"Professional" tuner warning
08-08-2006, 06:36 AM
#1
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"Professional" tuner warning I had one of the more respected tuners in the LA area tune my car last year which I paid $ 650 for (supposedly a combined street & dynotune). The dynosheet showed very nice numbers indeed so I had no reason to be unhappy. However, it did behave a bit strange when driven under normal (not WOT) conditions. As an example, torque down low was almost non-existent which made it a pain to drive. This became more and more noticable and I also had major issues with my idle that constantly hung at 2k for extended periods of time (I approached the tuner with this several times and he "had no clue what it could be").
Unfortunately, I moved away from Cali (europe) shortly after the work was done and had almost no chance of complaining in person.
After a while, and a lot of thread reading, I found out that my TB had been drilled way too much which caused the idle problem. I ended up replacing the TB which solved the problem. I had not told anybody to drill my TB! Cost me app. $ 300 (freight to europe).
I have spent the last couple of months learning how to tune myself with HP Tuners and WB hardware and all I can say is that the "tune" that was done to the car is terrible. I paid $ 650 (+ the new TB) for some changes to the timing table, some [incorrect] VE changes, and a PE table increase up high. Nothing else was done. NO apparent effort was made to actually tune the car and I definitely feel cheated. It's obvious that this person either didn't know how to tune properly or didn't really give a damn since I was a dumb customer who new nothing.
This is a lesson learned for me and possibly a warning to other people who plan on having your cars tuned by a professional - make sure he/she is really a serious professional.
Unfortunately, I moved away from Cali (europe) shortly after the work was done and had almost no chance of complaining in person.
After a while, and a lot of thread reading, I found out that my TB had been drilled way too much which caused the idle problem. I ended up replacing the TB which solved the problem. I had not told anybody to drill my TB! Cost me app. $ 300 (freight to europe).
I have spent the last couple of months learning how to tune myself with HP Tuners and WB hardware and all I can say is that the "tune" that was done to the car is terrible. I paid $ 650 (+ the new TB) for some changes to the timing table, some [incorrect] VE changes, and a PE table increase up high. Nothing else was done. NO apparent effort was made to actually tune the car and I definitely feel cheated. It's obvious that this person either didn't know how to tune properly or didn't really give a damn since I was a dumb customer who new nothing.
This is a lesson learned for me and possibly a warning to other people who plan on having your cars tuned by a professional - make sure he/she is really a serious professional.
.
08-08-2006, 11:16 AM
#6
I will give you guys some input, and hopefully it will allow you to make better decisions as to how you select a tuner. Most tuners will only do dyno tunes (wot passes only) and typically in an hour's time. That is not enough time to fully calibrate the VE Table and MAF Table, as well as the timing table for the most power. There are tables in the code that dictate what AFR ratio to use at a given time/condition. Ask your tuner what he is changing and why, most reputable tuners will explain all of this. If they do not want to at least let you know how they plan to tune your car or answer questions you have, move on. The old way of tuning used to be to butcher the IFR table or butcher the PE table. These are set tables that should not be modified to get the fuel in line, that is what the VE and MAF tables are for ... and should be used to follow the Commanded AFR very closely (verified with a wideband). Good luck with your future tuning, and I hope you others success in finding a reputable tuner. 
This is why I started tuning, I do/did not like what I saw from some "tuners". 
This is why I started tuning, I do/did not like what I saw from some "tuners". 
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08-08-2006, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by 12secSS
I will give you guys some input, and hopefully it will allow you to make better decisions as to how you select a tuner. Most tuners will only do dyno tunes (wot passes only) and typically in an hour's time. That is not enough time to fully calibrate the VE Table and MAF Table, as well as the timing table for the most power. There are tables in the code that dictate what AFR ratio to use at a given time/condition. Ask your tuner what he is changing and why, most reputable tuners will explain all of this. If they do not want to at least let you know how they plan to tune your car or answer questions you have, move on. The old way of tuning used to be to butcher the IFR table or butcher the PE table. These are set tables that should not be modified to get the fuel in line, that is what the VE and MAF tables are for ... and should be used to follow the Commanded AFR very closely (verified with a wideband). Good luck with your future tuning, and I hope you others success in finding a reputable tuner. This is why I started tuning, I do/did not like what I saw from some "tuners".
This is why I started tuning, I do/did not like what I saw from some "tuners".
08-08-2006, 01:28 PM
#9
my personal experience is dont drill the TB, unless there is absolutely no way to get enough air at the motor at idle to make it idle, this usually only happens with very large cams, and large cams in stroker, but for the most part you can tune the think to idle without altering the TB at all.
08-08-2006, 01:29 PM
#10
Originally Posted by goofy
I had one of the more respected tuners in the LA area tune my car last year which I paid $ 650 for (supposedly a combined street & dynotune). The dynosheet showed very nice numbers indeed so I had no reason to be unhappy. However, it did behave a bit strange when driven under normal (not WOT) conditions. As an example, torque down low was almost non-existent which made it a pain to drive. This became more and more noticable and I also had major issues with my idle that constantly hung at 2k for extended periods of time (I approached the tuner with this several times and he "had no clue what it could be").
Unfortunately, I moved away from Cali (europe) shortly after the work was done and had almost no chance of complaining in person.
After a while, and a lot of thread reading, I found out that my TB had been drilled way too much which caused the idle problem. I ended up replacing the TB which solved the problem. I had not told anybody to drill my TB! Cost me app. $ 300 (freight to europe).
I have spent the last couple of months learning how to tune myself with HP Tuners and WB hardware and all I can say is that the "tune" that was done to the car is terrible. I paid $ 650 (+ the new TB) for some changes to the timing table, some [incorrect] VE changes, and a PE table increase up high. Nothing else was done. NO apparent effort was made to actually tune the car and I definitely feel cheated. It's obvious that this person either didn't know how to tune properly or didn't really give a damn since I was a dumb customer who new nothing.
This is a lesson learned for me and possibly a warning to other people who plan on having your cars tuned by a professional - make sure he/she is really a serious professional.
Unfortunately, I moved away from Cali (europe) shortly after the work was done and had almost no chance of complaining in person.
After a while, and a lot of thread reading, I found out that my TB had been drilled way too much which caused the idle problem. I ended up replacing the TB which solved the problem. I had not told anybody to drill my TB! Cost me app. $ 300 (freight to europe).
I have spent the last couple of months learning how to tune myself with HP Tuners and WB hardware and all I can say is that the "tune" that was done to the car is terrible. I paid $ 650 (+ the new TB) for some changes to the timing table, some [incorrect] VE changes, and a PE table increase up high. Nothing else was done. NO apparent effort was made to actually tune the car and I definitely feel cheated. It's obvious that this person either didn't know how to tune properly or didn't really give a damn since I was a dumb customer who new nothing.
This is a lesson learned for me and possibly a warning to other people who plan on having your cars tuned by a professional - make sure he/she is really a serious professional.
08-08-2006, 01:54 PM
#11
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I had my car tuned there and lets say that i will never go back. My afr was commanding at 10.7 and the timing was at 17 degrees. I now have a good friend who does it for me.
08-08-2006, 03:52 PM
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thats why i am having 12secss do hptuners on my car, hopefulyl tomorrow. he treats the tune as if the car was his, i have heard he doesnt just do a quick tune and say see ya later. he has a good rep of taking his time and maing sure u r happy when u leave. hopefully i am not jinxing myself!!!dammmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
08-08-2006, 04:26 PM
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i know its off subject but how difficult is it to learn how to tune? ive already payed 550 fora dynotune and with some extra mods i dont feel like doing it again.
sandro
sandro
08-09-2006, 11:32 AM
#18
Originally Posted by myws6istheshiznit
not too long ago i also posted some issues i had with them. nice to know im not the only one speaking out about this shop
