safemode

iTrader: (1)

I've done a decent deal of searching for the cause or solution to a problem I've been having an embarassingly long time. As the subject says, it's a vibration/grinding noise felt through the steering wheel and heard by anyone in and around the car when turning right (while moving). You hear/feel it much more when applying the brakes at the same time as turning right (the sharper the right the worse the noise as well until it would actually lock the steering as if you had turned to full stop even though you haven't).

It's a horrible sounding grinding noise that I was sure was going to be the result of some destroyed bushing, broken suspension component or some strange hub / brake problem that didn't manifest under the stress of going straight or making a left turn.

Additionally, the engine would whine like one of the pulleys were putting a serious load on the serpentine system once you straightened out after a right turn.

I noticed other people who have had the same exact symptoms but nobody has posted with a solution and if they had the same problem then I understand why.

The Cause:
Low power steering fluid.. Like seriously too low. That's it. All the grinding noise and vibration felt through the steering wheel was due to just that. And it made sense that it was noticable on right turns rather than left because right turns put more of a strain on the power steering system. I can only assume that braking had a contributing factor because of the added stress from stopping during a tight turn.

The Solution:
Topping off the power steering fluid. But also I should track down and fix the very obvious leak in my power steering system. When i have money anyway.

If you seem to have a full fluid resevoir and experience these symptoms (note, you should get no grinding or vibration when going straight and it's very doubtful the problem would start off coming from turning left or reversing) then I would consider some other type of failure in the power steering pump that mimics the effects you get when you are low on fluid in a functional pump, which means getting a new ps pump.

Anyways, I hope this helps out anyone banging their head trying to track down a suspension failure before checking something stupid like fluid levels.

wssix99

iTrader: (5)

Why is that?

safemode

iTrader: (1)

In a perfectly weight balanced car, there really shouldn't be any difference in how hard the rack has to work to keep the wheels pointed in any direction. Cars aren't like that (unless they're purpose built).

Though in all likelihood it was probably just that for whatever reason the right side of the piston kept getting more air (perhaps the fluid intake for the pump is on the right side of the resevoir a bit and turning right pulled the fluid to the left, exposing the intake to just air rather than the little fluid left in the resevoir) Similar to how third gen camaro's gas tanks weren't baffled and if you were too low on gas turning right would dry out the pump and cause you to stall.

wssix99

iTrader: (5)

So, the right turn issues only happened at high speeds, then and not show turns? (That would be unusual.)

safemode

iTrader: (1)

no, it would happen at any speed, but the sharper and quicker the turn, the more noticable the effect, especially when slowing down at the same time.

That makes it seem even more likely that the intake for the hydraulic pump is located slightly on the right rear of the resevoir ... so making a right turn while slowing down will cause the fluid to move towards the front left. And if you have little enough fluid in there, it probably exposes the pump intake to air in that situation before other motions would allow the same intake of air to occur.

wssix99

iTrader: (5)

I wouldn't think the sloshing of fluid in the tank would be very pronounced at low speeds, but if it was all-the-way-low, it might be.

Do you think that the steering issue could have magnified a small problem with the hubs/bearings on the right side of the car? (They don't last very long.) Could a vibration from the steering caused a loose/worn bearing to act up?

safemode

iTrader: (1)

a bearing is going to be noticable all the time. not just turning. You would also have noticable increase in heat from a wheel with worn bearings. What becomes pronounced during turning with a bearing issue is that the wheel will wobble, causing unexpected steering issues that you'll feel. Not a metal on metal grinding feeling. If the bearings were that bad you'd definitely feel it all the time.

The pump getting partial air in the cylinder alone will cause the above symptoms. If you look at the design of the reservoir you can see how this can occur. The supply line (big hose) is in the center and rises above the lowest part of the tank (possibly to reduce debris getting recirculated into pump?) . The return line is actually positioned at the lowest point and there is much more room on the lower side towards the front of the tank that is lower than the supply than behind the supply. The supply is also on the right side just as i had guessed.

After looking at the actual resevoir from all sides, it's pretty easy to see why slowing down and making a right turn will cause your low fluid condition to be a no-fluid condiiton as far as your pump is concerned when you are very low on fluid. It would easily be the first symptom of low fluid assuming the leak is slow enough that it doesn't skip ahead and just become a no-fluid under any circumstance - situation.

Unless gm designed it that way to avoid debris, i can't imagine why they made the resevoir tank like this. Most other tanks i've seen are cylindrical or at least the supply is at the lowest point. But hey, it's gm.

wssix99

iTrader: (5)

Only if its totally shot. As they start to go bad and wear out, they will act up in turns as increased lateral stresses are introduced to the hub. I've had many bearings start to go this way.


Are we talking about a LS1 F Body here? The tank inlet is actually low and dumps directly in to the pump body.