View Poll Results: Which would you put on your car?
Procharger
274
43.77%
Turbo Charge It!
352
56.23%
Voters: 626. You may not vote on this poll
Procharger Vs. Turbo
TECH Apprentice
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 363
Likes: 0
From: Blackwood, NJ
I'm all about positive displacement superchargers. Still undecided on my feelings toward turbos. Also, it's a myth that turbos have no parasitic loss, they do. It's just significantly less than superchargers. Where some superchargers would require ~250hp to power, a turbo for the same setup would require only ~50. Personally, I will never buy a centrifugal blower. It's like combining the disadvantages of a turbo with the disadvantages of a supercharger. That's not to say that crazy numbers can't be made, but roots and twin screw will produce more off the line punch and make peak boost much sooner and hold it to redline (which I feel is more fun, having been in both a centrifugal and roots powered cars making similar peak numbers). And for those of you who don't think you can inter/aftercool a roots/twin screw blower, check this out. Those Laminova intercoolers are compact and also much more efficient than most other forms of inter/aftercooling. Also, positive displacement blowers make more of a torque plataeu than a torque curve.
Good post... Yes, if you're a racing freak and will run your car on the track all the time, the curve of a centrifugal supercharger doesn't matter because it's assumed your car will be geared correctly and you will only be in your powerband, high rpms. For a street car, positive displacement blowers and turbos are SO much more fun... You know, sometimes you don't want to seriously beat on your car... Sometimes I'm in fifth and 2k rpm and I just want to pass up a car... half throttle, boost jumps to ~4 psi, and my car PULLS without even rev'ing past 3k... Fun stuff. Rarely do I ever rev past 4k rpm on the street, unless it's a serious race, and even then it's not THAT much of a difference!!! Positive displacement blowers are as good or even better... "Yeah but they peak at only 600 rwhp." Yeah, for F-bodies... There are some HIGH peaking Roots/Twin Screws out there... If they had one for us, I would have bought one. 
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 644
Likes: 0
From: south jersey
why wouldnt you want a turbo on a manual car? does it have less power then stock in the low end?? i think the stock ls1 has plenty power at idle.. already have limited traction with just a few bolt ons, and none whatsoever above 2,500rpm in the rain...
Originally Posted by bboyferal
Good post... Yes, if you're a racing freak and will run your car on the track all the time, the curve of a centrifugal supercharger doesn't matter because it's assumed your car will be geared correctly and you will only be in your powerband, high rpms. For a street car, positive displacement blowers and turbos are SO much more fun... You know, sometimes you don't want to seriously beat on your car... Sometimes I'm in fifth and 2k rpm and I just want to pass up a car... half throttle, boost jumps to ~4 psi, and my car PULLS without even rev'ing past 3k... Fun stuff. Rarely do I ever rev past 4k rpm on the street, unless it's a serious race, and even then it's not THAT much of a difference!!! Positive displacement blowers are as good or even better... "Yeah but they peak at only 600 rwhp." Yeah, for F-bodies... There are some HIGH peaking Roots/Twin Screws out there... If they had one for us, I would have bought one.
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We had a 346ci Trans-Am that we were pushing 16 psi of boost (http://www.exoticperformanceplus.com...Car.php?car=27) with an ATI ProCharger. This car was making over 700 ft lbs of torque and 717 rwhp on my Mustang Chassis Dyno. You could feel this car making boost at 2500 rpm, as the smaller pulley on the blower helped it to come in so much sooner. Bob
Originally Posted by ironexecutioner
AHHH i have read all of this and dont know what to do!!!!!!!!!
Originally Posted by bboyferal
Good post... Yes, if you're a racing freak and will run your car on the track all the time, the curve of a centrifugal supercharger doesn't matter because it's assumed your car will be geared correctly and you will only be in your powerband, high rpms. For a street car, positive displacement blowers and turbos are SO much more fun... You know, sometimes you don't want to seriously beat on your car... Sometimes I'm in fifth and 2k rpm and I just want to pass up a car... half throttle, boost jumps to ~4 psi, and my car PULLS without even rev'ing past 3k... Fun stuff. Rarely do I ever rev past 4k rpm on the street, unless it's a serious race, and even then it's not THAT much of a difference!!! Positive displacement blowers are as good or even better... "Yeah but they peak at only 600 rwhp." Yeah, for F-bodies... There are some HIGH peaking Roots/Twin Screws out there... If they had one for us, I would have bought one.
I like the simplicity of the SC set up and power delivery of a N/A type car. Thats why I went with the ATI set up and couldn't be happier with the way it turned out. And the sound... 
HAH! You're gonna compare the sound of a Roots vs. a centrifugal? 
That's a stretch I've NEVER heard before... Oh well, we each have our own tastes. 
ALL power adders have a wall to hit, including centrifugal SC's. There are Roots/Twin Screws whose walls are farther away than Procharger D-1's... They just wouldn't fit on our cars.
3k RPM? Why rev that high? Sometimes I pass cars at 1400-2500, half-throttle, pull, and let a little air out the BPV...
Blowing tires loose? How do some of you have your cars set-up? MAYBE in first I squeal them out a little... Never throughout second.
Why are your rwhp numbers higher than your rwtq numbers? 650? In what range is that power over 550 rwhp... a couple k rpm?
It hits sooner, blows off your tires, etc... What? So, now greater area under the curve is a bad thing?
Once again, they're great... But, not everyone want to rev to 5k rpm to have 400 of their 500 rwhp...
That's a stretch I've NEVER heard before... Oh well, we each have our own tastes. ALL power adders have a wall to hit, including centrifugal SC's. There are Roots/Twin Screws whose walls are farther away than Procharger D-1's... They just wouldn't fit on our cars.
3k RPM? Why rev that high? Sometimes I pass cars at 1400-2500, half-throttle, pull, and let a little air out the BPV...
Blowing tires loose? How do some of you have your cars set-up? MAYBE in first I squeal them out a little... Never throughout second.
Why are your rwhp numbers higher than your rwtq numbers? 650? In what range is that power over 550 rwhp... a couple k rpm?
It hits sooner, blows off your tires, etc... What? So, now greater area under the curve is a bad thing?
Once again, they're great... But, not everyone want to rev to 5k rpm to have 400 of their 500 rwhp...
Originally Posted by bboyferal
HAH! You're gonna compare the sound of a Roots vs. a centrifugal? That's a stretch I've NEVER heard before... Oh well, we each have our own tastes.
ALL power adders have a wall to hit, including centrifugal SC's. There are Roots/Twin Screws whose walls are farther away than Procharger D-1's... They just wouldn't fit on our cars.
3k RPM? Why rev that high? Sometimes I pass cars at 1400-2500, half-throttle, pull, and let a little air out the BPV...
Blowing tires loose? How do some of you have your cars set-up? MAYBE in first I squeal them out a little... Never throughout second.
Why are your rwhp numbers higher than your rwtq numbers? 650? In what range is that power over 550 rwhp... a couple k rpm?
It hits sooner, blows off your tires, etc... What? So, now greater area under the curve is a bad thing?
Once again, they're great... But, not everyone want to rev to 5k rpm to have 400 of their 500 rwhp...
That's a stretch I've NEVER heard before... Oh well, we each have our own tastes. ALL power adders have a wall to hit, including centrifugal SC's. There are Roots/Twin Screws whose walls are farther away than Procharger D-1's... They just wouldn't fit on our cars.
3k RPM? Why rev that high? Sometimes I pass cars at 1400-2500, half-throttle, pull, and let a little air out the BPV...
Blowing tires loose? How do some of you have your cars set-up? MAYBE in first I squeal them out a little... Never throughout second.
Why are your rwhp numbers higher than your rwtq numbers? 650? In what range is that power over 550 rwhp... a couple k rpm?
It hits sooner, blows off your tires, etc... What? So, now greater area under the curve is a bad thing?
Once again, they're great... But, not everyone want to rev to 5k rpm to have 400 of their 500 rwhp...
There is just so much to either setup, a crappy turbo setup is just as bad as a crappy blower setup but some people will still be happy with a bad setup because its what they WANT. I've owned/built several of each and you wont convince me one is 'better' then the other.
I still stand by for ease of install, tuning, reliability, availability and overall power its hard to beat a decent procharger setup on an F-body unless you can fabricate and tune your own turbo setup (or pay someone to do it anyhow).
WERD KEV WERD.....I could spin em at 65 with my old procharger set up, punch it and BAM power on tap....the turbo...no....punch it...wait for it...wait for it
Isn't time to lock this one? Its served its useful life and the answer is...it'll go either way depending on who you ask.
Isn't time to lock this one? Its served its useful life and the answer is...it'll go either way depending on who you ask.
Originally Posted by kp
hmmm, my car will spin 11.5x28 QTPs on the highway at 60mph if I drop to 2nd and nail it, must be a badly set up car since it had only cut 1.32 60 foots off the footbrake with DOT tires. So whats your secret to hooking up 700rwhp on the street, I'm all ears..
You're missing the point... It seems that some people believe that Roots/Twin Screws/Turbo's aren't fun on the street because you can break them loose on the midrange unlike centrifugal blowers, e.g. post above my previous one ("...Blowing off the tires that much easier..."). That's what I was responding to. Well, you've made that person's point moot now because you've set forth the fact it happens to centrifugal blowers, too.
Now you have me really confused! Realistically, now, it was never a good point of course.
Originally Posted by kp
There is just so much to either setup, a crappy turbo setup is just as bad as a crappy blower setup but some people will still be happy with a bad setup because its what they WANT. I've owned/built several of each and you wont convince me one is 'better' then the other.
I still stand by for ease of install, tuning, reliability, availability and overall power its hard to beat a decent procharger setup on an F-body unless you can fabricate and tune your own turbo setup (or pay someone to do it anyhow).
I still stand by for ease of install, tuning, reliability, availability and overall power its hard to beat a decent procharger setup on an F-body unless you can fabricate and tune your own turbo setup (or pay someone to do it anyhow).
Who Posted?
Total Posts: 157
User Name Posts
bboyferal 23
Semp3rFi 11
Exotic Performance Plus 9
Detroitmuscle 7
obZidian 4
Drewstein 4
buschman 4
kp 4
TS6 4
frcefed98 4
reject 4
MountainMotor 3
Superman09 3
Frost 3
BUYAMERICAN 3
sscam68 3
MyWs62FaST4u 3
PNYKILR 3
Slowhawk 2
pwrtrip75 2
SRZ 2
Ryan K 2
loreak 2
2001WS6Vert 2
NOIR 2
boosted99camaro 2
Iroc313 2
hellbents10 1
00454sscamaro 1
RICEBURNER 1
DJ's99SS 1
Chas1 1
I<3Bboyferal 1
Ferocity02 1
ironexecutioner 1
jason02Z 1
thislswon 1
stevemilz 1
black01_WS6 1
98turbls1 1
MY99TAWS6 1
NHRAMAN 1
Wet 1 1
Z2K_MrJ 1
2MuchRiceMakesMeSick 1
NOS USER 1
White.Lightning 1
BlwnTA 1
Street Lethal 1
Rynofasho 1
msb184 1
slick1851 1
UnZFeat'd 1
XxGarbSxX 1
Assassin 1
Urban Legend 1
Built LT1 1
Revolutionary 1
american thunda 1
hotrod04 1
N20LS1 1
LSONE 1
unSStoppable 1
SStolen 1
ty_ty13 1
andereck 1
blu00rdstr 1
Damn dude
*edit* didn't mean to lock it LOL...whoops....Kev feel free too, but i'm thinking this one is done.
Total Posts: 157
User Name Posts
bboyferal 23
Semp3rFi 11
Exotic Performance Plus 9
Detroitmuscle 7
obZidian 4
Drewstein 4
buschman 4
kp 4
TS6 4
frcefed98 4
reject 4
MountainMotor 3
Superman09 3
Frost 3
BUYAMERICAN 3
sscam68 3
MyWs62FaST4u 3
PNYKILR 3
Slowhawk 2
pwrtrip75 2
SRZ 2
Ryan K 2
loreak 2
2001WS6Vert 2
NOIR 2
boosted99camaro 2
Iroc313 2
hellbents10 1
00454sscamaro 1
RICEBURNER 1
DJ's99SS 1
Chas1 1
I<3Bboyferal 1
Ferocity02 1
ironexecutioner 1
jason02Z 1
thislswon 1
stevemilz 1
black01_WS6 1
98turbls1 1
MY99TAWS6 1
NHRAMAN 1
Wet 1 1
Z2K_MrJ 1
2MuchRiceMakesMeSick 1
NOS USER 1
White.Lightning 1
BlwnTA 1
Street Lethal 1
Rynofasho 1
msb184 1
slick1851 1
UnZFeat'd 1
XxGarbSxX 1
Assassin 1
Urban Legend 1
Built LT1 1
Revolutionary 1
american thunda 1
hotrod04 1
N20LS1 1
LSONE 1
unSStoppable 1
SStolen 1
ty_ty13 1
andereck 1
blu00rdstr 1
Damn dude
*edit* didn't mean to lock it LOL...whoops....Kev feel free too, but i'm thinking this one is done.
lol, I dont mind discussing it and let people debate about it, its been a fairly clean, no drama thread. There are pros and cons to each and people are passionate about what they own usually, especially for what the stuff costs. Personally I see a turbo or a blower no different then a 3/8 drive ratchet, its a tool that I can make work for me no matter what kind of car I use it on.