89 Trans Am GTA LS1 t56 swap
02-26-2011, 06:43 PM
#1
89 Trans Am GTA LS1 t56 swap So I had a black 89 GTA in high school. It had Tan leather interior but I always wanted black leather. It was actually originally white but someone had painted it black. I ended up selling that one before I went to Wyoming tech in '01, but I've always keep an eye out for a black one with black leather interior. Who knew they were so hard to find lol. I've only seen a hand full and they were all on ebay. I ended up seeing a black on black 89 on ebay around Christmas of '07. I was in Iraq at the time and it was at Montana Muscle in Stevensville MT. It's only about 4 hrs from where I live, they have a whole yard full of 2nd gen TAs. So I bought it and had my dad pick it up for me. I was just going to leave it stock and drive it while I build my 67, but the engine started knocking and I happened to score a heck of a deal on a wrecked 00 TA. Looking back I shoulda just bought a cheap body since I want to replace everything that makes it a GTA. But now it's worth so much less than what I paid it wouldn't be worth selling it and buying a cheaper one, and even if I rebuild the short block I wouldn't get much more out of it. So LS1 swap it is!
Here's the GTA
The interior is pretty good other than some cracks in the seats
Here's the 00 I'm using for a donor.
Bought the whole thing for less than what the engine and trans are worth from a Marine that was about to deploy and just wanted it gone. Somebody had rear ended him. It only has 55,000 miles and was in great shape.
Here's the GTA
The interior is pretty good other than some cracks in the seats
Here's the 00 I'm using for a donor.
Bought the whole thing for less than what the engine and trans are worth from a Marine that was about to deploy and just wanted it gone. Somebody had rear ended him. It only has 55,000 miles and was in great shape.
Last edited by t_raven; 07-31-2017 at 08:36 AM.
02-26-2011, 06:55 PM
#3
I was originally planning to put the engine, transmission and interior from the donor into my 69 so the donor is already stripped, but I've decided to hold off on the 69 and get the 89 ready for summer.
Here's when I dropped the engine out of the 00
I was hoping to get in on the GP for some Hawk's swap headers but I can't justify it at the moment and they are only offering 10% off the 1 3/4 headers so I'll wait and hopefully get some later on.
My plans are to eliminate the emissions equipment, clean up the engine bay, elimate anything I don't need and hide what I can. I have a set of C6 wheels I'll put on later. I want to get drop spindles, bigger brakes, Koni struts, subframe connectors, UMI caster/camper plates. I might use the 4th gen seats but they aren't perfect so maybe I'll just keep the stock ones until I can recover them later on.
Here's when I dropped the engine out of the 00
I was hoping to get in on the GP for some Hawk's swap headers but I can't justify it at the moment and they are only offering 10% off the 1 3/4 headers so I'll wait and hopefully get some later on.
My plans are to eliminate the emissions equipment, clean up the engine bay, elimate anything I don't need and hide what I can. I have a set of C6 wheels I'll put on later. I want to get drop spindles, bigger brakes, Koni struts, subframe connectors, UMI caster/camper plates. I might use the 4th gen seats but they aren't perfect so maybe I'll just keep the stock ones until I can recover them later on.
Last edited by t_raven; 07-31-2017 at 08:41 AM.
02-27-2011, 09:10 AM
#6
I ordered the swap mounts from hawksthirdgenpart.com
http://www.hawksthirdgenparts.com/82...ountspair.aspx
I'm going to make my own transmission crossmember. The ones being sold don't give enough room for exhaust and they are too expensive for what they are.
I ordered a bunch of braided sleeving from this guy on ebay to do my harness with
http://stores.ebay.com/FURRYLETTERS/...=p4634.c0.m322
I'm going to get a Tick master cylinder and remote bleeder now that I know a couple guys have used them on 3rd gens. I'll stick with the stock clutch for now but the rear main is leaking so I'll replace it before I put the engine in.
http://www.hawksthirdgenparts.com/82...ountspair.aspx
I'm going to make my own transmission crossmember. The ones being sold don't give enough room for exhaust and they are too expensive for what they are.
I ordered a bunch of braided sleeving from this guy on ebay to do my harness with
http://stores.ebay.com/FURRYLETTERS/...=p4634.c0.m322
I'm going to get a Tick master cylinder and remote bleeder now that I know a couple guys have used them on 3rd gens. I'll stick with the stock clutch for now but the rear main is leaking so I'll replace it before I put the engine in.
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02-27-2011, 03:28 PM
#9
Yeah it was easy enough to pull it out the top. I'll have to notch the K member for the AC compressor but I'm sure I can do it in place so no need to drop it. I woulda pulled the LS1 out the top of the 4th gen if it were easier but out the bottom was easy enough.
I finished pulling my engine harness
When I parked the car in 08 the AC had a full charge but when I pulled the engine there wasn't much in there. Not sure if this was done before or if I did it when pulling the engine. The oil makes me think one of the trans cooler lines did it, I did bend the crap out of them lol. It doesn't look like it made a hole in the tube but depending on what a new ones costs I might just replace it while I'm at it.
Here's my harness stripped of all conduit
And here it is after removing what I know I don't need. There is probably more to remove but I need to look at some diagrams first.
The pile of wires I removed so far
This is the gromet for where the harness passes into the passenger foot well. I've seen guys cut the wires on both sides but I decided to take it apart and remove all the wires before I started cutting anything. It's full of like a hard glue but it all broke apart pretty easy. I'm hoping I can mount my PCM where the orignal ECU was and reuse this gromet on the new harness.
I finished pulling my engine harness
When I parked the car in 08 the AC had a full charge but when I pulled the engine there wasn't much in there. Not sure if this was done before or if I did it when pulling the engine. The oil makes me think one of the trans cooler lines did it, I did bend the crap out of them lol. It doesn't look like it made a hole in the tube but depending on what a new ones costs I might just replace it while I'm at it.
Here's my harness stripped of all conduit
And here it is after removing what I know I don't need. There is probably more to remove but I need to look at some diagrams first.
The pile of wires I removed so far
This is the gromet for where the harness passes into the passenger foot well. I've seen guys cut the wires on both sides but I decided to take it apart and remove all the wires before I started cutting anything. It's full of like a hard glue but it all broke apart pretty easy. I'm hoping I can mount my PCM where the orignal ECU was and reuse this gromet on the new harness.
Last edited by t_raven; 07-31-2017 at 08:45 AM.
02-27-2011, 05:34 PM
#12
I sat here debating it for about an hour but I just ordered a Tick master cylinder and stage 2 Monster clutch package. I ordered ARP flywheel bolts too. It's a big chunk of change but I need to replace the rear main which means I'd need flywheel bolts anyway. If I'm going to spend $50 why not spend $1100 right? lol. I don't even want to mess with a stock master cylinder so I was definitely going to get the Tick MC and remote bleader. Since I'm trying to sell my 01 TA and I think it needs a clutch, rather than buy a new one I'll put the Monster clutch in the 89 and since that stock clutch only has 55k miles on it maybe I'll put it in the 01 if it's not sold by the time I get around to it.
02-27-2011, 07:07 PM
#14
I sat here debating it for about an hour but I just ordered a Tick master cylinder and stage 2 Monster clutch package. I ordered ARP flywheel bolts too. It's a big chunk of change but I need to replace the rear main which means I'd need flywheel bolts anyway. If I'm going to spend $50 why not spend $1100 right? lol. I don't even want to mess with a stock master cylinder so I was definitely going to get the Tick MC and remote bleader. Since I'm trying to sell my 01 TA and I think it needs a clutch, rather than buy a new one I'll put the Monster clutch in the 89 and since that stock clutch only has 55k miles on it maybe I'll put it in the 01 if it's not sold by the time I get around to it.
02-27-2011, 07:46 PM
#15
Are you the same Pocket from thirdgen.org? If so thank you very much for all the wiring info you've posted over there. I just reread the whole "how to prep a 3rd gen harness" yesterday before I started taking mine apart today.
The fender grommet I cut on both sides and pop the glue/wire cluster out as a whole when running the harness the stock route behind the fender. Some like a cleaner install from drilling a small hole under the HVAC box and running through there. Then I take the grommet with cut wires and use it as a plug for the hole behind the fender
02-28-2011, 11:09 PM
#16
Well since my stuff from Tick Performance is on the way I decided to removed the old clutch and flywheel first thing this morning. I had to get it out of my 69. I was originally going to put it in there but I've decided to get the 89 done first since it's in good shape, and take my time doing the body work on the 69. I'll find another LS1 or something down the road when funds allow.
Pulled the trans off the engine
Here are the clutch, PP and FW
I was expecting it to look better with only 55k miles on it. The car was drivable when I bought it but I only pulled it on and off a trailer so I don't know how good the clutch was. Anybody that knows clutches think it would be worth putting it in my 2001 TA?
I went to the Chevy dealer to get a rear main seal and oil filter and swung by Napa to get some brake cleaner, so while I was out I went and pulled the tank and fuel line out of the donor. I'm working on the 89 in a big storage unit and I have the parts car and a couple others sitting where my dad works.
Old rear main out and new one before I put it in
Transmission was filthy
If it wasn't for the snow drifts in front of my storage unit I probably would've taken the engine and trans and pressure washed them, but a couple cans of brake cleaner got it clean enough
Pulled the trans off the engine
Here are the clutch, PP and FW
I was expecting it to look better with only 55k miles on it. The car was drivable when I bought it but I only pulled it on and off a trailer so I don't know how good the clutch was. Anybody that knows clutches think it would be worth putting it in my 2001 TA?
I went to the Chevy dealer to get a rear main seal and oil filter and swung by Napa to get some brake cleaner, so while I was out I went and pulled the tank and fuel line out of the donor. I'm working on the 89 in a big storage unit and I have the parts car and a couple others sitting where my dad works.
Old rear main out and new one before I put it in
Transmission was filthy
If it wasn't for the snow drifts in front of my storage unit I probably would've taken the engine and trans and pressure washed them, but a couple cans of brake cleaner got it clean enough
Last edited by t_raven; 07-31-2017 at 08:47 AM.
02-28-2011, 11:38 PM
#17
Before I had the donor car I had a different LS1 I was going to put in this GTA so I bought a set of 4th gen pedals off ebay planning to use them. That was before reading that they don't work as well as 3rd gen pedals. So now that I have a whole donor car I have two sets. I figured I'd see what I could do to make the 4th gen pedals fit right. If I'm not satisfied with them I'll get some 3rd gen pedals.
I cut the gas pedal off and drilled the booster stud holes big enough
I put them in to see how they fit and the bolt holes line up just fine but the brake pedal was way low with the rod connected. I figured out there are two reasons why
Measuring from the front of the bracket to the pivot bolt the 4th gen set is about 1/8" longer.
That 1/8" doesn't sound like much but I did some measuring and because of the ratio of the pedal from the pivot to the booster rod pin and from that pin to the pedal it makes about 1/2" difference in pedal height. So I ground out the spot welds on the shims that are welded to the front of the bracket to remove that extra 1/8".
The other thing I measured is how far out the pedal is in relation to the pivot and the booster pin. I put a level from the pivot bolt to the pad of the pedal and measured how far the booster pin was from that line. 4th gen:
3rd gen:
It's hard to tell in those pics but the booster pin is about 1/8" further from the level on the third gen brake pedal, which means the pedal pad is closer to the driver.
Measured with the straight edge on the line through the pivot and booster pin and measuring how far out the pad is you can see that 1/8" turns into about another 1/2" at the pad
3rd gen 1/2" closer to driver
So those two things contribute to the brake pedal being about 1" lower than the original pedal. I took care of the first problem. I think I'll see what I can do about making the booster rod adjustable so I can put the pedal height where I want it.
Other than brake pedal height I don't see why the 4th gen pedals won't work just fine. I might need to tweek the part the clutch master bolts through but I think that should be easy enough. The holes for the pedal switches are a little bigger though so I'll see if I can use the 4th gen switches.
I cut the gas pedal off and drilled the booster stud holes big enough
I put them in to see how they fit and the bolt holes line up just fine but the brake pedal was way low with the rod connected. I figured out there are two reasons why
Measuring from the front of the bracket to the pivot bolt the 4th gen set is about 1/8" longer.
That 1/8" doesn't sound like much but I did some measuring and because of the ratio of the pedal from the pivot to the booster rod pin and from that pin to the pedal it makes about 1/2" difference in pedal height. So I ground out the spot welds on the shims that are welded to the front of the bracket to remove that extra 1/8".
The other thing I measured is how far out the pedal is in relation to the pivot and the booster pin. I put a level from the pivot bolt to the pad of the pedal and measured how far the booster pin was from that line. 4th gen:
3rd gen:
It's hard to tell in those pics but the booster pin is about 1/8" further from the level on the third gen brake pedal, which means the pedal pad is closer to the driver.
Measured with the straight edge on the line through the pivot and booster pin and measuring how far out the pad is you can see that 1/8" turns into about another 1/2" at the pad
3rd gen 1/2" closer to driver
So those two things contribute to the brake pedal being about 1" lower than the original pedal. I took care of the first problem. I think I'll see what I can do about making the booster rod adjustable so I can put the pedal height where I want it.
Other than brake pedal height I don't see why the 4th gen pedals won't work just fine. I might need to tweek the part the clutch master bolts through but I think that should be easy enough. The holes for the pedal switches are a little bigger though so I'll see if I can use the 4th gen switches.
Last edited by t_raven; 07-31-2017 at 08:48 AM.
02-28-2011, 11:53 PM
#18
I took the auto shifter and cables out
Then I went a head and stripped the LS1 harness.
I took the PCM connectors off
Removed all the conduit and tape
Then I bundled up individual circuits. On the top are circuits I don't need. Middle is all getting reused, and the bottom bundle was all the injector and coil wires, too many splices there to separate it more than that with out cutting wires so I will mock it up like that and modify it if I need to.
My plan is to have the harness as neat looking as possible, and mount the PCM inside. I want to make it so I can remove the engine with the harness attached as easily as possible so I want to put a connector in the harness so that I don't even have to remove the connectors from the PCM to remove the engine. I'm thinking I'll use a round canon plug style connector, maybe mount one side in the firewall so I can easily twist it off and yank the engine out.
Then I went a head and stripped the LS1 harness.
I took the PCM connectors off
Removed all the conduit and tape
Then I bundled up individual circuits. On the top are circuits I don't need. Middle is all getting reused, and the bottom bundle was all the injector and coil wires, too many splices there to separate it more than that with out cutting wires so I will mock it up like that and modify it if I need to.
My plan is to have the harness as neat looking as possible, and mount the PCM inside. I want to make it so I can remove the engine with the harness attached as easily as possible so I want to put a connector in the harness so that I don't even have to remove the connectors from the PCM to remove the engine. I'm thinking I'll use a round canon plug style connector, maybe mount one side in the firewall so I can easily twist it off and yank the engine out.
Last edited by t_raven; 07-31-2017 at 08:49 AM.
03-01-2011, 10:36 AM
#20
Man I got looking at "MIL-SPEC" connectors and holy confusing. And I knew they were spendy but dang some of the ones I saw on ebay were hundreds of dollars. I worked with them a lot in Iraq and I actually threw away a lot of old harnesses with connectors on them. I wish I hadn't done that lol. I'm gonna email my buddy and see if there are any old harnesses he can cut the connectors off and mail to me.
I don't know what's the most terminals you can get in one but even if I used 2 it would be nice and easy to just twist them off and pull the engine. It's not that hard to disconnect the harness at the PCM but where's the fun in that lol. That's probably what I'll do but it's worth looking at any options to make the harness as user friendly as possible while it's all apart.
