What 4L60E Rebuild Kit is Best for my 1995 S10?
06-10-2015, 11:21 AM
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What 4L60E Rebuild Kit is Best for my 1995 S10? I've never rebuilt a transmission but am going to try on my 1995 S10 sometime next month and was wondering what ya'll thought of this master kit. I'm pretty mechanically inclined and have been studying up the ATSG manual and being reading in the forums, but what to make sure I spend my money wisely. It contains a gasket and seal kit, full Raybestos clutches and steals, master bushing kit, 2-4 band and a filter.
http://www.gmtransmissionparts.com/4...ston-lip-seals
The reason I'm rebuilding it is that I've completly lost reverse, so I know my sun shell is bad. Should I replace it with an OEM shell or should I use an upgrade sun shell like this?
http://www.gmtransmissionparts.com/s...4l60e-1982-up/
Other then the master kit and the sun shell are there any other parts I should get before starting the rebuild? I'll have some downtime in July and was hoping to get all the parts here to get it all the way done.
Any advice on this would be great!
Adam
http://www.gmtransmissionparts.com/4...ston-lip-seals
The reason I'm rebuilding it is that I've completly lost reverse, so I know my sun shell is bad. Should I replace it with an OEM shell or should I use an upgrade sun shell like this?
http://www.gmtransmissionparts.com/s...4l60e-1982-up/
Other then the master kit and the sun shell are there any other parts I should get before starting the rebuild? I'll have some downtime in July and was hoping to get all the parts here to get it all the way done.
Any advice on this would be great!
Adam
06-10-2015, 12:53 PM
#2
Upgrade to the Sonnax Smart Shell to replace your broken sun shell.
Replace separator plate with a thicker, harder Transgo one and also consider replacing the steel ***** with imidized ones.
Check your reverse input drum and decide if it needs to be replaced.
Ideally, you'd replace your 20yo torque converter. A generic one will run roughly $200. The folks here will recommend you spend the $400-500 on a basic, well built one. Reason being is that your torque converter is really old and if it goes out, it'll ruin your freshly rebuilt transmission. I went with a basic, well built one from Circle D for $450. I'm sure at least one of the sponsors here will chime in if you consider replacing your torque converter.
Preemptively fix the TCC valve in the valve body to prevent the common code 1870 with either the cheaper and easier deletion of the isolator valve (basically replaces the isolator valve with a bigger spring) or by reaming the bore and "properly" fixing it. People get great results going either direction.
Replace the 3-2 control valve spring which is a known weak point and prone to breaking.
Consider a specialty kit (this isn't a rebuild kit) for a collection of little things. I used the Sonnax Performance Pack. There's a Transgo kit that also has a lot of similar things. I know the Sonnax PP includes pinless accumulator pistons to replace the original (plastic) pistons and the TCC valve fix. People like both of them.
Depending on your budget, replacing both sprags is about $50-60.
My rebuild kit was from trutechtrans, one of the more comprehensive rebuild kits I could find and cost about $250. The one you have listed is pretty comprehensive. One thing I notice is that it doesn't contain the updated bonded steel pistons. One of the forum experts could tell you how important that would be.
GM updated specs says that Dexron VI fluid is the recommended fluid for all transmissions, including the older Dexron III transmissions. AC Delco Dex VI fluid can be had for about $25/gallon.
And here's my rebuild thread, complete with pictures, walkthrough, and a parts list that's got more stuff than you need for a rebuild. I just went overboard for fun and all.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/automatic...ld-thread.html
Since you have an older 4l60e, if you replace the original pistons with bonded steel pistons (highly recommended) you will likely need to update the overrun spring cage because it isn't compatible with the updated bonded steel piston. Check post #34 of my rebuild thread for pictures to determine if you need to update the spring cage. The updated overrun spring cage AC Delco part number is 24206085.
For a video walkthrough, find the transmissionbench videos either on youtube or at the transmissionbench website. Best videos on the internet, free, and about 7 hours of step by step break down and rebuild of a 4l60e.
mrvedit, bbond, and a few others are the resident transmission experts here. I am not an expert, just a regular guy who rebuilt his 4l60e.
There are some specialty tools you'll need, like a spring compressor, pump alignment tool, bushing press, teflon seal installer, feeler gauge, lock ring pliers (not to be confused with snap ring pliers, which you also need), etc. You can make your own spring compressor, pump alignment tool, teflon seal installer, and you can use sockets to press the bushings. You'll also need a really long ratchet extension, 30+ inches, to get to the bell housing bolts. Buy a can of Liquid Wrench and spray the bellhousing and exhaust bolts every day for a couple days. You may be able to remove your transmission without dropping the exhaust pipes. If you don't have to remove the exhaust pipes, don't. They suck. I had to remove mine to get my transmission out of my truck, a 96 C1500.
Not really a specialty tool, but you will need a set of feeler gauges ranging from about 0.0015 to 0.0080.
Recommended extra tools are compressor with a soft tipped air gun to air test the seals and a line pressure gauge to verify correct pressures after you rebuild the transmission.
Get ready to get messy!
Replace separator plate with a thicker, harder Transgo one and also consider replacing the steel ***** with imidized ones.
Check your reverse input drum and decide if it needs to be replaced.
Ideally, you'd replace your 20yo torque converter. A generic one will run roughly $200. The folks here will recommend you spend the $400-500 on a basic, well built one. Reason being is that your torque converter is really old and if it goes out, it'll ruin your freshly rebuilt transmission. I went with a basic, well built one from Circle D for $450. I'm sure at least one of the sponsors here will chime in if you consider replacing your torque converter.
Preemptively fix the TCC valve in the valve body to prevent the common code 1870 with either the cheaper and easier deletion of the isolator valve (basically replaces the isolator valve with a bigger spring) or by reaming the bore and "properly" fixing it. People get great results going either direction.
Replace the 3-2 control valve spring which is a known weak point and prone to breaking.
Consider a specialty kit (this isn't a rebuild kit) for a collection of little things. I used the Sonnax Performance Pack. There's a Transgo kit that also has a lot of similar things. I know the Sonnax PP includes pinless accumulator pistons to replace the original (plastic) pistons and the TCC valve fix. People like both of them.
Depending on your budget, replacing both sprags is about $50-60.
My rebuild kit was from trutechtrans, one of the more comprehensive rebuild kits I could find and cost about $250. The one you have listed is pretty comprehensive. One thing I notice is that it doesn't contain the updated bonded steel pistons. One of the forum experts could tell you how important that would be.
GM updated specs says that Dexron VI fluid is the recommended fluid for all transmissions, including the older Dexron III transmissions. AC Delco Dex VI fluid can be had for about $25/gallon.
And here's my rebuild thread, complete with pictures, walkthrough, and a parts list that's got more stuff than you need for a rebuild. I just went overboard for fun and all.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/automatic...ld-thread.html
Since you have an older 4l60e, if you replace the original pistons with bonded steel pistons (highly recommended) you will likely need to update the overrun spring cage because it isn't compatible with the updated bonded steel piston. Check post #34 of my rebuild thread for pictures to determine if you need to update the spring cage. The updated overrun spring cage AC Delco part number is 24206085.
For a video walkthrough, find the transmissionbench videos either on youtube or at the transmissionbench website. Best videos on the internet, free, and about 7 hours of step by step break down and rebuild of a 4l60e.
mrvedit, bbond, and a few others are the resident transmission experts here. I am not an expert, just a regular guy who rebuilt his 4l60e.
There are some specialty tools you'll need, like a spring compressor, pump alignment tool, bushing press, teflon seal installer, feeler gauge, lock ring pliers (not to be confused with snap ring pliers, which you also need), etc. You can make your own spring compressor, pump alignment tool, teflon seal installer, and you can use sockets to press the bushings. You'll also need a really long ratchet extension, 30+ inches, to get to the bell housing bolts. Buy a can of Liquid Wrench and spray the bellhousing and exhaust bolts every day for a couple days. You may be able to remove your transmission without dropping the exhaust pipes. If you don't have to remove the exhaust pipes, don't. They suck. I had to remove mine to get my transmission out of my truck, a 96 C1500.
Not really a specialty tool, but you will need a set of feeler gauges ranging from about 0.0015 to 0.0080.
Recommended extra tools are compressor with a soft tipped air gun to air test the seals and a line pressure gauge to verify correct pressures after you rebuild the transmission.
Get ready to get messy!
Last edited by coryforsenate; 06-10-2015 at 01:38 PM.
06-10-2015, 03:53 PM
#3
Moderator
Cory is giving good advice. Especially about the bonded pistons and needing the new style spring cage.
The kit you mentioned is not a particularly good value.
Lot of people here have bought their kits from trutechtrans and been very happy - talk to owner Jeff and he will sell you exactly what you need and no more than you need. (I've been trying to get them to be a sponsor here.)
The kit you mentioned is not a particularly good value.
Lot of people here have bought their kits from trutechtrans and been very happy - talk to owner Jeff and he will sell you exactly what you need and no more than you need. (I've been trying to get them to be a sponsor here.)
06-10-2015, 06:07 PM
#4
TECH Addict
In order to help you from spending more than what is necessary, we will need to know a little more about your truck. Has the engine been modified and how will it be used.
Cory is correct in that the 20 year old torque converter should be replaced, but if you are just planning a stock rebuild, then most any generic stock rebuilt torque converter that matches your engine will be fine. Most trans parts supply companies carry a line of these stock rebuilt torque converters. When you would need a high $ torque converter with a billet cover is when you are going with a smaller sized torque converter to gain more stall.
As for your trans, if the only gears that you are missing is reverse most likely the sun shell is not broken and all that has failed is the low/reverse clutches. That being said I’m sure the whole trans is in need of a rebuild.
For a stock rebuild most any kit that includes all gaskets, seals, steels and Borg Warner, Raybestos or Alto clutches will be fine. I prefer TranStar seal and gasket kits but that’s just me. A kit for a 4L65E will give you an extra clutch in the 3-4 clutch pack and all else is the same. Most kits will work and will have what you need, so price around. Don’t forget to get a filter.
The later model bonded steel pistons are easier to install but are not necessary and you will need a different spring cage to install them.
The later model trans came with plastic accumulator pistons that tend to break. I’m not sure on the years but if they are plastic you should replace them with an aluminum piston or the Sonnax pinless accumulator pistons, but be careful the 1-2 pinless piston will not work with a TransGo shift.
If the check ball holes in your separator plate are worn out TransGo makes a good plate.
Your over run sprag should be replaced with a Borg Warner 29 element dual cage unit. It is also a good idea to replace the low/reverse roller clutch. The springs in these get weak.
Still talking about a stock rebuild here, an OE Heat Treated sun shell if your old one shows too much wear, if you have more money in your budget the Sonnax Smart Shell is money well spent but not needed.
On every trans rebuild I at least install a TransGo SK 4L60E JR or the SK 4L60E shift kit. This is more of a shift improver kit than a kit that will give you hard shifts. I also like to install a TransGo NOYOYO kit with the hardened pump rings, it’s just good insurance.
Lastly I like to install a Sonnax .470 OD Reverse boost valve & bushing with o-rings. If a harder shift is wanted go with the .490 OD with o-rings. There are to designs, for a 95 model you will need the earlier one.
I forgot you will also need a bushing kit.
Like Cory says you will need a few tool that are not in most people’s tool box. Cory’s thread is good and has a lot of pics, so check it out.
My above suggestions are for a stock rebuild. It your engine is putting out a good bit more power than stock, some upgrades will be needed in the above parts list.
Here is a list of some of the suppliers that I have used, price around.
TranStar I don’t think they offer a complete kit per say, you just pick and choose what you need.
Makco Transmission Parts
Transmission Parts USA
TruTechTrans
Cory is correct in that the 20 year old torque converter should be replaced, but if you are just planning a stock rebuild, then most any generic stock rebuilt torque converter that matches your engine will be fine. Most trans parts supply companies carry a line of these stock rebuilt torque converters. When you would need a high $ torque converter with a billet cover is when you are going with a smaller sized torque converter to gain more stall.
As for your trans, if the only gears that you are missing is reverse most likely the sun shell is not broken and all that has failed is the low/reverse clutches. That being said I’m sure the whole trans is in need of a rebuild.
For a stock rebuild most any kit that includes all gaskets, seals, steels and Borg Warner, Raybestos or Alto clutches will be fine. I prefer TranStar seal and gasket kits but that’s just me. A kit for a 4L65E will give you an extra clutch in the 3-4 clutch pack and all else is the same. Most kits will work and will have what you need, so price around. Don’t forget to get a filter.
The later model bonded steel pistons are easier to install but are not necessary and you will need a different spring cage to install them.
The later model trans came with plastic accumulator pistons that tend to break. I’m not sure on the years but if they are plastic you should replace them with an aluminum piston or the Sonnax pinless accumulator pistons, but be careful the 1-2 pinless piston will not work with a TransGo shift.
If the check ball holes in your separator plate are worn out TransGo makes a good plate.
Your over run sprag should be replaced with a Borg Warner 29 element dual cage unit. It is also a good idea to replace the low/reverse roller clutch. The springs in these get weak.
Still talking about a stock rebuild here, an OE Heat Treated sun shell if your old one shows too much wear, if you have more money in your budget the Sonnax Smart Shell is money well spent but not needed.
On every trans rebuild I at least install a TransGo SK 4L60E JR or the SK 4L60E shift kit. This is more of a shift improver kit than a kit that will give you hard shifts. I also like to install a TransGo NOYOYO kit with the hardened pump rings, it’s just good insurance.
Lastly I like to install a Sonnax .470 OD Reverse boost valve & bushing with o-rings. If a harder shift is wanted go with the .490 OD with o-rings. There are to designs, for a 95 model you will need the earlier one.
I forgot you will also need a bushing kit.
Like Cory says you will need a few tool that are not in most people’s tool box. Cory’s thread is good and has a lot of pics, so check it out.
My above suggestions are for a stock rebuild. It your engine is putting out a good bit more power than stock, some upgrades will be needed in the above parts list.
Here is a list of some of the suppliers that I have used, price around.
TranStar I don’t think they offer a complete kit per say, you just pick and choose what you need.
Makco Transmission Parts
Transmission Parts USA
TruTechTrans
Last edited by bbond105; 06-10-2015 at 06:18 PM.
06-10-2015, 07:35 PM
#5
Ah, I wrote my post without thinking but as bbond105 said, if you only lost reverse and not 2nd and 4th also, then your sun shell shouldn't be the problem.
It's probably not a bad idea to replace it anyways given that it's a known weak point in older 4l60e transmissions because of a less sturdy collar although as bbond105 said, the Sonnax one is more than what is needed for a daily driver with a stock engine.
The kit I got from trutechtrans came with bushings. And a filter/gasket.
Another thing is that, if your budget allows, let a shop throw your case in a parts cleaner. After a few minutes of scrubbing mine I decided to let a shop do it. It's a lot of work and you'll have your hands full with the rebuild.
It's probably not a bad idea to replace it anyways given that it's a known weak point in older 4l60e transmissions because of a less sturdy collar although as bbond105 said, the Sonnax one is more than what is needed for a daily driver with a stock engine.
The kit I got from trutechtrans came with bushings. And a filter/gasket.
Another thing is that, if your budget allows, let a shop throw your case in a parts cleaner. After a few minutes of scrubbing mine I decided to let a shop do it. It's a lot of work and you'll have your hands full with the rebuild.
06-10-2015, 08:02 PM
#6
TECH Addict
As for cleaning the case I go to the car wash. Spray some digresser on it and go to work. Clean what you can from the outside but the main concern is the inside. As long as the inside of the case is clean that is all that really matters.