carlsonauto

Using the on off type of valve has been said to increase the tcc pressure to a point that it damages the converter but I have used them and never seen an issue with this.

I also dont see how the ball being removed can cause more wear and heat. Removing it makes the tcc apply faster which is going to reduce both wear and heat...

Also FWIW I would never rebuild a transmission and reuse a stock converter. Its like takng a shower and putting dirty clothes back on.. It doesnt make much sense to me..

Im in a hurry otherwise I would elaborate a bit more, sorry gotta run..

mrvedit

I am not familiar with any of the trans rebuild videos.
Since you appear to be very meticulous and thorough, you should get the ATSG manual too; I'm sure you will get more use out of it than most other $29 books.
I primarily use the ATSG manuals as a reference when answering questions on this forum, partly to ensure I use the correct part names. Also the illustrations in the ATSG manuals are from GM, which makes it easier to identify parts if you go to the dealer. (For some parts, I find the dealer to be cheaper and faster than anyone else, especially for things like snap-rings, clutch apply/backing plates and other semi-maintenance parts.)

fishcrazy

I think what I read was that the restriction being in was a cause for more heat and wear being generated and that the removal of the ball was an improvement in these factors. I probably said that poorly when I described it. As I understood it from what I read was that the force of the fluid coming out of the shaft was increased therefore causing the TC to lock up quicker and with more force if you will. A firmer shift feel like a gear shift with less slipping. At any rate I dont know exactly what the shudder problem was but I hope that I deal with the cause of that also in this rebuild.

That makes good sense that you would not reuse the TC. I dont feel good about doing it myself. I have no way of knowing just how many miles the unit that is installed has on it and would hate to have to take the trans out again to replace it. I guess I just need to figure what to replace it with. I have had this shudder problem in the past that went away when I put the new synthetic transmissionm fluid and new filter on which makes me think that I may have bought some time on this transmission since it did loose reverse not so long after that. Im thinking that maybe the friction material in the converter is at the end of its life. Or something is because I found quite a bit of fine metal on the magnet in the pan when I did the fluid change. This shudder that I have experienced in the past with this Escalade is what makes me think that I should address the TCC valve and the 0.500 pressure boost valve in this rebuild. I only know to think of these things because you guys brought it up and made me look into it. I just hope I am thinking correctly about this because it is all new to me. Im just trying to learn what to do here.

fishcrazy

I have this feeling that you are righ about the ATSG manual. I really like the GM manual you suggested as it does seem to have a good presentation of the of some important points that they seem to be able to bring to your attention an make you aware of the need to deal with them in a certain way. They help you with the learning curve so to speak. Im a very visual person and find that video is very instructive. That is why I think I am infatuated with the DVD idea.

I thought I might include some pictures as this post progresses as a way to check what I am seeing and get some help from you guys that have more experience with these things. It would probably help all who are following the thread and thinking of doing their own rebuild as well. It looks like I can upload pictures to this site directly. That way you all can see exactly what I am doing and more acuratly assess the situation. It could be good for all who may be trying to learn transmissions as I am.

mrvedit

I and many others include pictures by first uploading them in a max size of 1024x768 to Photobucket.com and then including links to the pictures.

When the time comes, you are welcome to view my 500+ 4L60E pictures in these albums.

Rebuild:
http://s1015.photobucket.com/albums/...60E%20Rebuild/

Disassembly:
http://s1015.photobucket.com/albums/...20Disassembly/

Valve body:
http://s1015.photobucket.com/albums/...0Valve%20Body/

I hope to annotate all the pictures some day, but that may just be a dream. They do help me answer questions on this forum anyway.

mrvedit

If you REALLY want to learn how all the hydraulic circuits and valves work, get the "Hydramatic 4L60-E Technician's Guide", 120 pages of full color hydraulic diagrams and more. Printed ones are about $25-$35 (Google it). I downloaded a PDF version (and printed it) from this site:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/34145767/4L60E

I recall it cost a bit to download, but you can view it for free there. Pretty cool really.

sjsingle1

iTrader: (1)

^^^ got mine cheap off ebay............very nice book

even new its not to expensive

fishcrazy

Thanks for the link. Very cool! Could take some time to absorbe all that info. Some very helpful stuff there. I like hao the narrative explanes how the hydraulics are activated and applied step by step.

There is a 4l60e manual on there to download as well. you know if it is any good?

fishcrazy

I will pay you a million bucks to remove these exhaust nuts from the manifold connection. Im afraid that I am going to break them. They dont appear to be that rusted but they sure dont want to budge. All I have tried is a 15" breaker bar so far. No heat or penetraiting oils or heat yet but Im thinking about getting some PB Blaster and a persuader pipe on it. What if I break it off what is my option then? Or is that the preferred method of removal. Is the remaining bolt hard to then remove? Looking for any suggestions. This sure is FUN! lol

carlsonauto

A little bit of heat on those will go a long way. I dont waste time with penetrating oil mostly because it doesnt do anything and smells bad when you burn it off while heating with a torch..

fishcrazy

Thanks for the tip. I was reluctant to use a torch but its looking like the next resort. Hope I dont set anything ablaze under there! Is leverage recommended? Like a pipe?

carlsonauto

if you make the nut hot enough to glow you shouldnt need any extra leverage. You dont want to break them, that opens a whole other can of worms..

fishcrazy

And I tried that with a propane torch and it just is not hot enough. Any other options? I know if I force it the bolt is going to break. Does that mean I will have to remove the manifold to fix that? Maybe I can rent an oxy/Acetylene torch.

fishcrazy

Got some propalene gas that is hotter. Hope that works.

mrvedit

Good luck.
Personally I would use a medium setting on an impact wrench after letting PB Blaster work for a while. I have three different battery powered impact wrenches now and rarely use my air wrenches any more.
I don't have a torch and therefore don't have any experience with heating. I suspect that when the steel gets red-hot the metal is soft and any rust offers little resistance. Don't know if the propalene gas will get it hot enough.

I pretty much assembly every bolt with anti-seize compound (unless I need Loctite). Its a little messy, but everything comes apart easily even years later.

carlsonauto

Oxy acetylene is the only way to fly. Not sure what I would do without it. We use it almost daily...

fishcrazy

Well I failed to break the nuts on the exhaust but I did not fail to get the exhaust off! If all else fails then get out the SAWZALL. Yes I did place a strategic cut in the pipe that will allow the transmission to drop out. I plan to repair it after the transmission is back in with a Walker Mega Butt Joint Clamp. I know thats cheating but I dont have a Oxyacetalene toarch. Anyway I did get the transfer case out and just need to remove the starter and bell housing bolts and TC bolts to drop the trans. Then the fun begins.

mrvedit

Congrats on the progress! I have those Butt Joint clamps "just in case" but haven't tried them yet.
Remember to disconnect the battery before removing the starter!
A 24mm Socket, 3" extension and a long break bar are needed to turn the crank so that you can remove the TC bolts. Unless you use an impact wrench on the TC bolts, you will need a helper to hold the Crank steady as you untorque the bolts.

fishcrazy

Thanks for the pointers. I need all the help I cann get! I have been looking all over for a reasonable shipping solution for the ATSG Manual but they want more than the manual cost to ship it 2 day. I downloaded the PDF from the ASTG site for the 30 buck cost of the book and I am happier with it on my computer anyway.

Still have to find a t50 plusTorq bit on the shelf around here but Im sure someone has it. Some auto parts places say "what is that?" OH Well!

mrvedit

After reading this thread, I suggest not trying a plain old T50 as it can strip a bolt:

http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/4l60...ts-179348.html

Also see #6 about how to mod a plain T50 if you are desperate:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/automatic...l#post14414324

While the torque specs say to only tighten them to 45 ft/lbs (or so), I recall they are always extra tight from the factory. My 150 ft/lb battery impact wrench did not loosen them; had to use my air wrench. Even though they are Torx, you need to put a lot of body weight into it so that the bit doesn't jump out.

Around 2007 GM switched to an even more unusual type bolt requiring a "Kent-Moore DT-49037-A Driver, Mortorq Spiral Fastener".