It'llrun

I think everyone knows.

So in your mind, the front clip doesn't count as part of the body? The interior of the bed isn't part of the body? The doors aren't part of the body? The doors, I know, are replaced between street vehicle and race vehicle, but that's part of my point. If he took that thing down the track in "actual street trim," I believe it wouldn't run 6's, let alone 5's.

That's the point in a nutshell. What he drives to the track isn't close to what he races there. It's literally hundreds of hp/tq different and probably close to, or over, 200 lb different.

I'm NOT knocking the thing for what it is(I'm genuinely impressed with that it is and can be). I'm simply saying that in my mind, it's hardly a street vehicle and ya know what... Larry Larson agrees with me almost 100% and pretty much said so in his interview. He didn't even wanna drive the thing... straight from him. He just wanted to be done with it.

Every 4th gen has ZERO to do w/ that vehicle. Did GM offer their pickup that way? No? Not the same then. As for the Camaro having less metal... kinda makes ya wonder how he's gotten the truck so much faster than all the 4th gens, huh???

Ultimately, there's not 1 state in America that would, upon actual inspection(particularly in race trim), issue a tag for that vehicle. Not 1. It's a game we've played on various levels since the 1970's. It's easier to tag a home built vehicle than something like that. I'm fairly certain that S10 would fail just due to the height of the front bumper. I'm also convinced the brakes, at least fronts, aren't legal for road use. I know that a speedometer and odometer are required, as are turn signals(easily bypassed using hand signals), but... the bigger thing is, too many changes happen between "I drove it here!" and "I'm ready to race!"

On that note: This made me feel impressed...
Of course it's had tougher rules... it has faster cars.

speedtigger

iTrader: (16)

This is one of those arguments that has no right answer. Only YOUR right answer.

What overshadows the argument, is what brings people to the tracks. Originally these classes brought people to the track because the cars looked like and initially were something that anyone could build. Now there are all just high dollar racecars with the facade of being grass roots racers.

What will determine the efficacy of these classes will be if they can continue to draw a crowd. When the pits are full and the stands are empty, that is the first sign of decline.

WE TODD DID

iTrader: (2)

Give it up, it's not a street car. Period.

swoop

iTrader: (1)

That was a killer pass. That truck is so nice in person.

Also saw Joe Berry driving out the front gate after running 6.89@ 207

SSPerformance

iTrader: (76)

far from a street car

loosews6

iTrader: (1)

Lmao..... that's what i said

1320

iTrader: (6)

So whats a street car? Doug clines camaro was cited up above, but I d like to point out that it was built by Larry Larson too, and is a near copy chassis wise of his chevy II. The truck may drive around differently then it races, but most of us do.....Who does change tires? Who has cut outs? Who changes fuel? Who changes the boost?

These guys ran 6's and drove 1000 miles in a week.......Thats been the test for a decade now......and just so you know, Larson had a steel front end for the s10 too.....I think he just ran out of time during the build. But in anycase, virtually all f bodies built after 1993 have plastic fenders...and glass hoods...and plastic doors...just because they are heavier doesnt mean much.

Are they daily drivers.....no, but they can cruise to any show just as easy as many show cars.....that see week end duty for a trophy.

It'llrun

One that can pass federal emissions standards and any/all rules within the state it is in, for sure. Modifications are no problem, but when the ENTIRE chassis has been replaced by a hand built version... that's beyond modified, that's hand built. Look into the reality of Larry's truck. He openly admits that almost none of it is really GM built.

Those cars have nothing to do w/ the truck though... and the truck is the issue.

Many of us change tires and boost. Many have cut outs... a small percentage change fuels.

Larry changes so much, it literally requires HOURS to go from street driven to race ready. He drops about 200 lb in the process, swaps tires, removes the radiator, most of the exhaust, apparently the Gear Vendors OD is worked w/, though I wouldn't know why, swaps the doors and who knows what else. Anyway, he has your basic racing crew and it still takes hours. Our typical cars go out and within 15 minutes(0 minutes in most cases), are ready to race. We don't usually haul a trailer with our racing set up inside either.

That said, I like what he's done, but personally, I don't see calling that a street legal vehicle.
We've been over this too... most cars that come w/ plastic or fiberglass hoods, doors, fenders, etc. aren't much like an S10, which got none of that as far as I remember.

Just because vehicle A was built a certain way, doesn't mean vehicle B can be changed to match A and then the owner can claim it's all stock on accounta... nonsense. Larry doesn't actually do that, but people here are willing.

sweetbmxrider

iTrader: (13)

Pass emissions means street car? That's a joke, everyone rips the emissions crap out. Just because you can pass a plug in doesn't mean **** then. Changing the chassis has no effect on emissions, so why is it an issue? The whole street car term is so dumb. I just laugh to myself at guys complaining here that trailer their cars to the track. These cars pull trailers themselves!

It'llrun

The majority of people never do a thing with their emissions and probably less than 1% of us actually do. We're not talking about what makes a car "not a race car" here... we're talking about what makes it street legal. That said, nobody should care, imo, who does or doesn't replace their cats with the logical, lack thereof.

Again, not about what affects emissions... street legal is the deal and ZERO states would find it legal to replace the frame w/ a completely new chassis, even including a roll cage... better though they are, or not. Besides, the federal government has its nose in there too. We're not talking about what is or isn't smart or what is or isn't driver friendly, etc. We're talking about what it takes to remain legal and Larry has openly said many times, his vehicles for these races, really are not. They DO live up to the race rules, but not the actual law.

I don't think anyone is really complaining about it, nor that many of those race cars pull trailers anywhere. Larry's does, but most don't.

The "street car" term is part of the racing class... for legal purposes, a car/truck has to pass far more tests than those found in the NHRA and other racing leagues.

Our "negative comments" are based on several things perhaps, but mostly just the fact that this type of vehicle is rarely considered a street car based on several factors.... like, can you drive it from home to the track, race it in 15min or less, take another 15min or less to "readjust" things like tires or boost... and drive it away w/o having to stop for more changes to make it driver capable.

If you need HOURS to make it race or street ready... it's not really a street car. It's more of a job. Still, I like these vehicles, but personally, I'm not being persuaded to believe they really are "street" cars because they'd never do in my case, or for most people I know. I'm not bothered either way, just discussing the reasons some of us feel as we do.

Guitar

iTrader: (9)

It's a street car. You can say different all you want. Try telling a driver of a car that drives to the track, runs a fast *** pass, and drives back home that his car is not a street car. Just because yours isn't that fast doesn't mean that it isn't.

It'llrun

I questioned the legality, not whether or not he drove it to the track. The fact remains, he doesn't actually drive it to the track, runs a fast *** pass, and drive back home...

He drives to the track, spends HOURS preparing for a fast *** pass, makes the pass... and maybe a few... then spends HOURS making it a street car again so he can drive it home... What does a guy like that do when the track experiences a sudden down poor and closes, like many tracks commonly experience in Florida? He makes the staff have to stay or... like they used to do down at Moroso(PBIR), they make him leave and he has to sit on the driveway working on his car, or call a wrecker... in the rain.

A real street car can simply be driven home rather than "repaired for hours" to be capable of simply driving home.

One more time: I like the "truck" for what it is, but I'm not going to make the mistake of thinking it is something other than what it really is. Larry himself has made it clear... this is NOT A DRIVER... it's set up specifically according to the rules and therefore, he does drive it, but he also spends hours, because the rules allow it, making it VERY MUCH ILLEGAL for street use, prior to racing. There's my point... even the very guy who owns it will say, he never races it in "street car" form and he never makes like it's a "street car" after racing, until he completes all the required changes to make it legal again, according to the real laws... and even then, he doesn't truly make it legal... just enough to get by.

"On the street the transmission is cooled through a stacked-plate ATF-to-air cooler. On the track the ATF cooler is bypassed and removed to save weight.

Part of the truck's Doomsday strategy is removing "unnecessary parts" for the drag strip. That includes the gasoline fuel cell, pump, and fuel filter mounted in the bed of the truck. It also includes the truck's aluminum radiator, cooling system, and side-pipe exhaust. On the track the truck's steel doors are replaced with carbon-fiber versions." - HotRodMagazine

So... it's a "street car" when properly prepared and a race car when properly prepared... but it is NOT both at the same time... according to Larry Larson himself.

sweetbmxrider

iTrader: (13)

I think you are confusing yourself with what you think a street car is. You seem to change your idea of one every post. Carry on.

It'llrun

Apparently I've confused you, but not me. For example: In my last post, I merely used words from the link I had previously added... how is using the exact same words... a change? It isn't, but you haven't been paying attention.

With you, I discussed legality. With him... same issue. As I've said all along, I like that truck and all the cars like that. None is for me because I find it to be a sensational waste of money just to make an attempt to pat myself on the back. Besides, my health isn't likely to ever allow me to make any such attempt and I've lost interest.

Anyway, I've basically covered just 2 issues in each post... the same two.

sweetbmxrider

iTrader: (13)

I must be making this stuff up. Wait, there it is, just as you said it.


Getting back to this:

What states find it legal to remove pollution control equipment from on-road vehicles? You'd have a much easier time getting an inspection sticker here in nj with an aftermarket chassis than you would with no cats. There is no safety inspection, you don't need a windshield to pass but I'm not sure where they'd put the sticker. No cats = No pass = No street legal

RobsZ28

iTrader: (3)

I think some people are confusing a daily driven car with a street car. Registered+insured+driven on a public roadway= street car. My car wouldn't be legal or pass emissions in California, but don't pass emissions and is legal in Arizona where I live. Does that mean I don't have a street car?

Zmg00camaross

iTrader: (11)

It's is a streetable race car. I am a MO state inspector and it fails on multiple things. Who gives a damn!! Anyone here have the knowledge and know how to run 5s in the 1/4? Respect is all that man deserves.

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

Respect... along with a healthy fine/ticket and an impounded illegal vehicle! I joke... I joke... All Larsons cars are amazing!

I'd still have to argue...

If a car can't pass an inspection to get a tag, it can't be legally driven on the street... Period. 80+% of the guys in Drag Week were driving illegal cars. You couldn't be competitive in Larrys class with a true street legal car.

I think there should be a "For really real - Street Legal Class". Before the racers are allowed to run, the cars would need to pass their states vehicle inspection requirements. If they fail, they shouldn't be allowed to race.

I just went through this huge ordeal with my car. I had to take to the highway patrols "Vin Garage" to have it inspected. Due to the roll cage and other "severe modifications", I needed a whole slew of things to get a legal KS tag... which I did.

When I enter my local tracks "street car" event and they line me up against the equivalent of a promod car...I feel ripped off. Even if the promod was driven to the track. Just because the car got a legal tag back in 1962, doesn't mean it's legal the way it sits today.

Zmg00camaross

iTrader: (11)

Well if Larson came to my shop I would pass him I say it's legal then. Or could be Internet famous and fail him haha.

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

You don't count... we go by the book!