glennhl

Hey, I've been searching and haven't found an exact answer. If I put a dry kit on my car (see mods and power below), how much power can I add without upgrading the fuel pump or the injectors (both are stock)? Also, what dry kit do you guys recommend?

glennhl

Also, do I need to get my car retuned and get a retard **** for the timing?

camaroextra

iTrader: (10)

most people will run a 150 shot,
i had a similar question a while ago, read this thread its not that long https://ls1tech.com/forums/nitrous-oxide/418060-whats-biggest-i-can-juice-my-02-z28-wet-dry.html

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

Surely do not try a 150 dry with your current power setup, you will be about maxing out those injectors. You could do a 150 Wet if you get a fuel pump to be safe, but I would not do a 150 dry, even stock a 150 dry is not a good idea.
I would try a 75 dry shot and see how much duty cycle the injectors are at, and if its not too much you may want to try the 100. A tune always helps as well as pulling a little timimg while on the spray.

227Hawk

iTrader: (1)

My opinion is change to 30 lb. or 42. add a pump and then hit it w/ a 150.
You're pretty much @ max.duty now.
Hawk

glennhl

OK, so if I want to be very conservative, use a 75 dry, otherwise either get a fuel pump and a wet kit or get a fuel pump and 42 injectors and use a dry kit. Does that sound right?

Matt@HSW

iTrader: (14)

Basically. If possible (that is if you go with a dry kit) watch the injector duty cycle. If you go with either (wet or dry) try to watch the fuel pressure. If it starts to drop get out of it and look into a new fuel pump.

Matt

NitrousDirect

iTrader: (1)

If you want that kind of power go with a wet kit it's that simple. If you want over 150hp you'll need to look into upgrading your fuel pump. We'd be happy to answer any questions you may have and explain anything further in depth, feel free to call, pm, or email

NemeSS

iTrader: (127)

eventually u will upgrade to a wet kit once u see how ur car books with a 100+ shot and want to use more juice.
get a better pump and some bigger injectors like 30's,preferably a tune also(FOR DRY)
u might as well just go with a wet kit and ditch the dry kit
or just stay consevative with a dry kit -GL-

glennhl

Since I have a 01 with 28 lph injectors, would going to 30 really help that much? I would really like a 100 dry kit if I could do that without a new fuel pump or injectors. Who makes the kit that you can dial out timing?

Matt@HSW

iTrader: (14)

I wouldn't suggest it if you don't have a way of looking at your duty cycle. Let's say for the time being that you’re at 380 RWHP. Add on the 100 shot and you pick up a full 100 at the wheels. That puts you at 480 RWHP on the stock injectors and pump. A set of 30 lb injectors will act more like a set of 34 lb injectors on the LS1. You could use a LS1 Timing Tuner to take out timing (and it also has a window switch). If you go with a dry shot a few degrees of timing will be retarded automatically, but depending on how much timing you added via the tune you may/may not want to pull more.

Matt

DynotuneN2O

iTrader: (13)

It would be simpler to just get a wideband air fuel gauge and start with your lowest jets. The a/f guage will tell you when your getting to close to the edge.
For $199 they are the best bang for the buck tuning aid....

Dan

BadAssFast

iTrader: (2)

I agree. Your best bet is wet. Why go dry? In your case it doesn't seem to make sense to me.

Robert56

iTrader: (2)

Ok, seems everybody wants to talk you out of what you want to do, and normally these will be wet kit owners, so biased. First, if you jet your dry to the same HP level as a wet, you'll have the same power, period. Those that have been trying to convince us that wet has more torque (I was one that almost fell for it), dosen't seem to be the case, read on going post tnt vs nx thread. Now first let me state, I have done 480hp and 5xx torque on stock injectors and fuel pump. You'll likely need to think pump upgrade if you are near the 450 combined hp level for the f-bod (vette 550hp). Now injectors, from your mods, yes injectors are prob in order, but the 30lbs (36lb'ers at our fuel pressure) can be had for $180 (link in my links section in my web). I wish I knew your HP goal I could give you a correct size injector. About the 80% duty cycle as max, that's a maintained use rec, now if occasionaly going over 80% for a few seconds is not a problem and you won't wear them out, just stay away from static(100%). Dry has many advantages, the best being no intake/hood removal, that's why I like dry the most. Second, add wet side now you have a fuel noid, relay, fuse, wiring extra filter that can go wrong, not so on dry. MAF doesn't fail like some would like you to believe. Depending on how your dry is plumbed in can hit a little softer compared to a wet hit, but that's likely not a problem unless you are NHRA bound. So what can go wrong with a dry hit that can cause problems once its set-up correctly, virtually nothing, can't say that about wet. We offer a PRO Dry kit that is a better quality than the NOS 5177 and I will add link to introductory thread for the PRO Dry kit. If you want any additional info or clarification on any thing I posted, not a problem would be glad to. Oh, and running 10.xx on an absolutly bone stock ls6, not even headers, should indicate that a dry hit can perform just fine. The lsx platform was not engineered to be running fuel through, and I really don't have a problem with guys running a wet kit if they do it based a informed choice. Babbling off.

glennhl, I brought the thread to the top for you to check out. "Introducing the PRO Dry kit".
Robert

glennhl

Excellent advice! Right now I'm thinking just going to the 480 hp level. A friend of mine has HPTuners, so we can check out the injector duty cycle. Right now I'm running 12.73 at 113.75mph. I'll probably not add the dry shot until I get a 12 bolt 4.11 rearend. However, I know sooner or later I'm going to want the juice and I want the simplest system therefore I'm leaning to the dry kit.

dannyz

Like your style Robert. Nothing said that isn't backed by fact's.
Keep it up.

Homeslice (tm)

The correct answer to your question is "It Depends". It depends on what else you have done, how much risk you want to take on etc.

As far as my answer to your question, I spray over 200 dry with totally stock gear and have never had a problem, but I have some years of experience and a LOT of testing in getting here. You CAN spray just like me but since you are asking this question I would say start with a typical 100 dry shot and do a bunch of reading and question asking before jetting up. It's not about getting a kickass nitrous system allready built from somebody else, it's about getting the knowledge and experience to build one for yourself.

BadAssFast

iTrader: (2)

We are all born inherently biased. We learn predjuce.
- Quoting myself

I agree adding 1,000,000 HP with a Pratt & Whitney Jet engine attached to your bumper will yield the same 1,000,000 HP as adding a 1,000,000 shot of N20 whether its is wet or dry...it is a matter of what it takes to do it...dry has potetntally more variables for the everyday fun in the sun user to consider...

There is another hassle...going out for new injector and you omitted the cost of a new fuel pump and then getting it tuned. Let's see. My Racetronix is $249...42 lb injectors are ... hmm I need to ask Nitro Dave, I forgot frankly...more than $180 though.

With wet you have a fuel nozzle...all that is essentally a moot point.

What are you talking about? I still have a hood and intake?

Everything in life can fail...fuel pumps, injectors, relays, bearings...I don't see that adding one relay is worth worrying about...

A little softer hit. There it is. Wet hits harder.

Something can always go wrong. You might get a stuck N20 solenoid...works the same way as a fuel solenoid. In life there are no guarentees.

I don't think any of them were engineered with running nitrous in mind!!

LOL!! Either do I.

That's why we are all here. To inform...with a little humor to eae the tension in some posts and threads. Not this on.

Okay...informative babble though.
Robert loves dry systems. I love them both Do whatever you want to do...just buy a quality system. Like anything on a car there are opinion differences. I'm not wrong, either is Robert56. I will add that Robert has been doing this a longs time and much of it is second nature to him. I have been around it for 35 years...but only put nitrous on my car 18 months ago. I think it's important to rememmber that in general, until we know differently, keeping the system simple and safe is more important than wet vs dry. If my first kit had me swapping injectors and fuel pumps, frankly, I wouldn't have done it. Who knows. Now I am considering a wet dry hybrid. It's all cool as long as "Scotty" doesn't start yelling "I can't hold her to gether much longer, Captain..."
Just have some fun.

Robert56

iTrader: (2)

Macon, you forget, he was asking about a dry kit. Exactly how many dry kits have you run, meaning your comments based on read alongs or real world. A small dry for most is the easiest, simplest, safest and cheapest way to go. I'll bet he is needing or close to needing injectors already. As for the fuel pump, I don't know why you think this is a dry only need, if you need it dry you'll need it wet, period. What happens on a dry when the n2o noid sticks open, nothing, the MAF still adds extra fuel and rpms go up indicating an issue, no problem, you wont hurt your motor. Now what happens when a n2o noid sticks open on a wet hit, with no extra fuel, lean city and soon $$ probelems. Lets say wet fuel noid sticks open, and no n2o to help atomize and carry fuel, the out come could be serious, dry won't happen. Lets say wet noid sticks closed (noid itself, relay, fuse, wiring) we have a lean condition again $$. And it goes on... Each person must take the calculated risk with n2o, whether wet or dry, but the facts point to a dry system as inherently safer by design. No the GM engineers didn't design the intake for n2o, however, n2o flows a little different than fuel. our manifolds have the runners below the plenum and this acts like a oil catch can when heavy fuel is sent through and a gas doesn't fall out and puddle. Macon you chose a wet kit, that's fine, and I have no problems with it. Just because you still have your itake and hood dosen't mean that this intake explosion thing dosen't happen.
Robert

BadAssFast

iTrader: (2)

No i did not.

NONE.

I live in the real world. I believe that it is possible to learn from books and discussions. Example: I've never built a transistor but I sure know how they work.

I'm aware of all the dangers...at least most of them.

and as you say...
yep

A motor is a large pump and the velocity of air makes it unlikely to puddle.

I did and it's good you don't have any problems with it.

**** happens. But properly maintained, not usually.

Just trying to hang with Robert56 is a tough job for someone who has never run a dry system. In fact i've only been runninmg nitrous for a short while. These threads help me and hopefully YOU learn what is best for your application. I've always maintained that the Halo system Nitrous Outlet is a very interesting system. BTW...that's a great reason to use a dry kit...easier to hide...but on an LS1 (LQ4/9) so is displacement...anyway. I applaud Robert for staying on track and not trying to simply sell his rep'd products. It makes for a better discussion.

I will contimue to discuss my observations, real world data and mixtures of both on this forum. I am ALWAYS quite honest about what I know and what I suppose. Be real careful not to criticize me for that one. Check my sig. Every post I make says don't trust a damn thing I say until you have proof it's correct. Remember Einstein
"No amount of experimentation
can ever prove me right; a single experiment can prove me wrong."
I'm pissed out!! LOL