Cheapest/Easiest EFI fuel setup for older car?
06-06-2016, 07:10 AM
#1
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Cheapest/Easiest EFI fuel setup for older car? I've done this a couple of times, but the budget (and time) is drying up on this 69 Chevelle swap.
The original plan was to use the stock tank and sending unit, put an external Walbro 255 on the end of it going into a corvette regulator, feeding mostly stock line that's been flared up front for high pressure line instead of hose clamped with rubber line like it was. I hadn't decided how I wanted to return it yet.
Typically we just replace the entire fuel system and all lines, and put a bulkhead fitting in the stock sending unit for a return. A couple of times we've used the rail mounted regulator, put the Walbro pump just under the front subframe using all stock feed lines, and ran a cheap push-lok return from the rail back to the tank (truck intake/rails).
All I've bought so far is the external Walbro and vette regulator/filter. Has anyone managed to find an alternative on the super cheap/easy?
The original plan was to use the stock tank and sending unit, put an external Walbro 255 on the end of it going into a corvette regulator, feeding mostly stock line that's been flared up front for high pressure line instead of hose clamped with rubber line like it was. I hadn't decided how I wanted to return it yet.
Typically we just replace the entire fuel system and all lines, and put a bulkhead fitting in the stock sending unit for a return. A couple of times we've used the rail mounted regulator, put the Walbro pump just under the front subframe using all stock feed lines, and ran a cheap push-lok return from the rail back to the tank (truck intake/rails).
All I've bought so far is the external Walbro and vette regulator/filter. Has anyone managed to find an alternative on the super cheap/easy?
06-06-2016, 08:33 AM
#3
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No, I'm only worried about the fuel system from the pickup in the tank, up to where it attaches to the fuel rail. I need to convert the fuel system itself over to EFI. I've done it several times already, I'm just wondering if anyone has come across an easier option that doesn't include a full replacement.
06-06-2016, 08:51 AM
#4
I've used the aeromotive phantom series stuff and it works great if you have the ability to mount it in the tank. From there it just plumbing the feed line, filter, regulator, and return line. It's quieter than an external pump and it's nice to not have to sump the tank. Is that what you are talking about?
06-06-2016, 09:56 AM
#5
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funny i have been researching this for my build for a while, did a bunch more last night. and of course the answer out there is that you cant. you need to spend lots of money.
but im still cheap. so my current plan is (quick version):
stock tank to a 12S low pressure pump ($35 autoparts store mr gasket universal).
custom small steel surge tank (about a liter or so) with submerged walbro pump (400lph as i am planning for boost) mounted up on frame rail/firewall/fender
quick set of junkyard oem plastic lines
then a 3/8-5/8 (rubber/steel autoparts store stuff) return back to the filler neck.
thinking that all should work great, and cost under $200 and never have to pull the tank.
but im still cheap. so my current plan is (quick version):
stock tank to a 12S low pressure pump ($35 autoparts store mr gasket universal).
custom small steel surge tank (about a liter or so) with submerged walbro pump (400lph as i am planning for boost) mounted up on frame rail/firewall/fender
quick set of junkyard oem plastic lines
then a 3/8-5/8 (rubber/steel autoparts store stuff) return back to the filler neck.
thinking that all should work great, and cost under $200 and never have to pull the tank.
06-06-2016, 10:44 AM
#6
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I'm skipping the surge tank all together and using a Walbro 255 inline pulling from the stock pickup. The return in the filler neck does sound a good bit easier than tapping the actual sending unit. I was using the corvette regulator because I already have it, and it will prevent me from running a full length return.
From the regulator to the rail, I just run a single piece of -6 pushlok hose that's ~$40 with fittings.
So I end up with $50 in lines, $60 regulator with fittings, $75 pump with fittings, $25 in extra fittings. No surge tank.
From the regulator to the rail, I just run a single piece of -6 pushlok hose that's ~$40 with fittings.
So I end up with $50 in lines, $60 regulator with fittings, $75 pump with fittings, $25 in extra fittings. No surge tank.
06-06-2016, 01:23 PM
#7
The GM/Dorman plastic fuel lines and fittings are dirt cheap through rock auto. Its really easy if you have the plastic push connector install tool, but you can get away with a caulk gun and brake flare tool bar if you don`t want to spend the $ for the tool.....or the flaring bar and a deadblow hammer if its a really bad day. LOL.
I also like to use a complete fuel pump/pickup/venturi bucket out of a newer GM (ebay has cheap pull outs). The trailblazer ones are fairly short IIRC and the flex fuel ones have large pumps. You have to cut/weld the tank though to make those fit so you should only do that on a new tank.......
I also like to use a complete fuel pump/pickup/venturi bucket out of a newer GM (ebay has cheap pull outs). The trailblazer ones are fairly short IIRC and the flex fuel ones have large pumps. You have to cut/weld the tank though to make those fit so you should only do that on a new tank.......
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06-06-2016, 08:25 PM
#8
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i just got a bunch of plastic lines w/connectors at the junkyard today. was under 15bucks for more than i need, plus some other misc crap. i plan to use the Dorman metal splice connectors to get them to the length i need.
06-06-2016, 11:58 PM
#9
06-07-2016, 08:18 PM
#12
I also like to use a complete fuel pump/pickup/venturi bucket out of a newer GM (ebay has cheap pull outs). The trailblazer ones are fairly short IIRC and the flex fuel ones have large pumps. You have to cut/weld the tank though to make those fit so you should only do that on a new tank.......
Prices really vary on the replacement units. Kinda scary knowing which one to get.
Last edited by Pop N Wood; 06-09-2016 at 03:57 PM.
06-08-2016, 09:34 PM
#13
I took the bucket out of a Ford F-150 and welded onto my stock 1983 Zephyr tank. I just fill it with water, cut and weld it then flush it out after. I use the Summit braided line for the feed and stock return. I have about 100 bucks into the setup plus some time but it works great and allows me to keep the stock sending unit in place.
06-08-2016, 09:58 PM
#14
http://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/c...assembly,17130
I'd use the spectre tank. I have used 3 or 4 in F bodies for LSx swaps with great results. Use a C5 filter, and some efi lines mated to stock fuel line. External pumps are garbage compared to an in-tank setup. You can knock an add'l 5% off the $318 by googling Rock Auto coupon code.
I'd use the spectre tank. I have used 3 or 4 in F bodies for LSx swaps with great results. Use a C5 filter, and some efi lines mated to stock fuel line. External pumps are garbage compared to an in-tank setup. You can knock an add'l 5% off the $318 by googling Rock Auto coupon code.
06-09-2016, 12:31 PM
#15
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I have an extremely limited budget on this swap. Its a customer car. If he's not dishing out money for an EFI tank, then he doesn't get one. He gets an external pump and Summit -6 line instead.
He has a $2000 budget for a 5.3 with NEW: headgaskets, water pump, pump spacers, oil pan, ARP head bolts, LS7 lifters, PAC springs, custom cam, electric fans, wiring harness and computer, power steering lines, custom mounts, stainless headers, and a fuel system. SO yeah, its tight.
I've went the weld-in bucket option before with a setup from Tanks Inc.
In my Nova I have a Rick's tank, dual 340 LPH in tank pumps, billet bucket, billet inline filter, -8 AN feed/return, etc. This isn't exactly my first time building a fuel system.
He has a $2000 budget for a 5.3 with NEW: headgaskets, water pump, pump spacers, oil pan, ARP head bolts, LS7 lifters, PAC springs, custom cam, electric fans, wiring harness and computer, power steering lines, custom mounts, stainless headers, and a fuel system. SO yeah, its tight.
I've went the weld-in bucket option before with a setup from Tanks Inc.
In my Nova I have a Rick's tank, dual 340 LPH in tank pumps, billet bucket, billet inline filter, -8 AN feed/return, etc. This isn't exactly my first time building a fuel system.
06-09-2016, 03:25 PM
#16
I see, so what do you plan on spending total for the fuel system? Is he paying labor or just parts? Def some labor to be saved w the complete tank vs configuring the inline setup. Its been long time since I priced an external pump. I do swaps on the side as well. Its always frustrating when you have to cut corners. Curious to see what route you end up going.
Scott
Scott
06-09-2016, 08:07 PM
#17
pick up a used caprice tank, you may have to trim the rear frame rails a 1/4" on each side, but it will fit, comes set up with an efi pump, sender etc. add some longer straps to hold it in place and you are ready to go.
06-09-2016, 08:31 PM
#18
Man that makes so much sense. I've been looking at sumps and baffles and mega buck aeromotive phantom systems/holley hydra mat for a couple of years and until now never realized just how good the stock venturi buckets were. Vetteworks makes an adapter you tack weld to the top of a tank.
Prices really vary on the replacement units. Kinda scary knowing which one to get.
Prices really vary on the replacement units. Kinda scary knowing which one to get.
Thank you! I am so shocked people go with so many expensive or relatively unknown attempts for the fuel tank...and forget that GM designed the fuel bucket to work in a non baffled tank. The vetteworks kit / GM pump is awesome.
Finally, braided stainless fuel line is terrible if you park your car in a garage. No fuel drips...but the smell is awful. I used to leave my garage door open after I pulled in..and shut it later or the gas fumes were terrible. I recently switched over to 3/8" copper nickel...what a difference. I'll bet the plastic/nylon dorman lines work just as well. I chose the cu/ni because I wanted to use AN fittings. The 37 deg flare tool was pricey but works very well and I can use it for other lines in the future.
06-10-2016, 12:09 AM
#19
Thank you! I am so shocked people go with so many expensive or relatively unknown attempts for the fuel tank...and forget that GM designed the fuel bucket to work in a non baffled tank. The vetteworks kit / GM pump is awesome.
Finally, braided stainless fuel line is terrible if you park your car in a garage. No fuel drips...but the smell is awful. I used to leave my garage door open after I pulled in..and shut it later or the gas fumes were terrible. I recently switched over to 3/8" copper nickel...what a difference. I'll bet the plastic/nylon dorman lines work just as well. I chose the cu/ni because I wanted to use AN fittings. The 37 deg flare tool was pricey but works very well and I can use it for other lines in the future.
Finally, braided stainless fuel line is terrible if you park your car in a garage. No fuel drips...but the smell is awful. I used to leave my garage door open after I pulled in..and shut it later or the gas fumes were terrible. I recently switched over to 3/8" copper nickel...what a difference. I'll bet the plastic/nylon dorman lines work just as well. I chose the cu/ni because I wanted to use AN fittings. The 37 deg flare tool was pricey but works very well and I can use it for other lines in the future.
I use the Dorman nylon or NiCopp (cu/ni) line exclusively. I absolutely hate braided line for fuel systems. With these two options you get OEM reliability in an inexpensive package you can build yourself. I have a flare tool that makes the OEM style push on quick disconnect fittings and I love it - but it's not cheap.
$2000 is a small budget for a swap. It CAN be done, but it's tight.
06-10-2016, 07:10 AM
#20
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reedld beat me to the punch. I am in the process of swapping in a 6.0 and 6 speed into my 1968 Camaro, and I am in the same boat budget wise. After a lot of research, I found that the 5th gen Camaro fuel pump works in the tight space with the shallow fuel tanks and when modified by Vaporworx kit (converts from PWM to constant pressure), it can run at 58 psi constant.
I got a low mileage 5th gen fuel pump assembly on ebay for $59 shipped, vaporworx kit $120 shipped, and will need to make a recessed panel to house the fuel pump assembly. All in I will be right around $200 bucks. And according to Vaporworx, the stock 5th gen pump when converted to constant pressure is the equivalent of a Walbro 255.
I got a low mileage 5th gen fuel pump assembly on ebay for $59 shipped, vaporworx kit $120 shipped, and will need to make a recessed panel to house the fuel pump assembly. All in I will be right around $200 bucks. And according to Vaporworx, the stock 5th gen pump when converted to constant pressure is the equivalent of a Walbro 255.