Wanting to run 10's but not sure the best way to do it.
07-19-2017, 03:18 AM
#1
Wanting to run 10's but not sure the best way to do it. I'm fairly new in the drag racing tech section.
I was at the strip last week spectating and the mod bug bit me. I want to run 10's in my 99 Z28. I still want the car to be perfectly streetable though, doesn't need to be the tamest thing in the world, but don't want to do much weight reduction, want to keep all my seats, dash and trim, want to keep my A/C. I do notwant to run N20, don't mind tubular K-Member, and know suspensions mods will be necessary. Already running 295's in the rear. Thing is, I don't want to make it an all track car, I also want to go auto'xing with it time to time, drive it to and from work and enjoy it on the weekends with passengers.
I haven't yet run my 99 to see what it will do (or what I can do) I don't expect anything impressive given its age, wear and my lack of skill but I don't mind doing a few runs on the mostly stock motor just to get a feel for things, currently its bogging quite a bit at about 2k RPMS and I haven't yet invested in figuring out why.
I know getting into the 10's isn't going to be cake work especially since I'm avoiding weight reduction and trying to keep the car street-able. If I'm not doing any real weight reduction (besides maybe Tubular K-Member and a few under the hood things.) then I am about 95% sure it's not going to happen on stock displacement while keeping it street-able. I haven't really decided though if I want to go F.I. or remain NA. If I go F.I. would rebuilding my LS1 into a forged 372 be enough to reliably run boost and make it into the 10's or would I need a 408 or higher? I've been reading that 383's are not a good boost combo. What if though that I instead used a 5.3L LM7 or a 6.0L LQ4? Both are low compression iron tanks. Could those be used to reliably sustain the 10's?
What if I remained N/A? I'm believing 408 or 427 would be my only real hope.
I was at the strip last week spectating and the mod bug bit me. I want to run 10's in my 99 Z28. I still want the car to be perfectly streetable though, doesn't need to be the tamest thing in the world, but don't want to do much weight reduction, want to keep all my seats, dash and trim, want to keep my A/C. I do notwant to run N20, don't mind tubular K-Member, and know suspensions mods will be necessary. Already running 295's in the rear. Thing is, I don't want to make it an all track car, I also want to go auto'xing with it time to time, drive it to and from work and enjoy it on the weekends with passengers.
I haven't yet run my 99 to see what it will do (or what I can do) I don't expect anything impressive given its age, wear and my lack of skill but I don't mind doing a few runs on the mostly stock motor just to get a feel for things, currently its bogging quite a bit at about 2k RPMS and I haven't yet invested in figuring out why.
I know getting into the 10's isn't going to be cake work especially since I'm avoiding weight reduction and trying to keep the car street-able. If I'm not doing any real weight reduction (besides maybe Tubular K-Member and a few under the hood things.) then I am about 95% sure it's not going to happen on stock displacement while keeping it street-able. I haven't really decided though if I want to go F.I. or remain NA. If I go F.I. would rebuilding my LS1 into a forged 372 be enough to reliably run boost and make it into the 10's or would I need a 408 or higher? I've been reading that 383's are not a good boost combo. What if though that I instead used a 5.3L LM7 or a 6.0L LQ4? Both are low compression iron tanks. Could those be used to reliably sustain the 10's?
What if I remained N/A? I'm believing 408 or 427 would be my only real hope.
07-19-2017, 11:02 AM
#6
It's an Auto - If I need to change it to a stick I won't mind doing it as my Auto feels a bit dated. I'd REALLY wish I could throw in a 5 or 6 speed automatic but it seems to be more trouble than its worth.
Right now, car is almost basically stock except for ported TB, and a LID. I haven't even touched the exhaust yet (because I've been spending most of my time repairing and restoring it, just redid the entire interior) - exhaust is next but one thing I haven't really figured out and why I havent yet touched it is because I'm not sure if I want to turbo or not.
Right now, car is almost basically stock except for ported TB, and a LID. I haven't even touched the exhaust yet (because I've been spending most of my time repairing and restoring it, just redid the entire interior) - exhaust is next but one thing I haven't really figured out and why I havent yet touched it is because I'm not sure if I want to turbo or not.
Last edited by Need4Camaro; 07-19-2017 at 11:11 AM.
07-19-2017, 12:13 PM
#7
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I think you're going to end up building a pretty expensive car...
For a dual purpose suspension, drag racing and street driving, there are options. For a auto-X racing and drag racing suspension, I'd tell you to build mainly for the auto-X, but get dampers with a WIDE range of adjustability and likely swapping springs on 1/4 mile track day. You might want 600# front springs for autoX and 300# front springs for 1/4 mile.
On the motor, skip the 408. Do something with a 4.125" bore. There's a guy who flat got it done with a 3.622 stroked LS7 - so a 388. In the dyno section. 630HP, 530TQ rear wheel, NA. Which is about the power you might be looking at to run tens close to full weight. You can boost into the tens, but lots of road race guys prefer NA from what i've read.
Don't get too hung up on WR making a car not streetable. Plenty of examples of guys who have pulled 300# out of their car and still very streetable. It can be done without turning the car into a swiss cheesed rattle trap.
Tubular K, Lithium battery, tubular control arms, fiberglass hood, Lighter rotors, tires, and wheels, etc... Hell, I DD with tubular spindles. Some guys DD with Strange drag brakes.
Auto trans should be fine, but IDK if you'd want two different stall converters depending on which way you're racing that day.
For a dual purpose suspension, drag racing and street driving, there are options. For a auto-X racing and drag racing suspension, I'd tell you to build mainly for the auto-X, but get dampers with a WIDE range of adjustability and likely swapping springs on 1/4 mile track day. You might want 600# front springs for autoX and 300# front springs for 1/4 mile.
On the motor, skip the 408. Do something with a 4.125" bore. There's a guy who flat got it done with a 3.622 stroked LS7 - so a 388. In the dyno section. 630HP, 530TQ rear wheel, NA. Which is about the power you might be looking at to run tens close to full weight. You can boost into the tens, but lots of road race guys prefer NA from what i've read.
Don't get too hung up on WR making a car not streetable. Plenty of examples of guys who have pulled 300# out of their car and still very streetable. It can be done without turning the car into a swiss cheesed rattle trap.
Tubular K, Lithium battery, tubular control arms, fiberglass hood, Lighter rotors, tires, and wheels, etc... Hell, I DD with tubular spindles. Some guys DD with Strange drag brakes.
Auto trans should be fine, but IDK if you'd want two different stall converters depending on which way you're racing that day.
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07-19-2017, 11:26 PM
#10
Call either Cam motion, Martin Smallwood, or Brian Tooley (BTR) Have them spec you a turbo cam. You will need a trunion upgrade on the rockers and new springs. 5.3 would be the way to go. You may see even better than 10's but tens will be no sweat. You will definitely need to do suspension uprades to get the power to the ground.
07-20-2017, 08:12 AM
#11
Call either Cam motion, Martin Smallwood, or Brian Tooley (BTR) Have them spec you a turbo cam. You will need a trunion upgrade on the rockers and new springs. 5.3 would be the way to go. You may see even better than 10's but tens will be no sweat. You will definitely need to do suspension uprades to get the power to the ground.
I really wish those APS Turbo Systems still existed, that is my dream turbo setup, I would swap the turbo's though but I love how everything is mounted. I would really like to fabricate a system lke that but I can't find an intercooler like that.
07-20-2017, 12:08 PM
#13
10s here. Best trap 124 many mods ago on 93 Octane but more mods coming. Stock wheels. Front sway bar. Original motor with internals. I drive the car everywhere including Florida to MD and back. I think it could be done with an a4 but it will not be cheap. Since you want to autocross I think it can still be done
07-25-2017, 03:34 PM
#14
TECH Apprentice
Seriously, you will save yourself a lot of headaches and money with your goal if you just buy a $30k Zo6 or similar. I like fbody's and sure you can reach your goals with one but if you want consistent 10's and a car that can autocross and be reliable on the street you will have that much in an fbody, plus all the work you have to do to get there.
07-26-2017, 05:21 AM
#15
yeah I'm honestly beginning to think that too.
I don't really want to sell it because I invested alot of time and money in this car but I am beginning to believe a better chassis would be much smarter.
Just dead curious do you think a 6th Gen Camaro SS may be a decent candidate for the goal? Some of them are popping up used for a fairly decent price.
I don't really want to sell it because I invested alot of time and money in this car but I am beginning to believe a better chassis would be much smarter.
Just dead curious do you think a 6th Gen Camaro SS may be a decent candidate for the goal? Some of them are popping up used for a fairly decent price.
07-26-2017, 06:11 AM
#16
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6g camaro is giving even the vettes a run for their money. Hell you've got camaros mixing it up with supercars on Nurburgring
The vette will still be lighter which has benefit on the 1/4 mile
The vette will still be lighter which has benefit on the 1/4 mile
08-02-2017, 12:56 PM
#17
Assuming you had proper fueling and control with a driveline that could take the abuse. (right converter and gearing too) I'm pretty confident I could get a bone stock LS1 with a nice turbo setup the 10.9x range pretty easy. Relatively cheaply to boot.
Guys are making 700-800+whp on untouched long block LS1's. Talking stock cam and untouched long block with valve springs only. If you want it semi-reliable... drop a decent (factory bore) rod and piston set in it with studs and LS9 gaskets.
Or pick up a gen4 short block 5.3 or 4.8. Either will do it semi-reliably IMO. A heavy car will never be successful at auto'xing IMO. Also drag suspension and auto'xing suspension are completely different setups. Neither of them are pleasant to drive on daily. Better off with 3 cars than trying to make 1 to suit 3 separate needs.
Guys are making 700-800+whp on untouched long block LS1's. Talking stock cam and untouched long block with valve springs only. If you want it semi-reliable... drop a decent (factory bore) rod and piston set in it with studs and LS9 gaskets.
Or pick up a gen4 short block 5.3 or 4.8. Either will do it semi-reliably IMO. A heavy car will never be successful at auto'xing IMO. Also drag suspension and auto'xing suspension are completely different setups. Neither of them are pleasant to drive on daily. Better off with 3 cars than trying to make 1 to suit 3 separate needs.