B&M shifter
02-20-2012, 08:26 PM
#3
I agree with DMM.
B&M is the sheeit! gotta be your bushings or somethings loose. Make sure everything is torqued down everywhere. Dont listen to the people who say to leave the linkage bolt at the bottom loose. That's only if you have the crappy stock bushings, They are weak and will bind if torqued too much, limiting movement.. The B&M fixed that with metal bushings, so tighten away. Mine is TIGHT. no issues. Same goes for the 2 bolts that hold the shifter base down to the plate (tighten the nuts from under the car), and the 2 that are just under the foam in the middle of the plate. torque those to the max. If that doesn't do it, you may have other issues, or, sometimes you just have to double clutch it and reset the synchros. I've found that a drop into 4th resets everything nicely before entry into 1st or R.
B&M is the sheeit! gotta be your bushings or somethings loose. Make sure everything is torqued down everywhere. Dont listen to the people who say to leave the linkage bolt at the bottom loose. That's only if you have the crappy stock bushings, They are weak and will bind if torqued too much, limiting movement.. The B&M fixed that with metal bushings, so tighten away. Mine is TIGHT. no issues. Same goes for the 2 bolts that hold the shifter base down to the plate (tighten the nuts from under the car), and the 2 that are just under the foam in the middle of the plate. torque those to the max. If that doesn't do it, you may have other issues, or, sometimes you just have to double clutch it and reset the synchros. I've found that a drop into 4th resets everything nicely before entry into 1st or R.
02-20-2012, 10:14 PM
#5
TECH Fanatic
One other thing it could be....when you put it in 4th gear, how much play do you have side to side? The shift linkage attaches to the transmission shift rail by means of a ball and socket joint, and in their infinite wisdom, they installed a $0.00001 nylon cup in there which splits and allows additional movement...making reverse the hardest gear to get into.
02-21-2012, 08:27 AM
#7
One other thing it could be....when you put it in 4th gear, how much play do you have side to side? The shift linkage attaches to the transmission shift rail by means of a ball and socket joint, and in their infinite wisdom, they installed a $0.00001 nylon cup in there which splits and allows additional movement...making reverse the hardest gear to get into.
Trust me. I have the tightest shifter of probably any 1st gen V. No play in or out of gear.
edit: stock, non race car 1st gen...
Last edited by Cadzilla; 02-21-2012 at 09:30 AM.
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02-21-2012, 06:43 PM
#10
TECH Fanatic
Could not find an exact pic of what we have...the bushing is plastic/nylon from the factory. Our shift linkage attaches to the trans external shift rail which transfers to the internal shift rail via ball and socket joint with a bushing preventing metal/metal contact. The bronze bushing is an excellent upgrade. Mine has about 1 1/2" of play at 60k miles. I'll get to it later.....
02-21-2012, 06:45 PM
#11
TECH Fanatic
You could be right, but there would be play in the linkage. If the linkage is tight, it is the internal bushing. Have to climb under and grab the linkage where it connects to the external rail and see exactly where the play is.
02-23-2012, 07:48 PM
#15
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$22 for the bushing. So if I understand this correctly, this bushing will cure the side to side slop on the shifter? I have CS shifter plate bushings and a B&M shifter. The side to slide play absolutely annoys me. I want the feel to be just as solid as my Camaro's T-56.
02-29-2012, 01:02 AM
#17
Could not find an exact pic of what we have...the bushing is plastic/nylon from the factory. Our shift linkage attaches to the trans external shift rail which transfers to the internal shift rail via ball and socket joint with a bushing preventing metal/metal contact. The bronze bushing is an excellent upgrade. Mine has about 1 1/2" of play at 60k miles. I'll get to it later.....
That plate, where the rod enters the trans- has 4 bolts and some kind of threaded bolt in it, as well as some rtv at the seam. I want to take it off now, but I need to know if I really need to and what I'm getting into. What is that threaded bolt? Preload tensioner?.. What is the torque spec of those 4 bolts?
I'll have to post all my pics to give you all a better idea of what I've done, including bushings at base of the stalk(b&m/pisnuoff), bushings on the side linkage under the shift plate(uuc/cs etc), bushings at trans for side linkage(home depot), brass bushings at center linkage where it meets the trans rod(replaces the plastic where the linkage rod stem goes through and is held by ac clip-pisnuoff), new pin at the swivel where the rod protrudes from trans(custom, already tight but will probably jbweld all inside the swivel here just to make damn sure-haven't decided yet), and ,now, although it's basically tight with no play at the ****, some bushing inside the trans?... Unless someone is confused. That is the list, that's it.
02-29-2012, 02:47 PM
#18
Wait wait, That middle pic- did you take that apart? It looks like the top plate removed and flipped upside down correct? You're saying there's another bushing INSIDE the damn trans?
That plate, where the rod enters the trans- has 4 bolts and some kind of threaded bolt in it, as well as some rtv at the seam. I want to take it off now, but I need to know if I really need to and what I'm getting into. What is that threaded bolt? Preload tensioner?.. What is the torque spec of those 4 bolts?
I'll have to post all my pics to give you all a better idea of what I've done, including bushings at base of the stalk(b&m/pisnuoff), bushings on the side linkage under the shift plate(uuc/cs etc), bushings at trans for side linkage(home depot), brass bushings at center linkage where it meets the trans rod(replaces the plastic where the linkage rod stem goes through and is held by ac clip-pisnuoff), new pin at the swivel where the rod protrudes from trans(custom, already tight but will probably jbweld all inside the swivel here just to make damn sure-haven't decided yet), and ,now, although it's basically tight with no play at the ****, some bushing inside the trans?... Unless someone is confused. That is the list, that's it.
That plate, where the rod enters the trans- has 4 bolts and some kind of threaded bolt in it, as well as some rtv at the seam. I want to take it off now, but I need to know if I really need to and what I'm getting into. What is that threaded bolt? Preload tensioner?.. What is the torque spec of those 4 bolts?
I'll have to post all my pics to give you all a better idea of what I've done, including bushings at base of the stalk(b&m/pisnuoff), bushings on the side linkage under the shift plate(uuc/cs etc), bushings at trans for side linkage(home depot), brass bushings at center linkage where it meets the trans rod(replaces the plastic where the linkage rod stem goes through and is held by ac clip-pisnuoff), new pin at the swivel where the rod protrudes from trans(custom, already tight but will probably jbweld all inside the swivel here just to make damn sure-haven't decided yet), and ,now, although it's basically tight with no play at the ****, some bushing inside the trans?... Unless someone is confused. That is the list, that's it.
03-05-2012, 12:31 AM
#20
For the purposes of what some have suggested in this thread, ie 'shifter cup' bushing, after researching it appears this cup piece is different for the various t56's out there and ours is a remote mount, not a direct on top of the trans shifter linkage.. I'd like to see
Now that I've removed the plate and seen how it connects, I think the cup liner either can't be replaced, or it might be a real pain. The piece that snaps into this cup sort of 'suctions' in past a point and holds.. I don't see how a new sleeve of firmer material would allow it it to slip past and lock in...if that makes sense. Here are a few pics of this shift cup and the rod. I don't think I'm messing with it. There's a tiny bit of play that can be attributed to this, but it's VERY minimal. What I thought was the last bit of play is already gone without any modifications to this.
All the other stuff I listed did not involve this but still firmed up the shifter 99% compared to stock. Here are some other pics to help explain:
first thing to fix is linkage at the bottom of the shift stalk. My b&m came with a new bushing and sleeve made of metal so that took away the slop here. I also bought a carriage bolt to replace the threaded stock bolt. (there are replacements available from other forum members that improve stock feel)
next would be the bushings that connect at the outer linkage just under the shift plate, pictured here on the side linkage arms. These firmer bushings from UUC or CS tighten up the side to side feel somewhat, making 1st and 5th/6th easier. Many times a short shifter will make such an improvement that these are not a big impact but still a necessary piece of the process to get the firmest shifting.
next would be the bushings at the other end of the same outer linkage pieces mentioned above, where they connect to the trans. The stock bushings are rubber, I replaced them with some fabbed up electrical PVC pieces from Home Depot, taking all of the side to side play out of these linkage arms.
circled in red on the trans here
next is the plastic bushing where the center linkage connects to the rod that protrudes from the trans. There is a swivel piece that connects to this protruding rod with a pin (ill get to that shortly). You basically drill out the plastic bushing and install the brass bushings in either side, and replace the linkage rod, which is held in with a c-clip piece. pisnuoff/brian/07-ctsv can probably provide a set of these for you. It did take some of the slop out and is necessary in the total package.
here's a few of the process pics together
Everything above helped tremendously, but I still had 1/2 to 3/4 inch of play at the ****...so I tracked it to a the swivel piece that attaches to the rod that protrudes from the trans. This swivel piece is connected by a vertical pin, this pin is held in by a snap ring. There is a tiny bit of play here, which translates to alot of play at the ****. I verified nothing would be affected when fusing this part- all your shift linkage does is rotate this shaft clockwise/counderclockwise/back/and forth. There are probably several ways to remedy this play, and I contemplated drilling out the holes and using a thicker pin, but #1- the metal that trans shaft is made of laughed at every drill bit I had and #2, there's already very very minute amount of play here so I didn't see getting it tighter with a new pin that would just get loose over time. So, I decided to invert it and fill it with JB weld, coating the pin as well. That is hard as a rock, but I may get it tack welded to make sure the JB never gives way, although it is rated to like 600 degrees and some stupid psi number.
filled it up,
took off that plate from the trans and mounted it upside down to get it all filled in.
making sure it was straight
lastly, what I posted up top, this internal bushing/cup thing...I think it might be a lost cause.
I took a video of the play prior to jbwelding that swivel piece, and I'll take another and post them when I get it all mocked up/bolted back together to show the difference in play (or lack thereof)....
Now that I've removed the plate and seen how it connects, I think the cup liner either can't be replaced, or it might be a real pain. The piece that snaps into this cup sort of 'suctions' in past a point and holds.. I don't see how a new sleeve of firmer material would allow it it to slip past and lock in...if that makes sense. Here are a few pics of this shift cup and the rod. I don't think I'm messing with it. There's a tiny bit of play that can be attributed to this, but it's VERY minimal. What I thought was the last bit of play is already gone without any modifications to this.
All the other stuff I listed did not involve this but still firmed up the shifter 99% compared to stock. Here are some other pics to help explain:
first thing to fix is linkage at the bottom of the shift stalk. My b&m came with a new bushing and sleeve made of metal so that took away the slop here. I also bought a carriage bolt to replace the threaded stock bolt. (there are replacements available from other forum members that improve stock feel)
next would be the bushings that connect at the outer linkage just under the shift plate, pictured here on the side linkage arms. These firmer bushings from UUC or CS tighten up the side to side feel somewhat, making 1st and 5th/6th easier. Many times a short shifter will make such an improvement that these are not a big impact but still a necessary piece of the process to get the firmest shifting.
next would be the bushings at the other end of the same outer linkage pieces mentioned above, where they connect to the trans. The stock bushings are rubber, I replaced them with some fabbed up electrical PVC pieces from Home Depot, taking all of the side to side play out of these linkage arms.
circled in red on the trans here
next is the plastic bushing where the center linkage connects to the rod that protrudes from the trans. There is a swivel piece that connects to this protruding rod with a pin (ill get to that shortly). You basically drill out the plastic bushing and install the brass bushings in either side, and replace the linkage rod, which is held in with a c-clip piece. pisnuoff/brian/07-ctsv can probably provide a set of these for you. It did take some of the slop out and is necessary in the total package.
here's a few of the process pics together
Everything above helped tremendously, but I still had 1/2 to 3/4 inch of play at the ****...so I tracked it to a the swivel piece that attaches to the rod that protrudes from the trans. This swivel piece is connected by a vertical pin, this pin is held in by a snap ring. There is a tiny bit of play here, which translates to alot of play at the ****. I verified nothing would be affected when fusing this part- all your shift linkage does is rotate this shaft clockwise/counderclockwise/back/and forth. There are probably several ways to remedy this play, and I contemplated drilling out the holes and using a thicker pin, but #1- the metal that trans shaft is made of laughed at every drill bit I had and #2, there's already very very minute amount of play here so I didn't see getting it tighter with a new pin that would just get loose over time. So, I decided to invert it and fill it with JB weld, coating the pin as well. That is hard as a rock, but I may get it tack welded to make sure the JB never gives way, although it is rated to like 600 degrees and some stupid psi number.
filled it up,
took off that plate from the trans and mounted it upside down to get it all filled in.
making sure it was straight
lastly, what I posted up top, this internal bushing/cup thing...I think it might be a lost cause.
I took a video of the play prior to jbwelding that swivel piece, and I'll take another and post them when I get it all mocked up/bolted back together to show the difference in play (or lack thereof)....
Last edited by Cadzilla; 03-05-2012 at 02:30 AM.