robbied31

iTrader: (1)

I got my Hooker swap headers in tonight. got excited to go see how they fit....



So I took them into the garage to see if I could bolt them up quickly.....
They hit my floor. I can't get all the bolts in because they hit the floor of the car....

Drivers side....




Passenger side....




Do I beat the floor up, return these to summit [if I can] and find headers that are longer before they flatten out, or what?

This is the first "Costly" mistake so far.

Thanks

Rob

jomomma

iTrader: (39)

oh boy..... if you do decide to return them, make sure you get some good measurements off of them first! is there anyway to "adjust" your motor mounts?

1FastBrick

iTrader: (16)

Are they actually made for this application or something that was supposed to be close enough???

pist0lpete

iTrader: (3)

I should have forseen this issue with as high as you have the engine mounted. My headers are very close to the floorpan and my oilpan is less than an inch off the crossmember with the F-body pan. Thats a bummer I would look into moving the engine down or possibly find some headers that hang lower.

Edit: Just saw your PM I don't know if I would be able to check the part number maybe if I can dig up the receipt. However, as I mentioned above mine are very close to the pan as well.

robbied31

iTrader: (1)

I can "adjust" anything at this point. Double check my thinking on all this please........ The engine is where it sits now due to oil pan to cross member to tie rod clearance. This is only 1/2" higher than the stock '67 mounts would have put it. But I believe that is higher than Pist0lpete and John67 put there's. The passenger side head is about 3/4" from the firewall. Also, then engine is sitting at the angle it is because I put the car at the angle I want it to sit when it is all said and done, and I then fabbed up the trans cross member to get the engine to sit at right about 4* down to the back.

What angle is your engine sitting at? Also, did you remove all the washers from under your motor mount, or do you run like the early pics show in your build thread? If you are still running with all the washers and the stock '68 and later frame stands, I am not [shouldn't be by my calculations] much higher than you. If you did in fact find a way to get the engine lower, than I am sitting higher than you.

These are the Hooker LS1 swap headers, part #2289-1HKR. They say that "Their" conversion plates need to be used for these headers to fit, but they certainly don't say which mounts and stands to use.

Stealth71 just suggested replacing body mount bushings which turns a light bulb on in my head. I wonder if the Previous owner of my car maybe took this thing apart and didn't put the bushings in or if the bushings are just shot. He took a lot of ***** apart and just loosely put things back together. That would explain a lot to me about why I am having issues that some of you others didn't.......hmmmmmm

Rob

1FastBrick

iTrader: (16)

you should deffinatly replace the body bushing. even though some of mine had been replaced they were still roting. But i am not sure you would gain that mucheven if you went with the polly bushings. Maybe at best I would say another 1/2 inch... but only time will tell also check the mounting points on the frame... there notrise for roting out or being damaged to some degree.

stealth71

iTrader: (15)

I see body mounts in there, although they are probably worn.


Looking through the thread your motor is a little high and forward compared to some of the other setups. Most people come nowhere near close to fitting the A/C compressor.

robbied31

iTrader: (1)

hmmmmm, But yet my passenger side head is 3/4" off the firewall. And I don't think lowering the engine 1/2" [or even an inch for that matter] allows me to move the engine further back........ does it?

This is what confuses me. It seems I am doing something totally different than the others who did this before me or I have a different setup than at least pist0lpete and john67 because none of my reference points jibe with theirs judging from reading their threads.

If it was easy, anyone could do it, right?

Thanks for the input

Rob

robbied31

iTrader: (1)

I went home today at lunch to look and see how I can lower my engine and trans. I started thinking I need to bite the bullet and get an F-Body oil pan and get this thing lower. I have done a lot of work to get it where it sits now, but I am not so stubborn that if I have it wrong that I won't go back to the beginning and start over. I pulled the engine to compare where the CTSV pan hits the cross member with a printout of the F-Body pan.........

as I was jacking the front of the car up by the cross member, I noticed that the front of the frame flexes quite a bit. I started to look for why it flexes so much and I found this crack in the passenger side frame. I don't think this is why the frame was flexing, I think the frame just flexes. But this cannot be good......









Is this something that can just be welded and gusseted?

Rob

1FastBrick

iTrader: (16)

bummer... that frame has been in a wreck. your front half of the frame is pushed up Thats why the headers dont fit. I would try and find a replacement... or take it to a good frame shop.

pist0lpete

iTrader: (3)

I agree with 1FastBrick looks like your car has some frame damage beyond just the cracks there. At the very least you should try and find the stock specs and do some measuring to see if it is indeed out of spec. That is a definite bummer I feel for ya.

1FastBrick

iTrader: (16)

Lets just say I am well trained in automotive collision repair field. I also used to be heavily into chevelle's. If you can give me a few days I can get you specs for that frame. I know some one who has a collection of that stuff for old cars.

pist0lpete

iTrader: (3)

I have seen the frame spec sheet posted over on team chevelle before I just haven't taken the time to search for it. If you find it and post it I will have to be sure and save it this time.

1FastBrick

iTrader: (16)

This is old school stuff on paper.... But If you need it I can get you and him a copy

robbied31

iTrader: (1)

Hi Guys,
I will take anything I can get as far as specs. What do you guys see from my pics that I don't? Just a visual inspection of the frame doesn't show any impact points or abnormal bends/dents/turns. One side of the frame looks like the other, except of course the crack. I just don't see anything that would make you say 'this thing was hit here'. Maybe this thing was launched like the dukes of hazard and bent and broke the frame. I am not an expert [as you guys already know] I would just think there would be more evidence [No CSI here either] if impacted. I will go search on team chevelle for specs.

This is a huge set back! If/when I find specs, I assume it would be best to have the body off the frame to check, correct? If so, I will start heading in that direction....

This would definitely explain all my confusion as to why my build's reference points didn't jibe with any of yours [Pist0lpete] and John67's.

I have found a '66 frame on craiglist in Bakersfield. My research say's the '67 and '66 frames have the same dimensions. Can anyone confirm this?

Once again......Thank you for all the help.

Rob

1FastBrick

iTrader: (16)

Yes, you should be ok 66-67 frame. I would not pull the body just yet. there is not always direct evedince that a frame has been hit. As far as Gm frames in General go, there really soft in that front kick up area. Its hard for the average person to see very minor damage. It's hard to explian but from what I see It looks like it was wrecked. Maybe not major but enough to bend the frame... That's most likely the root cause of the "crack"

67Mal

66-67 frames are the same except rear spring pockets in the frames.
67 takes pigtail at top 66 does not have pigtail (use 66 springs w/66 frame).
I have a 66 Elcomino frame under my 67 Coupe, rear section had to be shortened
under trunk area.
I think cracks in that area of our frames may be common just from stress.
http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=259972

pist0lpete

iTrader: (3)

My reasoning was that in the bottom pic the frame looks a bit sunken in just to the left of the crack. I am just going off memory as I am not looking at my frame right now but I did not remember it looking quite like that. While you are looking into frames you may want to consider an El-Camino frame like 67mal used since they are fully boxed but it will take a little more work as far as shortening the rear of the frame under the trunk.

robbied31

iTrader: (1)

Pist0lpete,
to the left of the crack on the bottom pic does look a little funky in the pic, but it does have a definite factory contour there. It looks exactly the same on the passenger side. Hard to tell because the pics are different....


I know there are differences from side to side, but for the most part, whatever you see on the drivers side you see on the passenger side. I have a couple buddies with Chevelles and one of them has had a couple stress cracks over the years. He welds them up and gussets them. My other buddy say's he has seen a lot of stress crack too. He is a 4x4 guy so they just weld everything up and move forward.

I have a good resolution 66 spec pic. still hoping to find a good 67 spec pic. I am going to pull the body and check against specs. If all is well, I will get it welded, gusseted and continue. If it doesn't match specs, then I will be looking for a replacement.

One step forward, two steps back...........

Rob

stealth71

iTrader: (15)

Snowball effect. Sounds like a PITA, but in the end it will be worth the extra work. You never know what you're getting into until it all comes apart.