Need a new transmission, what are the options?
08-04-2018, 06:53 PM
#1
Staging Lane
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Need a new transmission, what are the options? Well my 4L60E didn't last more than 50 miles after my HCI install. Classic 3/4 gear clutch went out. I went to a transmission shop and they quoted $3200 to fix which i just about fell over after hearing.
So no use in trying to reuse the 4l60e, what can i put in that will hold up and not be a ton of parts and headaches to install?
Thanks!
So no use in trying to reuse the 4l60e, what can i put in that will hold up and not be a ton of parts and headaches to install?
Thanks!
08-04-2018, 08:00 PM
#2
Turbo 400 , FTMFW!!!!! I love mine. It shifts brutally quick and just lasts forever. I had a T400 in my previous head/cam heavy LS1 seda).... same deal, abused the **** out of it.....never missed a beat... fluid was always bright RED.
The best built 4l60e won't even hold a heads/cam LS1 for long, not if you WOT it often. Been there, done that. IDC what anyone says. 4l60e belongs in an unopened tuned LS1, at maximum.
The best built 4l60e won't even hold a heads/cam LS1 for long, not if you WOT it often. Been there, done that. IDC what anyone says. 4l60e belongs in an unopened tuned LS1, at maximum.
08-04-2018, 10:33 PM
#3
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Turbo 400 , FTMFW!!!!! I love mine. It shifts brutally quick and just lasts forever. I had a T400 in my previous head/cam heavy LS1 seda).... same deal, abused the **** out of it.....never missed a beat... fluid was always bright RED.
The best built 4l60e won't even hold a heads/cam LS1 for long, not if you WOT it often. Been there, done that. IDC what anyone says. 4l60e belongs in an unopened tuned LS1, at maximum.
The best built 4l60e won't even hold a heads/cam LS1 for long, not if you WOT it often. Been there, done that. IDC what anyone says. 4l60e belongs in an unopened tuned LS1, at maximum.
08-05-2018, 07:05 PM
#7
I just noticed that you are HCI, so you probably won't like it much with any freeway driving. They usually cruise just fine behind a turbo car, due to not needing much gear. You might be better off with the 80e.
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08-06-2018, 02:31 AM
#8
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Plenty of H/C LS1 cars that are driven aggressively and have top tier 4L60Es holding together for many years. Certainly not my first choice for a strict track mule though.TH400/4L80E is a great unit. No question. But it's not a requirement for every non-stock LS1.
08-06-2018, 10:30 AM
#9
TECH Junkie
I'd be surprised if your HCI car makes over 450 to the tire. Certainly not over 500 to the tire.
500 to the tire through a 60e really isn't that hard anymore. And it will almost always be cheaper than an 80e, especially when you rack of all of the costs involved with doing a swap.
If you still don't like the idea of the 60e...then go 80e and keep your overdrive and lockup converter. The 80e is pretty easy to build and obviously very stout.
500 to the tire through a 60e really isn't that hard anymore. And it will almost always be cheaper than an 80e, especially when you rack of all of the costs involved with doing a swap.
If you still don't like the idea of the 60e...then go 80e and keep your overdrive and lockup converter. The 80e is pretty easy to build and obviously very stout.
08-06-2018, 12:40 PM
#10
TECH Junkie
I just got back from a road course event where I made well over 100+ wot shifts in a very short period of time in my self built 4l60e (with help from a few on here)
My guess is I make more power than the OP and im all but certain I shift higher....7100 rpm's. So if a dope like me can build one to handle a h/c it is pretty much a fact that much more knowledge experts can build a what would be bullet proof one for a h/c ls1.
08-06-2018, 03:25 PM
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I also disagree with this very much. If the Op's 3/4 clutch only lasted 50 miles that is absolutely a builder error.
I just got back from a road course event where I made well over 100+ wot shifts in a very short period of time in my self built 4l60e (with help from a few on here)
My guess is I make more power than the OP and im all but certain I shift higher....7100 rpm's. So if a dope like me can build one to handle a h/c it is pretty much a fact that much more knowledge experts can build a what would be bullet proof one for a h/c ls1.
I just got back from a road course event where I made well over 100+ wot shifts in a very short period of time in my self built 4l60e (with help from a few on here)
My guess is I make more power than the OP and im all but certain I shift higher....7100 rpm's. So if a dope like me can build one to handle a h/c it is pretty much a fact that much more knowledge experts can build a what would be bullet proof one for a h/c ls1.
I think some folks have just had bad experiences and either don't want to believe or refuse to believe that this isn't or doesn't have to be the case for everyone.
08-06-2018, 03:31 PM
#12
Turbo 400 , FTMFW!!!!! I love mine. It shifts brutally quick and just lasts forever. I had a T400 in my previous head/cam heavy LS1 seda).... same deal, abused the **** out of it.....never missed a beat... fluid was always bright RED.
The best built 4l60e won't even hold a heads/cam LS1 for long, not if you WOT it often. Been there, done that. IDC what anyone says. 4l60e belongs in an unopened tuned LS1, at maximum.
The best built 4l60e won't even hold a heads/cam LS1 for long, not if you WOT it often. Been there, done that. IDC what anyone says. 4l60e belongs in an unopened tuned LS1, at maximum.
im sorry but I strongly disagree with you. Not my opinion either, I speak from factual experience. I’m sorry that whomever built your transmissions for you completely failed you. I’ve got many 4l60e’s running around at higher power levels than just a heads and cam car. A heads and cam ls1 is a cakewalk. I have heads and cam in my gto and I give it NO mercy and it holds up and don’t skip a beat. And I did my budget build to mine because if it does fail I can repair it easily. I could not tell you how many full throttle passes I’ve got in my own unit but I assure you, it’s ALOT. heck the one time I went to the track I got ten time slips just from that, hot lapping it. I could build a unit to hold up in a heads and cam car for probably $1500-$1600 no problem.
Id never put a turbo 400 in a car that I’m going to drive. That’s just redneck. If it was a strip only car then yea. If it was a driver that had over 650-700hp then I’d put a 4l80 in it. I just shake my head when people bash on the 4l60 because they had problems because of an incompetent builder.
Sidenote. My car weighs right around 3980lbs with me in it. I shift at 7000rpm. Well I have it set to shift at that in drive and it don’t skip a beat. Guy that works with me also has a gto but his is ls2. He makes about 480rwhp and he gives his no mercy. He traps like 118-119mph. I built his over a year ago. I have some running around I built years ago. So I’m not sure what the deal is.
Last edited by Kfxguy; 08-06-2018 at 03:42 PM.
08-06-2018, 03:44 PM
#13
There are always a few outliers when dealing with any subject, transmissions included. There's a reason why the transmission sub forum is literally caked full of "can't get my 4l60 to work" "here is another 4l60 thread"....now my 4l60 etc etc. I've said it before, but I don't know of a soul that is either serious about performance...or a reasonable lifespan for their transmission that goes out in search for a 4l60.
08-06-2018, 04:26 PM
#14
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You will find plenty of folks doing just fine with H/C LS1 cars and a proper 4L60E. I loved my FLT (then FLP) unit, and I certainly wasn't easy on it. Even in the early '00s they were building durable 4L60Es. That's not to necessarily say that I would purposely seek out a 4L60E to install in a car that didn't come with it originally, but that's a different conversation.
08-06-2018, 04:37 PM
#15
There are always a few outliers when dealing with any subject, transmissions included. There's a reason why the transmission sub forum is literally caked full of "can't get my 4l60 to work" "here is another 4l60 thread"....now my 4l60 etc etc. I've said it before, but I don't know of a soul that is either serious about performance...or a reasonable lifespan for their transmission that goes out in search for a 4l60.
well you can think of transmission builders like you would a surgeon. Some do a good job. Some do a hack job. Anyone is feee to believe what they like, but without a doubt, a heads and cam ls1 is a cakewalk to get a 4l60 to hold up in.
You also have your typical builder like I had building mine a long time ago. He knows how to rebuild it like stock or knows how to repair it. Upgrading it is not in his interest. I imagine most builders are like that. I lied they are a hot rod kind of guy, they don’t care about all the upgrades. About as far as they go is a shift kit and a corvette servo. I personally hate shift kits and believe that most of them cause more problems than they solve. I wrote a nice write up on ls1gto dot com about what works and what don’t. Might be worth a read. I attribute my success to the many failures I’ve seen and figured out what caused them. There’s all kinds of upgrades available for this transmission even tho some cause more harm than good. It’s about finding a good combo, which I have. It’s also about getting the clearances correct and sealing the leaks that the factory allows.
Dont get me wrong, I’m not saying these things will hold 1000hp, because I don’t believe they will. I don’t buy into the level 57 super crazy ultimate blah blah blah 1000hp units. But I do believe that 600-700 is doable. I try to be realistic and to me, 1000hp isn’t realistic. Now just because your buddy has a cruiser that makes 1000hp and had one of these in it and drives it all over and has been for a couple years but never gets on it.....that don’t count. I’m talking about the guys like me, that like to stick it to the floor every chance they get. Will it last forever? No. But at pretty stout power levels it should last a couple or more years.
08-06-2018, 04:50 PM
#16
Thats the thing, a hack can replace parts and drill a few holes and have a 800hp th400.
08-06-2018, 05:42 PM
#17
TECH Junkie
The reason is because this site is primarily populated with LS1 vehicles which came stock with this unit. Poor aftermarket builds or weak/tired/over-stressed factory original units are not the same as a proper aftermarket build that's suited for the application.
You will find plenty of folks doing just fine with H/C LS1 cars and a proper 4L60E. I loved my FLT (then FLP) unit, and I certainly wasn't easy on it. Even in the early '00s they were building durable 4L60Es. That's not to necessarily say that I would purposely seek out a 4L60E to install in a car that didn't come with it originally, but that's a different conversation.
You will find plenty of folks doing just fine with H/C LS1 cars and a proper 4L60E. I loved my FLT (then FLP) unit, and I certainly wasn't easy on it. Even in the early '00s they were building durable 4L60Es. That's not to necessarily say that I would purposely seek out a 4L60E to install in a car that didn't come with it originally, but that's a different conversation.
I don't really know of a overdrive transmission by any manufacture that would with stand abuse that Ls1's went through and that would fit in a vette and 4th gen of the same era. Mustang's had 210 whp to worry about
I guess I would ask what transmission should they have put in Ls vette and Ls f-body's?
4l80's are not easy fits and a th400 would have been foolish from the factory.
08-06-2018, 06:15 PM
#18
yea and a hack would take his overdrive out of his late model car and put a dated three sped in it and make it no longer a pleasure to drive. Who the hell wants to be turning 3000 rpm at 60mph? I don’t. That’s taking backwards steps. Of course it lasts longer, it least it would certainly seem like it, because you won’t drive the damn thing near as much as you normally would if you had an overdrive.
08-06-2018, 06:20 PM
#19
yea and a hack would take his overdrive out of his late model car and put a dated three sped in it and make it no longer a pleasure to drive. Who the hell wants to be turning 3000 rpm at 60mph? I don’t. That’s taking backwards steps. Of course it lasts longer, it least it would certainly seem like it, because you won’t drive the damn thing near as much as you normally would if you had an overdrive.
08-06-2018, 06:46 PM
#20
yea, either you have no gear in the car or tall tires. Be for real guy, someone with a 11 or 12 second naturally aspirated car with a small block is not going to be ideal running a 3 speed. Now, say you have a car that traps 140 plus, well yea you could get away with it if the car is tame enough. If your trapping over 140 then chances are your gearing where the rpm will be lower. I can’t believe people on this forum are trying to convince a guy with a very mild setup that he needs a turbo 400. Laughable.