lferdzl

iTrader: (2)

im looking into purchasing a power programmer to increase gas mileage, hw, etc. I have a stock 02 z28, and i was wondering which programmer is best for my application. im not much of a racer so yea

ZL1Killa

iTrader: (17)

The diablosport predator from what i remember ;could be different now though..its been a while since i looked at things... I can give you a recommendation though...EFI LIVE v7. It might be a little expensive but I can run you through the basic things that will gain you power and basically the same thing that the programmer will do. I can even email you my tunes.. here is what we just lately did : injector flow rate changed (better gas mileage, and lower duty cycle--i have the table(s) for this), Power Enrichment (PE) table modified to run 13.4-12.9 air to fuel ratio, cat protect off, and -6% on MAF due to de-screening.

But since you aren't much of a racer then I would say go with the Predator. You can email them and ask them to email you back a tune and you can ask for specific things. The ls1 cars run way too rich from the factory and you will need to change the air to fuel ratio along with the cat protect and the injector flow rate. that all affects your air to fuel ratio. My injectors in my car stock, were set for a fuel pressure of 43.5psi and 28.8lb/hr (the 28.8 is right) however my fuel pressure was 56psi....so I was injecting more than what i needed(i believe I'm saying this right). Feel free to email me and make a list that you could see if diablo predator could change for you to take the utmost advatange of the power programmer. Is you car a 6 speed or an auto??

BawlsZ28

iTrader: (11)

I would spend my money somewhere else. Maybe look into all the bolt-on's instead. Also, these have better re-sale value in my opinion.

mrr23

iTrader: (3)

the vinci/crane tuner is what i use on both of my cars. on the 00 formula, i picked up .2 and 1.4 mph at the track. same day, back to back runs. here's a tutorial i made about it. http://www.stealthram.com/vhptuner.htm

slow

iTrader: (7)

I don't see any logic in changing injector flow characteristics if you did not change the injectors themselves. Gm did not flow these injectors in a lab environment to just guess at the flow rates in the tune.

If you want to change air fuel, change the commanded air fuel, don't lie to the computer.

ryan

JGA

mrr23

Any news on the 98 tuner?

Thanks JA

ZL1Killa

iTrader: (17)

The injectors are being lied to right now. The fuel pressure is NOT 43.5psi; the actual fuel pressure is close to 56psi. And if you use the formula for calculating all of this (which you can find up here and on www.efilive.com) you will discover that the fuel pressure does matter. I'm adding this excel table to show you; if you take even the 43.5psi and 28.8lb/hr injectors you get higher numbers than what is in the stock tune. The flow rate does matter in the air to fuel becuase it controls how much is injected per fire of the injector.

I have changed the cat protect to disabled, and I have changed the commanded air to fuel ratio to what I want, but is it actually changing it to exactly what i want, no its not. that means something else is affecting it. So if anyone has any other ideas on what to change that affects the air to fuel ratio please let me know. I'm serious, I would like to know. I'm still a newb to all of this tuning and through reading and troubleshooting it myself this is what I come up with (the injector flow rate)

slow

iTrader: (7)

where are you seeing data that these injectors flow 28.8 @ 43.5 psi?

Ryan

WS6FirebirdTA00

iTrader: (33)

the stock tables are set up for 58 psi. all the flow rates from 0 to 80 kpa of vacuum at set like this. if the car is stock dont waste money tuning it. part throttle i doubt you will see and gain in gas mileage. if your trims are way off it may help and leaning out wot some would help as well but wont make a huge difference with a hand held. you need something to tune the whole table if you want it right and are looking for a difference, IMO hold off on the tuning until you mod, otherwise it would be a waste, esp with a handheld

WS6FirebirdTA00

iTrader: (33)

your stock table should look like this, as it should right now (g/sec)

3.6288
3.6514
3.6738
3.6962
3.7184
3.7405
3.7624
3.7842
3.8059
3.8275
3.8489
3.8703
3.8915
3.9126
3.9336
3.9544
3.9752


IMO get a fuel pressure gauge and check out your rail pressure at various map settings, remember though that 0 vacuum in the IFR table is WOT 100 kPa. my idle pressure is 62 psi and goes to 59 when wide open. i have my ifr table set up for this. once you set this right LEAVE it. some people adjsut the IFR, i only change if it i changed injectors.

now back on topic, see how detailed things are? haha handheld wont do any of this for you. if you plan to mod more, go with efi live or hp tuners.

slow

iTrader: (7)

I disagree with not tuning a stock car. There is quite a bit you can gain by a good tune on even a stock car, in terms of hp, drivability, shifting.

granted my car wasn't wildly modified, but with full exhust, it picked up 20 rwhp in 30 minutes on the dyno, with a very basic tune.

Ryan

WS6FirebirdTA00

iTrader: (33)

o yeah you can get good hp out of the stock tune but if you stay stock i personally see no need, if you modify then do it. if you want to stay stock then what do you care about the power for anyway you know? lol

ZL1Killa

iTrader: (17)

Ok, well here is the big picture. Gm has smaller numbers than what the values should be. They are going to build the system for the drivers that don't have a damn clue on what they are doing or how to drive the car. GM builds it to take anything that a customer would throw at it. The smaller the number in the table the more fuel is dumped per fire; their stock number for 0kpa is :3.617188 and the formula that has been provided to me results in 0kpa at :3.6288 So we come to the conclusion that these numbers are not really that far off. It is not lying to the computer, if your pressure is 55psi and your injectors are 28.8# then you should change the table if you can to whatever my attached excel sheet tells you once you put in your fuel pressure and injectors.

All you do is open this excel sheet (unzip it) and open it. Then take a look at the area where it says ENTER YOUR VALUES HERE. put in 43.5 for the RATED FUEL PRESSURE. Then put in your actual measured fuel pressure if you can and then the stock injectors are 28.8# and at the bottom where it says FINAL TABLE you put in the values for :INJECTOR FLOW (g/sec) into your computer as long as you are working with (g/sec)

WS6FirebirdTA00

iTrader: (33)

best thing to do if find your ACTUAL rail pressure and do it that way

slow

iTrader: (7)

Interesting big picture.

Evarporate Emissions Testing, and CAFE s as well as Catalytic converter warranties go against the big picture reasoning posted of why they would make these values too small in the factory calibration, just to protect from stupid drivers.

But maybe a Tuners point of view is far different than a OEM calibrators point of view on the subject

Ryan

ZL1Killa

iTrader: (17)

the numbers aren't that far off if you are actually running 43.5psi fuel pressure.....but I will let you know once I program my car and see if it helped lean it out more. I'm still going rich up high and it is less than what I was before I turned cat protect off but it is still ~12.5:1 and I'm figuring that the flow rate has something to do with it since my pressure is a lot higher than the normal setting. I will let you all know, it makes sense though

ZL1Killa

iTrader: (17)

made revision to formula...some errors arose

here is the new file REVISION MADE, PLZ DOWNLOAD NEW REVISION MADE : PLZ ALL DOWNLOAD THAT GOT PREVIOUS VERSION

slow

iTrader: (7)

normal LS1 rail pressure is 58 static.

where do you see the ratings of the stock injectors were rated at 43.5?

Ryan

corvet786c

iTrader: (6)

Get The Vinci Programmer, Click on the site in the sponsor section. Has many diffrent programmes you can choose from instead of a diablo and hpp3

ZL1Killa

iTrader: (17)

thats the basic tune. the numbers are a little off could be 43psi instead...idk thats what someone found to be the stock rating; they also say that the automatics run lower fuel pressure than the 6 speeds but who knows