johnfin

I think my seal is leaking. Dripping at the nut. Is it easy to change the seal? Some rear ends have a crush sleeve and torque specs to set the backlash

JohnnyBs98WS6Rag

iTrader: (1)

I'm not sure what the "official" service procedure is, but I've heard that simply removing the nut and yoke (after removing the driveshaft of course) allows the seal to be replaced. When re-installing the yoke, torque the nut as much as you can without crushing the sleeve further (make sure the parking brake is set to prevent the wheels from moving the car as you torque the pinion nut). I'm thinking 150 ft-lbs should be sufficient. Might want to check the service manual on this job though to be sure the proper torque value is used. You can also mark the nut to pinion shaft before it is removed and torque it back to the same position.

The gear backlash won't be affected by the torque on the pinion nut, but he pinion bearing preload will be. If you torque the nut too much and crush the sleeve further, you'll end up with too much preload and shorten the life of the bearings. Fixing this situation requires disassembly and re-assembly w/ a new crush sleeve (and a different technique for setting proper pinion bearing preload). If you end up with too little pinion bearing preload, the pinion will shift around under load and cause early bearing failure as well.

biketopia

iTrader: (5)

I've done many many pinion seals over the years by just making marks on everything. Make an alignment mark on the pinion, the nut and the yoke, I use a cold chisel. Remove the nut, yoke, and the seal, install and line up the marks and tighten the nut back to your original mark and you'll be good to go.

johnfin

My pinion nut was not very tight. Whats with that? And how come some people say you have to replace the crush sleeve. Also do you need a puller for the yoke?

FirstYrLS1Z

iTrader: (4)

When installing the pinion nut with a new crush sleeve,it takes a huge amount of wrench torque to crush the crush sleeve to get to the required pinion bearings preload of about 25 INCH POUNDS. Loosening the nut should still take some torque but nowhere near as much as the tightening procedure. A not very tight pinion nut is typical as the bearings wear in(or deteriorate). Yoke to pinion is the fit of the splines and there could be corrosion build-up. I guess a puller could be useful. I typically just tap it off with a hammer. One end of the crush sleeve bears against the outer(smaller) bearings' inner race and should keep that inner race from spinning on the pinion. The existing crush sleeve has to be tightened to accomplish that and provide the proper bearing preload(used bearings about 10 INCH POUNDS). I've never used a new crush sleeve for seal replacement as I know what it takes to return to proper setting.
It's good to check for pinion wobble,indicating potential bad bearings but you're already past that point since it seems you've already loosened/removed the pinion nut.

johnfin

Should i make the nut a hair tighter during inatall?

FirstYrLS1Z

iTrader: (4)

As you're tightening the nut,tightening force torque needed will all of a sudden DRAMATICALLY increase. That's the point where you're starting to bear against the crush sleeve. Stop right there and rotate the pinion to make sure it's not too tight to turn by hand(not talking about what it takes to get it turning but the rotational force to turn it a full turn) and also check for any pinion wobble,up/down left/right.

johnfin

FirstYrLS1Z, my rear end is shot. Yolk moves up and down. Is it possible to remove the front bearing and crush sleeve with normal tools?

FirstYrLS1Z

iTrader: (4)

You never stated vehicle description ! Year ? Traction control ?
By front bearing I assume your mean the smaller bearing right underneath the yoke. Possibly but not probably with hand tools. The front bearing is a tight slip fit / slight press fit on the pinion. Most of the time the pinion has to be forced rearward(out of the rear end) and the bearing will stay at the race.
Once I know more about the vehicle,then I can post more.

johnfin

2002 WS6 Transam antilock and traction control. Pinion is loose as a goose, no more press fit there. LOL. Where is the crush sleeve located?

FirstYrLS1Z

iTrader: (4)

Pinion nut,then washer,then yoke,then smaller outer bearing,then crush sleeve,then large inner bearing,the pinion bearing shim in sequence on the pinion. Bearing races are pressed into the housing.

plenty of pics for reference at google 'crush sleeve pinion' images
https://www.google.com/search?q=crus...w=1366&bih=565

johnfin

So if I want to do the bearings on the pinion correctly with races, can I remove the differential/ring gear and work on the pinion or would I disturb the differential backlash settings.

FirstYrLS1Z

iTrader: (4)

Potentially ! You said the pinion had wobble,that right there would have introduced a different wear pattern between the pinion gear and the ring gearb and that different wear pattern could actually be wearing out the gears. But getting back to your question. Pinion depth is the 1st thing to set. If the replacement bearing/race is dimensionally identical to the original one as it was when installed by the rear end manufacturer,then necessary pinion depth will be the same. Measuring the thickness of a used bearing with race is typically less(but not by much) then when they were new. Bearing manufacturers have the part numbers stamped in the bearings' inner race and outer race,always best to use the same number. So if everything on the pinion matches / is good,backlash SHOULD be OK. The large inner bearings' race HAS TO BE PRESSED ALL THE WAY INTO THE CASES' COUNTERBORE.
BUT if a new/different wear pattern has been established because of the 'wobble',you could end up with noise.

You're probably getting pretty frustrated,you need the rear end fixed and/but it could be very involved. I'm 72,still working on the little 10 bolts. 50 years ago in my start of working on rears,I did things that should not have been done and yet they didn't break,might have been noisy but they lasted. I won't relate any of the horror stories. Rear ends are tough,they have to be.

johnfin

What special tools are manitory for rebuilding the 10 bolt. I will pop the rear cover and poop the front seal. If the gears look ok and front race looks good, i will pop in a new front pinion bearing and call it a day. Stay posted for pics

johnfin

johnfin

Everything looks good. Only had a pint of oild though. Front pinion outer race looks good. Thinking of just replacing the timkin pinion bearing and tighting it until there is no play. What should i do with the crush sleeve.

FirstYrLS1Z

iTrader: (4)

Everything looks good,even the bearing. I would be reusing that bearing as the race has a matched wear-in pattern to/for it.
What do you mean 'what should I do with the crush sleeve ? If that were mine,I would be using all the existing parts,except for the seal(and that's probably still serviceable). Use some RTV on the outer surface of the seal that presses into the housing and some RTV on the splines(it does leak there). Tighten the pinion nut up to where I got what I considered a good INCH POUNDS(20-25 INCH POUNDS considering you'll be rotating the pinion,carrier with its' bearings and the axles) rotational torque. Could be hundreds of foot pounds on the pinion nut to attain it,maybe not.

johnfin

I dont understand. First its inch lbs on the pinion nut then foot lbs. Which is it. And....is it manditory that both wheels be fee spining when i tighten the nut?

FirstYrLS1Z

iTrader: (4)

The foot pounds is the tightening of the 1 1/4" hex pinion nut to be able to put the proper bearing preload which is measured in inch pounds. It's a step by step procedure.
Tighten nut until it bottoms out(not a lot of wrench torque),then use that socket on a inch pounds dial torque wrench to measure how much it take to turn the pinion(not staring torque but once it starts turning) desired range 20-25 inch pounds,tighten pinion nut more slightly and measure rotational torque again,step by step. You need a specialized dial type inch pound torque wrench to measure rotational torque.

Yes,both wheels are off the ground. Turning the pinion turns the ring gear and carrier posi and that turns the wheels.

google 'in lb dial torque wrench' images to see.

I'm going to over-simplify it if I was down there doing it without a in.lb. dial torque wrench.
When the pinion nut is loose,there is up/down left/right wobble in the pinion.As you tighten the nut,wobble will decrease. Reach a point of tightening the nut where the wobble almost doesn't exist. A slight more(very slight) tightening and wobble is gone indicating the bearings are sitting in the races. Then I would tighten about 1/32-1/16 of a turn to put preload into the bearings and be done.

johnfin

Done deal, that is what i was going to do. Thanks.