pjtimmer

Hee there,
I just bought a 4th gen Camaro wiper motor from andy98Z to adapt to my '72 camaro.
But I also need some sort of switch for it to controle it.
I know it is a 5 way intermedidet and 2 speed operating, I could make a normal toggel switch for it, but I like to have a easy to use switch a column switch would be easier to use and install in my camaro.
I assume the wipers in a 4th gen camaro are controlled and activated by a column right hand side leveler switch normally? I also assume that the switch and leveler are one part to be taken out of the column. If I can get a column switch with leveler it would probally be easier to make it work in my '72 camaro.
Does someone have specs or pics from the way the wipers are operated?
Does anyone have a switch for sale? preferly with a wiring harnes or parts from it, like plugs?
please help, already tried the for sale/wanted forum but nobody relied yet
Thanks
Peter

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

You had me confused for a moment until I realized your location. In North America, the wiper/washer switch is on the turn signal lever which is on the left side of the steering column.

The wiper motor has a 5-pin connector arranged as a row of three and a row of two. Looking at them with the row of three on top, you label the pins A,B,C left-to-right for the top three and D,E left-to-right for the bottom two like this:
A B C
D E

A is ground.
B is 12v+ fused feed.
C is high speed feed - it should have 12V+ for high speed operation and nothing otherwise.

Here it gets more complex. The D pin is the wiper/washer request input. The switch sends a full voltage pulse to this connector for the washer. This causes the wipers to run a set number of sweeps and then stop. For normal operation, the voltage at this pin is reduced by a 24K ohm resistor in the switch.

Now the E pin is the delay signal input. For Mist, Low and High this pin receives a positive voltage reduced only by a 360 ohm resistor in the switch. Each of the delay (intermittent) settings has a different resistance in the switch. They are 39K, 82K, 150K, 270K, and 680K ohms. As the resistance is increased the delay between sweeps also increases.

Your best bet would be to find an original switch that has all this built in because the motor control is solid state and could be easily damaged by incorrect wiring.

Another consideration - did the 72 model have "hide-away" wipers? The newer models are designed to "park" the wipers below the edge of the hood when turned off. Many older cars didn't have that feature so the extra couple of inches of travel could be a problem. I don't remember the 72 Camaro much - I was a Mustang fan at the time.

pjtimmer

Thanks man, great stuff , I knew I could count on some one.
Great info, you just explained why I would like to use the orginal switch with lever and mount in in the dash. Otherwise it will be to complex I guess.
Do you or anyone have any idea where to get the original switch with lever???
or what are the part numbers and prices so I could order a new one....

Do I need anything else to make it work?

I have a standard SS from '72 with normal 'parked' wipers not the hideaway, thanks for the input! I will be making a plate out of thick aluminum the adapt the motor, it should work that way, lot nicer under the hood and way more functions than just high low.

thanks
Peter from The Netherlands

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

The original switch in the US is part number 25140743 (left side of column). The part number for the UK is 25140540 (right side of column). Those are both for the turn signal/wiper/washer/cruise control switch and lever which might be adaptable to fit in place of the original lever on the 72 (don't know but it might be worth a try).

You should be able to get them from a dealer or maybe from www.gmpartsdirect.com. The same part fits all models from 94 thru 02 so you may have some luck finding a used one at a junk yard.

pjtimmer

Thanks great stuff, could I find the switch also on the '94 6 cilinder firebirds?
It will not fit my column but I am building a new dash out of fiber, so I can adapt it where ever I like, thanks though.
I will try to find a UK one, so the wiper controlls are all in the switch or is there another box/computer/relaisblock/etc?????
Thanks for all hyour help
Peter

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

Yes, the wiper controls are contained entirely within the switch/lever assembly. The only other required component is the solid state controller which is inside the wiper motor.

The switch isn't listed as being different for 6 cylinder models vs. 8 cylinder models so a 94 6-cyl Firebird switch should be the correct one. The only different switch listed is one that doesn't have the cruise control switches but is otherwise the same.

pjtimmer

Thanks again, your such a great support!!!
I hope to have more luck finding some older ('94) Firebird'ss or Camaro's and it would even be better without the cruisecontrol, any part number on that one, in case i have to order a new one?
Thanks man
Peter

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

94-99 F-body turn signal/wiper/washer switch lever without cruise is part number 22510733. I guess all 00-02 models must have come with cruise because there doesn't seem to be a listing for those years without it. Also, I couldn't find a UK (right side) lever listed without cruise. My parts manual may be out of date or incomplete.

pjtimmer

So you get all that knowlige form a parts manual? great job.
If it is not to much trouble can you find the part numbers of the wiring connectors/plugs that I need on both ends? so I can order new one if I can't find one in the yard(which I probally don't)
Thanks
Peter

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

Well, I use a parts manual, a service manual and about 30 years general experience working on cars (including 5 years working in a new car dealership). Luckily, the manuals include an incredible amount of detail so I was able to find things like the internal resistance ratings.

Unfortunately, the wiring connector for the switch at the column is "N.S." (not sold separately) so you should make sure you get it with the switch if you find a used one. The connector for the wiper motor is part number 12129126.

I hope that helps.

pjtimmer

agian man, THANKS!!!!!
I hope to find it soon, if someone has one for sale please let me know.
Thanks
Peter

pjtimmer

Hee there,
Well I found a '94 firebird and I received the wiper motor. Unfortunedly the '94 fierbird didn't had the switch anymore, but I did find the connector to the wiper motor, so that's good.
Today I did a trial fit with the motor, seems to fit pretty good only some minor details to modify. But I have a question, both my '72 wiper motor and the '01 motor is bolted in the car with some rubber rings/bushings, The best way to mount the motor is without rubber bushings, but do I need those? why are they normaly there?

I also wonder about the switch lever, is the switch the only part I need? are there wires in it or a connector or something? where does the lever normaly plugs in? Do i need that part too? what are the numbers?
This is the switch that goes with the part number I got above, is that the whole thing or it there more to it??????


Please let me know again, thanks
Peter

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

Well, I don't know about the rubber bushings but I would expect they are there for noise reduction.

As far as the switch goes, the wiper/washer wires should have come with it. It should have an 11-pin flat connector that plugs into a harness in the steering column.

The turn signal and headlamp dimmer switch is mounted to the steering column and is where the lever attaches. Those functions are controlled by the movement of the lever through the column-mounted switch rather than by switches inside the lever like for the wipers and washer.

pjtimmer

Thanks I was hoping for you to answer again.

So if I order this switch, #22510733 , I should get the lever with the wires hanging out of it for the wipermotor and washer stuff all in the 11-pin connector, but not the turn signal or headlight because those are operated by the column swicth, correct?

If so, I will try to order tomorrow with the Opel GM dealer.

Also another question offcourse, the linkage plate that attaches to the splined pin comming out of the motor, it looks pretty scary, with the large plates on each other and the spring that goes around, what purpose has that thing, my old motor came with a straight lever/linkage to bolt on to the wiper linkage. This thing has some kind of system but how does it work and what does it do?
I hope you of someone else can help me out here, thanks for all your help.
Peter

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

Yes, according to the parts manual, the lever should come with the wiring.

I've seen the parts of the motor that you describe but I haven't been able to find out the purpose of all the extra parts (springs and such). As far as replacement goes, the procedure for the new style motor is pretty much the same as for older ones - disconnect from the linkage, unbolt and remove. So, I don't think the difference will affect your installation as long as you can make it fit.

The only thing I can think of that might account for the different design is the parking mechanism that I mentioned before.

pjtimmer

Hee there Whitebird00,
need your help bad, please
I ordered the #22510733 lever from a local GM dealer, they just called me and told it came in, and it doesn't have any wiring on it?????? They say I need the switch behind it too?
Do you have any picture or exploided diagram from it with the wiring? Maybe a copy from the page in the parts manual????
What other par number do I need?
Thanks again
Peter from the Netherlands

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

Here is the picture from the parts book. It shows item #6 with a wiring pigtail coming off of it. Item # 6 is described on the next page as "LEVER, T/SIG & HDLP D/SW & WSW & WSWA (BLACK)". This translates from GM-speak to "Lever, Turn Signal and Headlamp Dimmer Switch and Windshield Wiper and Windshield Washer".

If there are no wires on the lever then I don't know how you would get them because they are shown in the diagram and they are not sold separately that I could find.

mySStery_machine

iTrader: (23)

If I'm not mistaken (but probably am) I think that those springs and such that you have come accross are for the high beam function. When I removed my steering wheel from my 94 Z I didn't put those back together correctly and had remove the wheel and replace the spring/paddle setup. Hope it helps and yes, WHITEBIRD needs a monument named after him for all his help.

pjtimmer

I agree on the monument!
But I just went to the GM dealer and I have been looking at a lot of diagrams, they have tried to find out how it works. According to them the electric part is probally in the cover of the wiper motor..but that at the side.
The wiperturnsig. lever goes into a few switches in the steering column one of them is the wiper switch(the others are turnsignal and highbeam), so I ordered that one, pretty expensive but I want this to work: GM part# 26098535
This should work...I hope.
All tips are still welkom, thanks
Peter