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Looking good mane. I see you have a fondness for Milwaukee tools as do I.
Have you had a chance to play around with and get into the nuances of the Terminator X stuff yet??? VERY curious and interested in what comes of this option.
Has it gotten (or is it coming) to the point that it is starting to be a BETTER option for a person to sock away a few bucks and get a system like this Terminator X instead of going through getting a GM harness, GM PCM, buying or finding someone with tuning software etc.etc. It sure seems to me like it's going that way. Anything to give us gearheads more flexibility and/or more affordability is a good thing.
I think there is a time and place for OEM systems. For instance, a guy buys a crate LS3 and knows he will never modify it, I would probably steer him to the GMPP ECU and harness kits. But for guys that like to tinker, who like to change things around, who want complete control, who don't want to be tied to an "expert" tuner, then that Holley EFI is the way to go.
I just went through "the Gauntlet" which is what Holley calls taking all three of their classes in a row. Learned a ton of new things and also saw some scary datalogs from car that we're tuned by "experts." The Holley system basically saved these engines from being ashtrays.
agree 100% andrew. stock pcm's are incredibly flexible and can do stuff way beyond their intended use. I really like that you can pay-as-you-go with stock pcm's. do your swap, get a base tune, run it, pick up HPT or EFI live or even the pcm hammer or ls droid which are both maturing into very useful tools.
but eventually you run into a limit with what you can do. no dome control (although the PCM hammer guys and LS Droid maker have teased at that possibility) No integrated wideband. No configurable Outputs ( which was promised with v2.4, hence those of us that sprang for the mvpi pro)
and holley has landed a tool right about where you would be if you bought a pcm and professional grade harness, a stand alone boost controller and a nice wideband
the GUI is great. The support forums are friendly and holley-staffed. The amount of videos and tuning documentation related to the software is astounding.
Ive had HPT since 2013 and it's taken me 6 years to almost fully understand all the intricacies of the stock pcm, its tables and how they interact with each other.
now ive had the holley software for 3 weeks and i'm pretty confident I can navigate it at a reasonably competent level. It's a way nicer UX than anything i've had before, tunerstudio, tunerproRT hondata etc
yeah the literature makes it pretty clear that welding with the computer in the car is a big no-no.
and yes I'm a shameless red tool fanboi. I need to replace my 3/8 impact and drill combo. 5 years have really beat them up, but the battery management is still head and shoulders above the rest of the market from what I have experienced
I have read only one report from a term x install, he used the hand held and was able
to fire it right up and idle, run decent right away. I have used the HP, not sure what features
these have less. Still a bargain, as elects go, esp with trans control avail. Guys seem to be
dropping the Fitech and looking at this. I know one thing, don't weld on a car with these things
plugged in, as I found out, lol.
I agree, it seems to be very reasonably priced for what is offered. Yup! Learned that one the hard way myself! Although it was on something very far removed from anything LS lol... My pops loves 40s and 50s flavored traditional rods. Before things became like they are today.... No ratrods, no overbuilt, overchromed catalog-built trailer queens..... Just real, homebrewed hot rods..... Anyways, we got a 32 and 49 Ford, both running flatheads. But we ditched the points ignitions on both and upgraded to modern electronic ignitions in those distributors and we have definitely fried a couple of ignition modules while welding on the cars to fix/modify/build something else related to those cars.... Unplug the dizzy ignition module, coil and battery is what I do now... Probably overkill to protect the electronics but nonetheless....
Originally Posted by Project GatTagO
I think there is a time and place for OEM systems. For instance, a guy buys a crate LS3 and knows he will never modify it, I would probably steer him to the GMPP ECU and harness kits. But for guys that like to tinker, who like to change things around, who want complete control, who don't want to be tied to an "expert" tuner, then that Holley EFI is the way to go.
I just went through "the Gauntlet" which is what Holley calls taking all three of their classes in a row. Learned a ton of new things and also saw some scary datalogs from car that we're tuned by "experts." The Holley system basically saved these engines from being ashtrays.
Andrew
Yeah I agree with ya man. I have recently come to be VERY aware of the fact that the GM PCMs/ECMS of either OBD1 or OBD2 era have a fair amount of stuff that is "fudged" to get their desired effect. This adds to the complexity, to me anyways when trying to dial in something. This becomes more apparent as whatever you're building becomes farther and farther away from a stockish build and into the territory of "radical". I've got a 355 TBI that I've been playing with on the side and the hard parts for this SBC should easily crank out 400 FWHP if not more.... One thing that has become abundantly clear to me like I kinda mentioned above is the fudge factor..... Getting the acceleration enrichment right on this one has proven to be a real son of a bitch..... It's like trying to hit a moving target..... Wet flow manifolds are a bitch...... My turbo LS truck has performed soooooo good overall, but, I wanted to do a stout TBI SBC in this other truck just for fun..... I'm either going to sell that SBC to someone that wants to jam a carb off on it and make a solid ~400FWHP+ or, part the damn thing out..... I should have put an LS in it!!!! Oh well! I got a lot of the parts for cheap/free so I figured what the hell ya know? And I screwed together what is really a pretty stout SBC.... Just gotta figure out a way to fuel it.... I even found one of those highly coveted Holley TBIs... Found it at a swap meet for a mere $5!!!! That's what I think pushed me into wanting to build up a stong TBI for this other truck... But anyways...
I bet those classes were fascinating.... I would thoroughly enjoy something like that.... I have learned a lot about EFI over the years, but thankfully I have been able to speak with people like those that frequent this forum and others and ask questions and try to increase my knowledge of the topic... HPTuners and the little bit of experience I have with it is WAY better/easier IMO than trying to screw around with some of the archaic OBD1 TBI era PCMs and TunerPro...... Just, so, much, fudge, factor..
Originally Posted by truckdoug
agree 100% andrew. stock pcm's are incredibly flexible and can do stuff way beyond their intended use. I really like that you can pay-as-you-go with stock pcm's. do your swap, get a base tune, run it, pick up HPT or EFI live or even the pcm hammer or ls droid which are both maturing into very useful tools.
but eventually you run into a limit with what you can do. no dome control (although the PCM hammer guys and LS Droid maker have teased at that possibility) No integrated wideband. No configurable Outputs ( which was promised with v2.4, hence those of us that sprang for the mvpi pro)
and holley has landed a tool right about where you would be if you bought a pcm and professional grade harness, a stand alone boost controller and a nice wideband
the GUI is great. The support forums are friendly and holley-staffed. The amount of videos and tuning documentation related to the software is astounding.
Ive had HPT since 2013 and it's taken me 6 years to almost fully understand all the intricacies of the stock pcm, its tables and how they interact with each other.
now ive had the holley software for 3 weeks and i'm pretty confident I can navigate it at a reasonably competent level. It's a way nicer UX than anything i've had before, tunerstudio, tunerproRT hondata etc
yeah the literature makes it pretty clear that welding with the computer in the car is a big no-no.
and yes I'm a shameless red tool fanboi. I need to replace my 3/8 impact and drill combo. 5 years have really beat them up, but the battery management is still head and shoulders above the rest of the market from what I have experienced
Right, the GM PCMs are very flexible but you definitely do run into some limitations at some point.
Yeah the price point for the Holley system is amazing to me... I've never mastered tuning any GM PCM/ECM but if there is one thing that makes it all worth it is the fact that playing around with the GM or stock computers gives you a more robust understanding of the how and why things work.... Which is especially frustrating when you get into the fudge factor like I was talking about earlier... Nonetheless, still very worth it IMO.... But with this new tool hitting the scene giving us more flexibility and options than before, it's great.
Man I love my Milwaukees. They have never let me down... Funny you should mention the battery managment. One of my buddies cautioned me about always leaving some batteries on the charger.... I do it anyways and from what little I have read, and what I can tell, it doesn't matter because the chargers can "tell" when the battery is fully charged and won't ruin a good battery by hitting it with full voltage when it isn't needed.
agree 100% andrew. stock pcm's are incredibly flexible and can do stuff way beyond their intended use. I really like that you can pay-as-you-go with stock pcm's. do your swap, get a base tune, run it, pick up HPT or EFI live or even the pcm hammer or ls droid which are both maturing into very useful tools.
but eventually you run into a limit with what you can do. no dome control (although the PCM hammer guys and LS Droid maker have teased at that possibility) No integrated wideband. No configurable Outputs ( which was promised with v2.4, hence those of us that sprang for the mvpi pro)
and holley has landed a tool right about where you would be if you bought a pcm and professional grade harness, a stand alone boost controller and a nice wideband
the GUI is great. The support forums are friendly and holley-staffed. The amount of videos and tuning documentation related to the software is astounding.
Ive had HPT since 2013 and it's taken me 6 years to almost fully understand all the intricacies of the stock pcm, its tables and how they interact with each other.
now ive had the holley software for 3 weeks and i'm pretty confident I can navigate it at a reasonably competent level. It's a way nicer UX than anything i've had before, tunerstudio, tunerproRT hondata etc
yeah the literature makes it pretty clear that welding with the computer in the car is a big no-no.
and yes I'm a shameless red tool fanboi. I need to replace my 3/8 impact and drill combo. 5 years have really beat them up, but the battery management is still head and shoulders above the rest of the market from what I have experienced
Living in smog country, how does the Holley system pass emissions tests? I assume its getting installed on vehicles that don't require it or in areas that have no testing.
so here it's differing levels for different year cars
my malibu would just need a sniff test and be below some X number of oxides of nitrogen and carbon dioxides
same with my '93 bmw
a good functioning cat will allow you to pass easily if the car is anywhere near decently running...I got a cammed & carbed 455 olds to pass in an '86 cutlass recently.
but if it's new enough to have obd2...well you're fucked lol
there is some stuff you can do to spoof the test, but the fines are outrageous if you get caught
interestingly enough they're gonna do away with all emissions testing across the river in Vancouver. air quality has improved so much in the last decade they're gonna sunset it.
of course not here in Oregon though. One of the two regions the test emissions will probably never have decent air quality due to the geography of the area and the Portland Metro DEQ subsidizes the whole system.
so here it's differing levels for different year cars
my malibu would just need a sniff test and be below some X number of oxides of nitrogen and carbon dioxides
same with my '93 bmw
a good functioning cat will allow you to pass easily if the car is anywhere near decently running...I got a cammed & carbed 455 olds to pass in an '86 cutlass recently.
but if it's new enough to have obd2...well you're fucked lol
there is some stuff you can do to spoof the test, but the fines are outrageous if you get caught
interestingly enough they're gonna do away with all emissions testing across the river in Vancouver. air quality has improved so much in the last decade they're gonna sunset it.
of course not here in Oregon though. One of the two regions the test emissions will probably never have decent air quality due to the geography of the area and the Portland Metro DEQ subsidizes the whole system.
This is exactly what I thought and turning off CEL's related to emissions stuff is asking for trouble. Sure, doable and likely no one would ever know.
I just read Vancouver is indeed sunsetting on 12/31/19. Being a resident of Vancouver, this makes me very happy! Now I cam do my turbo atmosphere dump! HAHAHA
I am about to help a buddy locally with a TermX Max installation. I may also start making some quick software tutorial videos. While the software is pretty simple to navigate, it does take a little while to get used to where everything is located.
I may also start making some quick software tutorial videos. While the software is pretty simple to navigate, it does take a little while to get used to where everything is located.
Andrew
what are you turboing? do you have a build thread? always nice to see locals on here
This will be my first project in about 15 years. Finally have the space and some funds. I originally bought a 2004 Buick Rainier 5.3 for the aluminum block, pcm/harness and was going to just part it out to get some of the cheap initial cost back.
The problem is its super nice. Has every option and everything works except trans, I hate to hack it up. My wife also really likes it which will probably mean Ill get to spend more money on it. It needs the trans rebuilt, its why I got it so cheap. These motor/trans/pcm/harness combos start at about $2500 on ebay, so I can't loose money whatever I do.
I'm really thinking to just build this as it is. I want to do just simple: new springs, possibly diff heads as it has small intake valves, stage 2 cam, fuel pump and new rails as mine is returnless, injectors. I want to do up to about 14psi on a small turbo so I get full boost by 2500. Problem is Ive never welded, Im a fast learn but its reality. I may also grab a used tvs 1900 and go the SC route but I really want to learn to weld. I figure with any power upgrades the transfercase, this one is ran by clutches, would smoke and I would be forced to make a choice to upgrade the tcase to a gear driven with selectable ranges, this is an easy swap actually.
OR
Pull the motor, junk the 4l60e with awd tcase. Get a JY 2wd 4l80e and look for a swap. I like the Edge mustang swaps, I really like the square body chev's or even the 90's trucks. Really any SCSB would be fun. I'm kind of partial to sleepers as I felt like when I had my Trans-Am, I never got many races. It's actually why I loved my Eclipse, none of the domestic guys knew (I had it all debadged and blacked out/respected it at their own demise.
I dont really know yet. I'm going to buy parts like I just did spark plugs, oil pressure sensor and start accumulating the stuff I know I will need regardless.This Buick would look really good in the GNX trim like this:
nice I was looking at those and the saab 9-5's which share the same platform. hard to find them clean though.
thats good you got the wife's blessing. I bet you could talk to DDnSpider and figure out how to make a 60e live with 5-600 wheel from a nice little 7875.
nice I was looking at those and the saab 9-5's which share the same platform. hard to find them clean though.
thats good you got the wife's blessing. I bet you could talk to DDnSpider and figure out how to make a 60e live with 5-600 wheel from a nice little 7875.
I found a transmission guy in Longview that will rebuild it for $600 and it uses good parts from the list he provided. Will also do upgrades like a beast sunshell, corvette servo, extra 3-4 clutch. I'm tempted just to go this route in the short term so I can drive it around while I amass upgrade parts. I would be curious what people recommend for upgraded parts though. Ive even considered rebuilding it my self. I watched an entire series on it and it seems like its very detailed but not difficult work.
The motor thankfully is really strong and when this thing decides it wants to hold 2nd gear, its actually pretty quick. I wish I would of realized these existed when I car shopping for a DD years ago, these are really nice and yeah the Saab's are also nice. I would say in order of appearance to me: Saab 97x, Rainier, Trailblazer SS, Trailblazer, Ascender then Envoy and the 2 years Bravada is similar to the Rainier.
Doug, build is looking good man, keep the updates rollin as you can. That intercooler looks identical to the one that I run on my OBS but the inlet/outlet point down on this one.
ddnspider is definitely a super sharp guy, and among other things, he knows how to swing a 4L60 and make it hit hard and do it's thing. Having said that, if it's an auto, personally I'd go for an 80 just from the get go. Especially in a truck application. But we all gotta do what we gotta/want to do.
damn I havent touched the 'bu in a while. I went to fab the up-pipe and found I was missing a bunch of stuff I SWEAR i had but must have gotten used on other projects. dumb stuff like a vband flange
but this is what im doing atm ---KA24de swap into a JDM firetruck (got a buncha fun fab work to do on it here soon)
04-16-2019, 07:16 AM
That intercooler looks identical to the one that I run on my OBS but the inlet/outlet point down on this one.
