Seagram's 72

iTrader: (2)

Holley seems to have the day off on their tech line so I’ll see what I can get on here (usually better help on the forum anyways).

I have the HP efi kit on a 2003 LQ4 bone stock except for a cam and heads.

So far I only have about 15 miles (30 minutes of drive time) and about 40 minutes of idle time on it.

Everything has been setup per the Holley guide. I am using the stock ls1 loaded tune, learn mode on 5.

I am having a few issues and was wondering if they will go away as I auto tune (learn):

Issue 1:

I let the fuel pump prime for about 5 seconds, turn the key, and it takes about 4-5 seconds of turning over for the engine to start, both hot and cold. Will this start timne speed up using the learn more or do I have to manually tune this out? If so, what should I change first?

Issue 2:

After I come to a stop while drive it will idle down to about 1000 and then drop to about 500 RPM and almost act like it is dying for about 4-5 seconds before it comes back up to 800 RPM where I have it set. Again, Will this go away using the learn more or do I have to manually tune this out? If so, what should I change first?

Issue 3:

I have my e fans wired to B3 and B10 outputs (ground). They are setup to trigger when the CTS fan is at a certain temp for each fan. I had these both working before. Now it seems one of the outputs (I think B10) will not trigger and I have traced it all the way back to the harness (ecu) and still no ground triggered. Every time I open the program it always says "Inputs or Outputs Pin-Mapped to unavailable connector. This must be fixed before syncing." I used to have to resync the fans whenever I started it for them to work and now one will not work at all. I have deleted and added it back in with still no luck. B3 works so now without having to resync so I know I am doing it right and now B10 will not work. Any ideas?

Thanks for any insight

soundengineer

iTrader: (16)

I leave the Learn on the entire time...
but I also use Alpha-N at idle and I tell it what fuel it should have and it corrects slightly based on day to day needs.

sounds like your vehicle is in full learning at idle, and once you get it running, its either too rich or too lean for start up...
usually its too lean for startup... try adding some Fuel to the cranking fuel,....then if it starts and then dies, try adding to the afterstart enrichment table
if it still takes a while to crank over to start, then you may need more spark dwell...which means you have to go to manual settings for the Ignition type instead of just using the generic LSx 24 or 58 tooth settings

the stuble at coming back down to idle is probably because it learns too much at idle and is over or under compensating constantly, henceforth the reason to switch to an Alpha-N at idle only on a cammed car.

as far as the E-Fans issue... might be just that you bumped the fan pins to somewhere on accident...
make sure you have them in J1...especially if you have an HP unit...its the only place it can go.
if you have it in any other slots, it wont work.
also make sure you have the type set to HP
under Toolbox/Preferences... check box that says ECU is HP EFI

Seagram's 72

iTrader: (2)

Thanks soundengineer. You are the man with Holley EFI.

I will try these changes tomorrow and see what effect it has.

bmf5150

Sound engineer,what is alpha n???

Seagram's 72

iTrader: (2)

As what bmf5150 mentioned I would like to know more too. Also, how do I set alpha n at idle? Do I copy the settings over from the alpha tune or can I select to use alpha at idle somehow?
Thanks

soundengineer

iTrader: (16)

Alpha-N is using Fueling based on TPS and RPM...
useful when you have a car with a big cam that drives and Idles in the same MAP/RPM ranges but needs completely different fueling at both spots..
also useful if you have a big 10-71 hat on a car or any injector style hat...

basically, you set the rpm and tps parameters...and tell it what fuel it needs to be..
it still corrects in closed loop, but it doesnt learn


attached is how I do mine..
because my cam idles at 70kpa, and learns some odd values, which screws with my off idle fueling which needs something completely different.

bmf5150

Thanks for all your advice sound engineer,I have same issues Seagrams seems to have!to start my car it cranks for a while before it will start!im going to try what u suggested!i also have my idle bouncing between 400rpm -and 800rpm!i been driving car around hoping it improves but not much luck such far !maybe drove 15 miles!been thinking about adjusting screw on the throttle body to let more air in!!i have a ls1 with TSP 228r cam( baby cam)and there 243 ported heads,nothing to crazy!!

soundengineer

iTrader: (16)

You have to really know how to tune fueling on a car... Have to understand how to look at logs, and where to put fueling, and when to let it learn, or just correct for the moment...especially in idle and transition areas.

If you really analyze your logs, you can see exactly what its doing that is causing the issues, then it becomes fairly simple to correct the problems...

Like I said, if it runs fine, but its hard to start, its either dwell time, or cranking fuel

bmf5150

Sound engineer,thanks for your help!so should I do a data log of the car idling and start by looking at that?i know I have a lot to learn about tuning,but I appreciate the advice and help!!

bmf5150

I been looking up ve tables on idle to try and get an idea what I need to do!found this
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36318

soundengineer

iTrader: (16)

Post a zip file of your global folder, and a log, and ill take a look on my day off tomorrow....
I'm down In Australia at the moment, so my clock is the opposite side right now...lol

bmf5150

Found another good read,lots to learn!!


http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/sh...hp?tid/253395/

soundengineer

iTrader: (16)

doesnt really apply to the Holley Stuff...
sort of kind of.. but not really...
Idle should not be an issue... its usually a fueling issue, or the TB is not open far enough when fully closed when you have an issue at idle with the Holley stuff

bmf5150

here is a zip file of my global folder!!BIG thanks sound enginner for your help!!!

soundengineer

iTrader: (16)

cool, thanks, ill check it out when I get to my hotel in Brisbane Australia later today...flying in from adelaide today

Get me a log file too if you can.

bmf5150

here is my data logging,roughly ten minutes of car idling.here is the link to download..
http://www.filefactory.com/file/2yub...0521-154557_dl

bmf5150

Little info for u,when car is cold it dies first want to idle,till it warms up a little!!also around 190 degrees fans kick on ,seperate from Ecu and idle gets worse,need to compensate for extra load of fans as well

soundengineer

iTrader: (16)

you need a few things...
Fueling looks fairly stable to me.. but I would still consider switching to an Alpha N setup for Idle

you need to open your throttle body blade some more...
at hot temps you want it to be in the 5%-15% range
then do a TPS reset thru the sync circle picture tab thingy...

secondly you need to raise your idle RPM up some... 650 is awful low unless you are a stock cam...
get your cold idle up to 1100, and your hot idle up to around 800...
if its a bigger cam, then it needs to be higher...
My massive 248/252, idles at 950, and even that is a little low...

third..your timing table needs some work...
should be 28* from 0-1100rpm for all idle areas... and less as the MAP goes up...
you have this big jump up to 35, and thats a killer for stable idle..

I threw in a table that should be a little better for that...feel free to modify as necessary to suit your needs...I just have something that works really well as a good starting point.

and Stan.. is your ECU a HP or a Dominator?

I attached a file that has the changes mentioned, but try it, and let me know if any of it helps..
you really need to get some driving time on the car to let it learn all over the VE table to get everything more stable..
once you have the VE table solid, you can start to work on other parts like the Cold start and all the modifier tables.

soundengineer

iTrader: (16)

By the Way.. its 11:00 PM May 21st at Home in Nashville right now...
and its 2:00 PM May 22nd here in Brisbane Australia right now....

bmf5150

awesome sound engineer.would u mind emailing me the file,for some reason i down loaded it here and cant open it??
bmf5150@gmail.com