GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s
11-09-2002, 07:25 AM
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GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s Originally posted by Johnny Hunkins at CZ28.com:
After seeing how well our LT1 bolt-on shootout went this summer, I'm seriously thinking about doing an LT1 versus LS1 shootout.
This would be by invitation only (like the previous story) and would be conducted at Englishtown sometime in the spring or summer of 2003.
I think this would be a "center body mass" hit with GMHTP readers.
In order to maximize the relevance to our readers, it would be strictly for street cars. There would be few rules regarding modifications, but they would be strictly enforced, just as they were for the LT1 shootout. I expect this to be largely an 11-second and 10-second gathering, so don't be afraid to step up.
Here's what I'm thinking of:
We organize the groups in teams: Team LT1 and Team LS1. We select team members based on their best proven prior performance and their ability to travel to New Jersey for the shootout.
Any modification is allowed including stroker motors, nitrous, turbos, blowers, etc.
All cars must produce a current, valid insurance card for their particular vehicle. No "company insurance cards," no "dealer insurance cards", no "temporary" insurance cards. Only insurance cards for that stated vehicle.
All cars must be muffled. Rear exiting tailpipes only. No dump pipes or cutouts. (you can have them, just can't use them). Maximum decibel level in the burn-out is limited to 94 dB. No exceptions. Exceeding this results in immediate disqualification. This is a major limitation enforced by local ordinance and the track, so there is zero tolerance. "Street Legal" race cars need not apply.
All cars must be licensed and have a current vehicle registration in the owner's state of origin.
All vehicles must be driven by the owner. No sub drivers.
All vehicles must have all safety equipment required for their ET in accordance with NHRA rules. Driver credentials and chassis certification will be required below a 10-flat ET--no exceptions. Chances are, you won't pass the sound test anyway, but we're just covering ourselves. Note: you are responsible for knowing what your car requires, so find out in advance and get these things taken care of!
Any tire allowed. Any suspension/chassis modification allowed. Any '93 - present F-body allowed. If you've got some other GM body with an LT1 or LS1, we'll look at it on a case-by-case basis.
If you are interested, send a vehicle photo, tech sheet, contact info and time slip photo copy to: McMullen Argus Publishing, attn.: Johnny Hunkins, Dept. LT1 vs. LS1 Shootout, 299 Market St., Saddle Brook, NJ 07663.
You can read the entire thread, including the complaints about the noise restrictions here:
http://web.camaross.com/forums/showt...eferrerid=3936
<small>[ November 09, 2002, 07:27 AM: Message edited by: Jim@GMHTP ]</small>
After seeing how well our LT1 bolt-on shootout went this summer, I'm seriously thinking about doing an LT1 versus LS1 shootout.
This would be by invitation only (like the previous story) and would be conducted at Englishtown sometime in the spring or summer of 2003.
I think this would be a "center body mass" hit with GMHTP readers.
In order to maximize the relevance to our readers, it would be strictly for street cars. There would be few rules regarding modifications, but they would be strictly enforced, just as they were for the LT1 shootout. I expect this to be largely an 11-second and 10-second gathering, so don't be afraid to step up.
Here's what I'm thinking of:
We organize the groups in teams: Team LT1 and Team LS1. We select team members based on their best proven prior performance and their ability to travel to New Jersey for the shootout.
Any modification is allowed including stroker motors, nitrous, turbos, blowers, etc.
All cars must produce a current, valid insurance card for their particular vehicle. No "company insurance cards," no "dealer insurance cards", no "temporary" insurance cards. Only insurance cards for that stated vehicle.
All cars must be muffled. Rear exiting tailpipes only. No dump pipes or cutouts. (you can have them, just can't use them). Maximum decibel level in the burn-out is limited to 94 dB. No exceptions. Exceeding this results in immediate disqualification. This is a major limitation enforced by local ordinance and the track, so there is zero tolerance. "Street Legal" race cars need not apply.
All cars must be licensed and have a current vehicle registration in the owner's state of origin.
All vehicles must be driven by the owner. No sub drivers.
All vehicles must have all safety equipment required for their ET in accordance with NHRA rules. Driver credentials and chassis certification will be required below a 10-flat ET--no exceptions. Chances are, you won't pass the sound test anyway, but we're just covering ourselves. Note: you are responsible for knowing what your car requires, so find out in advance and get these things taken care of!
Any tire allowed. Any suspension/chassis modification allowed. Any '93 - present F-body allowed. If you've got some other GM body with an LT1 or LS1, we'll look at it on a case-by-case basis.
If you are interested, send a vehicle photo, tech sheet, contact info and time slip photo copy to: McMullen Argus Publishing, attn.: Johnny Hunkins, Dept. LT1 vs. LS1 Shootout, 299 Market St., Saddle Brook, NJ 07663.
You can read the entire thread, including the complaints about the noise restrictions here:
http://web.camaross.com/forums/showt...eferrerid=3936
<small>[ November 09, 2002, 07:27 AM: Message edited by: Jim@GMHTP ]</small>
11-09-2002, 09:19 AM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s Hmmm... I could always stick some tailpipes on my car. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
11-09-2002, 09:50 AM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by GeorgeC:
<strong>Hmmm... I could always stick some tailpipes on my car. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Oh yeah, I'm sure a borla would do wonders for your car! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
<strong>Hmmm... I could always stick some tailpipes on my car. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Oh yeah, I'm sure a borla would do wonders for your car! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
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11-09-2002, 03:02 PM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s i think i might have to make the e-town trip also. maybe my car will look good enough to attract some gmhtp people over.
i will get my pics and info and mail it out this week. what kind of timeframe are we looking at to choose the teams???
<small>[ November 09, 2002, 03:02 PM: Message edited by: EVIL ]</small>
i will get my pics and info and mail it out this week. what kind of timeframe are we looking at to choose the teams???
<small>[ November 09, 2002, 03:02 PM: Message edited by: EVIL ]</small>
11-09-2002, 04:57 PM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by theblur98ss:
<strong>Sounds like a good idea but how loud is a borla catback with long tubes and off road pipes??? I'd hate to make it there only to be too loud. I have no idea what decible level equates to. Anyone???</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I agree, anyone know this?
<strong>Sounds like a good idea but how loud is a borla catback with long tubes and off road pipes??? I'd hate to make it there only to be too loud. I have no idea what decible level equates to. Anyone???</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I agree, anyone know this?
11-09-2002, 06:06 PM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s You can pick up a decibel meter at any radio shack to test your car for about $35- http://www.radioshack.com/searchsku.asp?find=33-2050
To give you a rough idea, Eric Livingston's '97 Z had long tubes and a Borla exhaust and he had to cap his Borla after his first run and he wasn't the only one. This was a contentious issue last time, because the ordinance resulted in one of the cars not being able to participate in the event. ORPs will definitely have to be capped and gutted cats could also present a serious problem.
Hopefully, Hunkins will give very specific measurements as to how far away from the car and in which direction the dB meter will be used, so you can replicate the same testing procedure at your home track.
<small>[ November 09, 2002, 06:07 PM: Message edited by: Jim@GMHTP ]</small>
To give you a rough idea, Eric Livingston's '97 Z had long tubes and a Borla exhaust and he had to cap his Borla after his first run and he wasn't the only one. This was a contentious issue last time, because the ordinance resulted in one of the cars not being able to participate in the event. ORPs will definitely have to be capped and gutted cats could also present a serious problem.
Hopefully, Hunkins will give very specific measurements as to how far away from the car and in which direction the dB meter will be used, so you can replicate the same testing procedure at your home track.
<small>[ November 09, 2002, 06:07 PM: Message edited by: Jim@GMHTP ]</small>
11-09-2002, 08:16 PM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s I'm in as it is only 2.5 hours from my house, but I am a more or less stock. No 11s here, but I did see on the other board that you were considering slower cars. If you decide to run a stock type or bolt on type class I'm in for sure. I'll send my info and see what you think.
GO team LS1.
Can we get Colnel or wade down there and show the LT1s what is really up?
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
<small>[ November 09, 2002, 08:26 PM: Message edited by: ClassicCollector ]</small>
GO team LS1.
Can we get Colnel or wade down there and show the LT1s what is really up?
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
<small>[ November 09, 2002, 08:26 PM: Message edited by: ClassicCollector ]</small>
11-09-2002, 08:55 PM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s uh, this may be a stupid question but why not hold it at a track WITHOUT noise restrictions? Pretty stupid to have arace at a track that has noise restrictions, I thought that is why they put tracks in the middle of nowhere.
11-09-2002, 09:23 PM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s Speaking from my experiance in the LT1 Bolt on shootout.I would first like to say that Johnny,Jim, and Brian were great guys to work with.That being said I would also suggest moving it to a different track.Not only do you have to deal with the noise restriction, the track didnt hook very well either.I say bring it on down here to Texas.We have plenty of fast F-bodys. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> And dont dare say that its too far to travel <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
11-09-2002, 10:28 PM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s Our magazine seems to have a pretty good working relationship with E-town and its very close to our offices, which makes renting the facility and doing a shootout there easier to justify from an economic standpoint.
As for the track conditions, I routinely read posts from people who claim the numbers our magazine published from E-town are skewed because we get to prep the track to suit our needs and the altitude and weather is ideal. We can't control what the weather is going to be like for a shootout, but regardless, if a track doesn't hook very well for a shootout, all the cars are still running in the same conditions. Its not like we're bringing in a bunch of drivers who don't have any experience with less than ideal racing conditions.
As for the noise restriction, here are a few of Hunkin's comments from CZ28.com:
Oh stop cryin' about the noise rule. Most of you have no idea how loud 94 dB actually is. It's not like we're actually -- gasp -- asking you to be smog legal. Break down and spend $34.95 at Radio Shack. Take the meter with you next time you go to your local track. Better hurry though, you've only got, oh, 8 months or so to figure it out.
Street cars are not race cars. They have to be reasonably quiet or else you'd get a ticket every time you take it out.
The rule says absolutely nothing about excluding long-tube headers, cams, heads, etc. In fact, pretty much everything you can stuff under a hood will be allowed.
and
Let me put it this way: Englishtown runs its Wednesday and Friday night programs with this sound rule. There are usually more 10-second cars than you can count on those days. Many of them didn't pass when the rule originally came around, but as regulars, they had to comply, or not race.
As for the track conditions, I routinely read posts from people who claim the numbers our magazine published from E-town are skewed because we get to prep the track to suit our needs and the altitude and weather is ideal. We can't control what the weather is going to be like for a shootout, but regardless, if a track doesn't hook very well for a shootout, all the cars are still running in the same conditions. Its not like we're bringing in a bunch of drivers who don't have any experience with less than ideal racing conditions.
As for the noise restriction, here are a few of Hunkin's comments from CZ28.com:
Oh stop cryin' about the noise rule. Most of you have no idea how loud 94 dB actually is. It's not like we're actually -- gasp -- asking you to be smog legal. Break down and spend $34.95 at Radio Shack. Take the meter with you next time you go to your local track. Better hurry though, you've only got, oh, 8 months or so to figure it out.
Street cars are not race cars. They have to be reasonably quiet or else you'd get a ticket every time you take it out.
The rule says absolutely nothing about excluding long-tube headers, cams, heads, etc. In fact, pretty much everything you can stuff under a hood will be allowed.
and
Let me put it this way: Englishtown runs its Wednesday and Friday night programs with this sound rule. There are usually more 10-second cars than you can count on those days. Many of them didn't pass when the rule originally came around, but as regulars, they had to comply, or not race.
11-09-2002, 10:40 PM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s I'd be interested if you consider a bolt on group. I don't have the ponies to run w/ the big dogs.
11-10-2002, 12:01 AM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s Sounds like a good idea but how loud is a borla catback with long tubes and off road pipes??? I'd hate to make it there only to be too loud. I have no idea what decible level equates to. Anyone???
11-10-2002, 12:31 AM
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Re: GMHTP is doing another shootout and looking for LS1s Too many restrictions in my opinion too. My car is the only form of transportation I really own and my exhaust doesn't exit out of the rear. Not to mention by that time next year I should be run sub 10.00 with a/c and power steering as well as the stock stereo system. You should at least re-evaluate the exhaust exiting the rear. I can keep the car quiet enough to meet restrictions but no way I could make it exit out the rear.