 hit everytime time out and just need a 150 to crush some Mustang, lol (I like Stangs). The multi stage ends up with curves like the turbo(s).
On the tune, because I assume your wet? You'll need to tune for fuel one stage at a time for the accumulative three. So as you add each kit, the a/f ratio will change. So we need to be carefull that any one kit on it's own is still a safe a/f ratio.
The HP Tuner now with Real Time Tuning it is so damn easy to have a dedicated nitrous tune for the wet hits. It takes a second or two to change, so yes you certainly can go the two complete seperate tunes. Myself, although I am all dry and makes this more easy to do, it will be 100% all in the same tune.
Robert
On the tune, because I assume your wet? You'll need to tune for fuel one stage at a time for the accumulative three. So as you add each kit, the a/f ratio will change. So we need to be carefull that any one kit on it's own is still a safe a/f ratio.
The HP Tuner now with Real Time Tuning it is so damn easy to have a dedicated nitrous tune for the wet hits. It takes a second or two to change, so yes you certainly can go the two complete seperate tunes. Myself, although I am all dry and makes this more easy to do, it will be 100% all in the same tune.
Robert
01-06-2009, 10:13 PM
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There are absolutely so many benifits to going triple stage and thus why I do it also. Just think about adding another 150hp up top where you can safely add it with out skyrocketing torque. It's a way to be quicker/faster with any given motor compared to an all in one off the line hit. why do think the big daddy racers run 4 and 5 stages. Of course traction is another good point, as is saving our running gear. Also, we may not want to run a 350 hit everytime time out and just need a 150 to crush some Mustang, lol (I like Stangs). The multi stage ends up with curves like the turbo(s).
On the tune, because I assume your wet? You'll need to tune for fuel one stage at a time for the accumulative three. So as you add each kit, the a/f ratio will change. So we need to be carefull that any one kit on it's own is still a safe a/f ratio.
The HP Tuner now with Real Time Tuning it is so damn easy to have a dedicated nitrous tune for the wet hits. It takes a second or two to change, so yes you certainly can go the two complete seperate tunes. Myself, although I am all dry and makes this more easy to do, it will be 100% all in the same tune.
Robert
On the tune, because I assume your wet? You'll need to tune for fuel one stage at a time for the accumulative three. So as you add each kit, the a/f ratio will change. So we need to be carefull that any one kit on it's own is still a safe a/f ratio.
The HP Tuner now with Real Time Tuning it is so damn easy to have a dedicated nitrous tune for the wet hits. It takes a second or two to change, so yes you certainly can go the two complete seperate tunes. Myself, although I am all dry and makes this more easy to do, it will be 100% all in the same tune.
Robert
Most of the big guys are running 2 stages with anywhere from 150-250 on a plate and then bring in another 250-400 on a second stage on a direct port. This will be my plan.
01-06-2009, 11:07 PM
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like i said i have it so that if all i need to beat the guy im racing is a 100 shot then thats all ill use. if i need a 200 then i can hit it with a 200, and if i need the 300 or more i can go that high. my motor is built for 400 shot, but i think it will be almost impossible to get 400 to hook on the street even in three stages.
so my reasoning for having 3 stages isnt just to keep cylinder pressure down, but to have the option of running three different sized shots without having to re-jet anyhting
so my reasoning for having 3 stages isnt just to keep cylinder pressure down, but to have the option of running three different sized shots without having to re-jet anyhting
01-07-2009, 11:22 AM
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thanks robert. are there any more guys out there running big shots on multiple stages? how is everyone else running their big hits?
bring the car off the line on the 175 and hit the 225 like .8 seconds into the run...... trying to keep it on the wheelie bars for like 200 feet...
01-07-2009, 12:07 PM
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sweet, how are you going to be running the spray? what window switches, timing retards etc?
your the guy with the blue lt1 up at sonoma right outlawz? i think i met you during pinks all out
your the guy with the blue lt1 up at sonoma right outlawz? i think i met you during pinks all out
01-07-2009, 08:46 PM
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sweet, how are you going to be running the spray? what window switches, timing retards etc?
your the guy with the blue lt1 up at sonoma right outlawz? i think i met you during pinks all ou
your the guy with the blue lt1 up at sonoma right outlawz? i think i met you during pinks all ou
My FAST XFI system controls all my stages. built in window switch for the whole system regardless of stage since if you drop below or go above RPM window it will shut off the entire deal. Once stage 1 commences it starts a timer for stage 2,3,4..... All it does is ground the relays you have connected to the solenoids.... it also has built in timing control for each stage. it just doesn't do the addition. If you put in 8 degrees retard for stage 1 and 8 degrees retard for stage 2 it WILL NOT pull 16 degrees out. It'll pull 8.... You gotta put Stage 1: 8, Stage 2: 16, etc...... simple but some ppl can **** anything up...... that's ONE thing you will not wanna screw up...
XFI is a great engine mgmt system for nitrous guys.... BS3 is better for forced induction but XFI rules hands down for nitrous.... it'll control 4 stages...all you do is floor it and hold on. nothing connected to your throttle linkage either like WOT switches and ****.... it all works off whatever sensor you tell it..... hell you could have the nitrous come on when your coolant temperature reaches 199 degrees if you wanted. LOL....
01-12-2009, 07:40 AM
#18
like i said i have it so that if all i need to beat the guy im racing is a 100 shot then thats all ill use. if i need a 200 then i can hit it with a 200, and if i need the 300 or more i can go that high. my motor is built for 400 shot, but i think it will be almost impossible to get 400 to hook on the street even in three stages.
so my reasoning for having 3 stages isnt just to keep cylinder pressure down, but to have the option of running three different sized shots without having to re-jet anyhting
so my reasoning for having 3 stages isnt just to keep cylinder pressure down, but to have the option of running three different sized shots without having to re-jet anyhting
Then you will need a few different tunes for timing pull curves. It will get complicated fast, been there done that. One of the reasons that my 3rd stage wet was removed and replaced with a dry is/was tuning is easier with the dry when you get this complicated, IMO.
Now, this time around, what i am doing is running the MicroEdge for stage 1 and 2, then a Pills style MSD WS on a button for stage 3. For fueling and timing pull I am using dual Interfaces. What is cool about the Interfaces is it's accumulative in timing, what that means is, you can set your timing pull for each kit separately and when you run both kits the timing pull is added together, it's all automatic and does not effect the n/a tune. This can be used for wet hits also, though I am in beta testing right now.
Same with fueling it's cumulative or singular and only comes into effect when spraying so it doesn't effect the n/a tune either (Dry all stages so just for clarification).
All three of my stages are being run off the stock fuel tank. i have added a "Parallel" fuel system. It has an arm switch, then it is controlled by a RPM activation SW and only comes on when the main N2O arm switch is activated. No more watered down fuel mix in my big dollar motor. it is also set-up to be able to drain tank with the in-line Bosch in matter of a couple minutes and then add the race gas. when done racing, same thing a couple minutes and race gas is in can and ready for the next week end. The premise of this system is, why not use the existing fuel tank for a stand alone fuel system? That way we will have 100% race gas when running a 300/350 shot.
It's late here and i probably jumped around and made no sense, but maybe a little, lol. One thing to note, this is not a wet vs dry, lol, just saying how I am doing it and some of the hurdles we must look out for.
