PCM Diagnostics & Tuning HP Tuners | Holley | Diablo
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 09-30-2003, 08:16 PM
  #1  
LS1Tech Sponsor
Thread Starter
iTrader: (12)
 
Slowhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Bridgewater,Ma
Posts: 14,865
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts

Default C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

I've tuned many F-body's but this is the first Vette.
The problem at hand.Installed a TR224 on 112.Did the ussual tuning ie idle,timing ect.
The problem I'm having is hot start and when you rev it the idle drops to 200-400rpm then goes back up.It did die on me once.
This could be fixed on a F-body by drilling the TB but I know not to drill the TB on the Vette.
Would the fix be the Idle air table??
Other than this problem the car runs great.
Old 09-30-2003, 08:34 PM
  #2  
TECH Regular
iTrader: (12)
 
C5kid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Hershey, PA
Posts: 453
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default Re: C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

did you try an idle relearn w/ it? that is how you handle alot of idle problems w/ C5's

here are the directions

Just remember to do a idle relearn. Turn the key on but don't star the engine. Remove the number 16 & 23 fuses from the underhood fuse box. Turn the key off. Replace the number 16 & 23 fuses. Start the car and let it run @ 175 degrees or warmer for 5 minutes. Shut down the engine for at least 30 seconds, then drive the car for about 30 miles at varying speeds. If you do this kind of low bugget mods you will feel a big difference in the seat of your pants, and ET's. Good luck have fun.
Old 09-30-2003, 08:50 PM
  #3  
LS1Tech Sponsor
Thread Starter
iTrader: (12)
 
Slowhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Bridgewater,Ma
Posts: 14,865
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts

Default Re: C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

I'm under the impression it is not an idle relearn problem.
The car idles perfect.Just for 4 seconds on hot start and when the revs come down it surges a couple times then catches itself and idles perfect again.
Looks like the revs just need to come down slower,I've already played with the followers with no results.
Old 09-30-2003, 08:54 PM
  #4  
TECH Addict
 
Bink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,258
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default Re: C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

did you try an idle relearn w/ it? that is how you handle alot of idle problems w/ C5's

here are the directions

Just remember to do a idle relearn. Turn the key on but don't star the engine. Remove the number 16 & 23 fuses from the underhood fuse box. Turn the key off. Replace the number 16 & 23 fuses. Start the car and let it run @ 175 degrees or warmer for 5 minutes. Shut down the engine for at least 30 seconds, then drive the car for about 30 miles at varying speeds. If you do this kind of low bugget mods you will feel a big difference in the seat of your pants, and ET's. Good luck have fun.
Good advice. Here's the "Idle Relearn" from a C5 manual compliments of Patches :
Automatic Transmission:
1 Turn off the ignition

2 Restore the PCM battery feed

3 Turn Off the AC controls

4 Set the parking brake and block the drive wheels

5 Start the engine

6 Allow the engine coolant temperature to reach 176 degrees F

7 Shift the transmission selector into the drive range

8 Allow the engine to idle for 5 minutes

9 Turn on the AC controls (Omit for 2000-01 model)

10 Allow the engine to idle for 5 minutes (Omit for 2000-01 model)

11 Shift the transmission selector into Park

12 Allow the engine to idle for 5 minutes (Omit for 2000-01 model)

13 Turn off the AC controls (Omit for 2000-01 model)

14 Allow the engine to idle for 5 minutes

15 Turn off the engine for 15 seconds


Manual Transmission:

1 Turn Off the ignition

2 Restore the PCM battery feed

3 Turn Off the AC controls

4 Set the parking brake and block the drive wheels

5 Transmission in neutral

6 Start the engine

7 Allow the engine coolant temperature to reach 176 degrees F

8 Turn on the AC controls (Omit for 2000-01 model)

9 Allow the engine to idle for 5 minutes (Omit for 2000-01 model)

10 Turn off the AC controls (Omit for 2000-01 model)

11 Allow the engine to idle for 5 minutes

12 Turn off the engine for 15 seconds

Good Luck.
joel


Old 10-01-2003, 12:09 AM
  #5  
TECH Addict
 
Bink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,258
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default Re: C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

I'm under the impression it is not an idle relearn problem.
The car idles perfect.Just for 4 seconds on hot start and when the revs come down it surges a couple times then catches itself and idles perfect again.
Looks like the revs just need to come down slower,I've already played with the followers with no results.
On my car, with a big cam, it will plummet thru idle - if I don't do an idle relearn. Idle relearn sets the idle throttle position to provide proper airflow at idle RPM. You can see this if you scan TPS during relearn. I assume it sets the target RPM and decay accordingly. FWIW.
joel
Old 10-01-2003, 07:54 AM
  #6  
LS1Tech Sponsor
Thread Starter
iTrader: (12)
 
Slowhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Bridgewater,Ma
Posts: 14,865
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts

Default Re: C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

Thanks,I did the relearn and now its great.
Old 10-01-2003, 01:33 PM
  #7  
On The Tree
iTrader: (6)
 
c5ls1vette's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Lufkin, Texas
Posts: 140
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default Re: C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

How come you do not drill a hole in the throttle body of a corvette, alot of people on the corvette forum drill one.
Please enlighten me, I am just trying to learn.

thanks,
Old 10-01-2003, 01:39 PM
  #8  
TECH Addict
 
66ImpalaLT1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: St Louis, MO
Posts: 2,551
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default Re: C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

I have never drilled a hole with my T1 cam (221,.558,112) and I only have a slight surge in open loop with the air conditioning on. Adding timing at idle really helped my car.
Old 10-01-2003, 07:33 PM
  #9  
TECH Addict
 
Bink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,258
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default Re: C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

How come you do not drill a hole in the throttle body of a corvette, alot of people on the corvette forum drill one.
Please enlighten me, I am just trying to learn.

thanks,
C5 is Fly-by-Wire. Computer adjusts the throttle for idle airflow. A spring, wound on the shaft of the TB motor actually prevents the blade from closing completely-leaves a gap of 2-3 mm. Spring acts as a mechanical damper.anyhow, drilling the blade allows unmetered air to enter and, theorectically, throws off the computers analysis/adjustments.
Hope this helps some .Maybe one of the Gurus can Chime in??
joel
Old 10-04-2003, 01:34 AM
  #10  
TECH Resident
 
MNC5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Twin Cities
Posts: 862
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default Re: C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge

How come you do not drill a hole in the throttle body of a corvette, alot of people on the corvette forum drill one.
Please enlighten me, I am just trying to learn.

thanks,
C5 is Fly-by-Wire. Computer adjusts the throttle for idle airflow. A spring, wound on the shaft of the TB motor actually prevents the blade from closing completely-leaves a gap of 2-3 mm. Spring acts as a mechanical damper.anyhow, drilling the blade allows unmetered air to enter and, theorectically, throws off the computers analysis/adjustments.
Hope this helps some .Maybe one of the Gurus can Chime in??
joel
I've run a few very large cams 240+ duration in my corvettes and never had to drill the TB. If the idle is bouncing around, you missed something with your tuning. Check all the tables for smooth transitions from one cell to another @ idle



Quick Reply: C5 + Cam,how to stop idle surge



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:40 PM.