does anyone run this combo - 243 heads with TR230/224/111
 

I have a 2002 Z28 6-speed with about 38k on it. All I have done to it is 4.11 rear, Kooks 1-3/4 long tubes, magnaflow cats B&B triflow cat back, SLP Lid & MAF, z06 clutch and UMI Torque arm, LCA's and frame rail connectors.

On a mobile dyno and I was able to produce 344hp and 351ft/lbs at the rear wheels in good air with a mail order tune on stock heads and cam.

I saw a brand new set of 243 heads on a vette forum with the light weight valves and yellow springs for only $500 so I picked them up. I plan ti use them as is, no modifications. I just bought the TR230/224/111 cam and hardened pushrods.

I plan on purchasing the install kit (gaskets and such) leaving the stock balancer, TBI and injectors. After the install I want to have it properly tuned.

I have done a little research and found that it will be ok to use the yellow springs with this cam and that I will not have to upgrade injectors or headders.

I am wondering if anyone else has used this exact head cam combo and what results have you had, drivability, idle, emissions, HP gains and such. Or do you have any advise as to other parts I may wnat to consider.

Thanks in advance.

My cam is based off that one but I don't have heads or a good dyno result...but I read about others with that cam often.

With your bolt on numbers and the general gains I see I would expect that cam and heads to put you around 415-425rwhp with your set up and a good tune.

One guy on here even made 400rwhp cam only with an automatic with that cam

i would not use the ls6 springs with that cam

x2

He will need better springs. Thunder Racing recommends comp 918 or something similar.

I suppose I could by springs, I didnt see anywhere on Thunder Racings website where they reccomended a spring upgrade for that cam. The yellow springs are for a LS6 cam with .550 lift, the TR230 only had .575 lift.

Yellow springs are rated for about .570 lift max. Used springs at more than maximum capacity sounds like a time bomb. http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...2/buttkick.gif

They are not used springs.

There is no reason to not upgrade springs. If you are going to be going h/c why would you spend all that money and leave a weak spot like springs? Especially if you're gonna be so close to there max lift. +1 for possible ticking time bomb. But then again, it could run perfect. If it was me, I would make sure to uprade the springs!

I see, I will look into springs. Thanks for all the advice.

EDIT

I looked into 918 springs, they are only $190, If i buy these, can I reuse the stock keepers and retainers or do I have to buy them too?

as everybody said you don't want to run ls6 springs with that cam. lift is only one factor. ramp rates are also a big deal when picking a spring to match a cam. 918's work with stock seats and retainers(plug and play). if your looking for a nice spring look at the PAC 1218's or for a little more cash the 1518's

search for VIPRETR2. he is running the tr230 with 243's. he has been 10.80's i believe

Well i suppose I could order the 918's for $190 and reuse the stock retainers and keepers to try and stay within budget. Thanks fellas.

I'm using the PAC 1218's instead of the Comp 918. I've been very happy with mine and was able to pick them up at Speed Inc. for around $140. Should be a really nice combo you are putting together though.

X2 on the 1218's.....

some good info guys answered the question i was looking for as well!

I finally got the heads and cam in, car hauls ass above 3000RPM's

He is a driving MOFO though lol. Also had a 12 bolt.

Some people were asking me my gains from the TR230 and 243 heads

60hp and 15ft/lbs at the rears from a cam upgrade. I switched from the stock 241 head to a brand new set of Z06 243 heads when I did the cam.

The car had a different mail order tune for both before cam and after cam. I believ both dyno charts to be "corrected"



2002 Z28 6-Speed with approx 33,000miles in 2008
Kooks 1-3/4" Catted Y-pipe, B&B triflow cat back
SLP MAF
SLP LID
180 Thermostat
Mail order tune
Everything else stock
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...uns_Page_1.jpg





2002 Z28 6-Speed with approx 41,000 miles on 2010
Kooks 1-3/4" Catted Y-pipe, B&B triflow cat back
SLP MAF
SLP LID
180 Thermostat
Mail order tune
TR230 CAM
243 Z06 Heads
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...uns_Page_2.jpg

Please buy injectors. You will be easily maxing out your stockers.

yep, get bigger injectors!

Not necessarily, if he's running the stock 28#s, he should be ok.

If possible, you should really look into a street/dyno tune, I feel your TQ output should be higher. Mail-order tunes are great to get you goin, but the dyno will really tell the tuner what adjustment needs to be made.

I have almost identical mods heads/cam/etc and was able to make 412hp, 389tq....so you might have a little more in there. Good job nonetheless.

243 heads and a TR230 cam? On stock injectors? No. I have seen the 26 pound stockers cost hp on the dyno on a cam only car. Its not safe IMO to run an injector maxed out like that. SAE states injectors should run at no more then 80% duty cycle. Stockers run that at stock power levels. Best bet is to call up FIC and have them spec you out a flow rate, then have them rejet a set of stock injectors. They will come flow matched and are reasonably priced. I bought a set from them when I thought the SVO green tops would be a little overkill for my set-up. They spec'd me a set that flows 42 at our pressure. That will be plenty for my needs. I have a feeling this would be good for you as well and give you a little room to grow also.

what he said. you don't want your duty cycle at 90%, the lower the better and the less chance of leaning out at WOT

I think I am ok with the stock injectors

Think in one hand and shit in the other and see what you got. I hate people who seek advice then don't listen. I'm through with this Betty Boop.

I was not seeking advice. In my first post a year ago I stated that I am keeping my injectors. In my post yesterday I was only publishing my results based on some PM's I got over the year regarding my post. Its my car and I can do what I want with it. Its nice to have an opinion but there is no need to be a dick.

So you'd rather replace your motor instead of a set of injectors? why not spend the $200 and find a used set of 42's just to be safe. in my opinion thats cheap insurance.

I dont need to replace my motor. It runs just fine. Thank you all.

My injectors are maxed with just the cam...I am def upgrading when I replace the heads with 243s.

You are taking some risks here. Did you get someone to look at your air/fuel ratio??? Do you even have an idea what your injector duty cycle is?

If the answer to either of those is "no" then your "i think it will be fine" attitude is a very poor decision and you are very likely to cause engine damage. For all you know it's running knock retard now and costing you power on top of that.

Theres no risk unless I drive with my foot to the floor which I very seldom do. I am not building a motor around one dyno day or to drag race. Again, i apreciate all of the advise, I do, really. But I assure you, I am good with the stock injectors.

Alright, but for future reference to anyone else who finds this thread, I would like to state my stock 28.8# (the larger f body) injectors pass the 80% threshold at a much lower throttle position and rpm than WOT. At wot they are running 95-96% and my tune is on the leaner 13:1 af side.

I wouldn't even want to know what it would look like with 243 heads and the more aggressive mid range lift TR lobes.

run it to lean and you will, thats what nasty was referring to when he said you'd rather replace your motor.

like he said and we've all said it's cheap insurance, you don't need to go WOT all the time for the leaning out to hurt your engine . . . good luck with the stock injectors since you've decided to stick with them

Upon choosing my current cam this is what i wrote to Thunnder racing in an e-mail...




I have a 2002 Z28 6-speed.

The only modifications to the car now are as follows:


1) Kooks 1-3/4 Headers with low restriction (magnaflow) cats.

2) B&B Triflow cat back

3) 4.11 rear ratio

4) SLP Lid and MAF

5) PCM tune

6) Thunder racing 224/224 112 cam upgraded springs & pushrods.


I just picked up a unmolested set of 2002 Z06 243 Heads with the yellow springs and sodium filled valves.

I am not going to upgrade the headers to 1-7/8 but I will have the PCM retuned.

I do not want a large cam with heavy loping and drivability issues.

My four questions to you before I order anything are...

1) What cam would you reccomend to complement these heads the extent of their flow ability without compromising drivability?

2) If I port them, then what cam would you recommend?

3) Will the springs have to be upgraded?

4) Will I have to upgrade injectors of throttle body with the CAM you recommend?

And this was their reply...


If you do not port the heads I would suggest going with the 230/224/111LSA cam. Has the driveablitly of the TR224 but will make more power. If you do go ahead and port the heads the TR227 Extreme would be a pretty good choice for what you are looking at. Specs are 227/227/ - 116 LSA. Lift is .639/.639. It idles similar to the 224 but will utilize the flow of the ported cylinder head better. If you decide to go with the 230/224 you will not have to change springs, but you will definitely have to change the springs with the 227 extreme. As far as the injectors you should be fine with the stock one. Let me know if you have any further questions or if which direction you are looking to go.

As you see I did my research, what scares me a little was that the reply about the springs was wrong. I am not opposed to having the car professionaly tuned and before i do that, if I do, I would probably go with bigger injectors, however for the minimal amount I drive the car and what i do with it. I feel that I am ok.

i'm a big fan of thunder racing and i had their 227/224 cam and plan to have a custom 230/227 on a 116LSA but in this discussion i would seek a second opinion. the spring and the injectors statement i totally disagree with and i'm sure most here do. a salesman is paid to sell and not all know the best advice to the customer, most are looking for the $$$$ i'd suggest the 230/224 over that 227 extreme because you wont be changing springs in a year or so if you get the reverse split cam, the lift is killer on that 227. and the injector advice, ask a second opinion especially if you plan to have it dyno tuned eventually. call an a few spped shops and ask them tell them your mods and what your planning on doing . . . call FIC and ask him, he would be the best.

I agree which is why i would think he would have suggested selling me springs and injectors.

I contacted fic about resizing my injectors. Something I may consider this winter.

Thanks for all your advice.

no problem man, we're all here to help. good luck on your build and remember to take pics and post up vids when your done with it all:thumb:

What size injectors would you guys recommend? I'm looking at some 30 lb. I have LT's ORY 243's 11:1 compression and this cam..

If you got your car dyno tuned, you can find out what % duty cycle your inj is at at WOT and part throttle. You can base that info on what size inj you need.

Mine w/ my cam and stock 243, my 28.8lb were logging roughly 65+% at 5500 rpm (93-94 MPH) at part throttle.

i'd go with 42's because it will leave you room to grow if you decided to spray it or put better heads on it and so forth

I have stock 243 heads and 28.8lbs injectors too and 65% at 5500 doesnt sound all that terrible.

G5x2 and over 90% duty cycle with 28lb injectors and stock 241 heads. Tuner said I SHOULD even upgrade them now, def if I did anymore upgrades.

Give it up guys. You cant help someone that wont let themselves be helped. Have fun leaning your car out.

I'm not sure which one of us replied to that e-mail, but I assure you that there was a missunderstanding on the spring issue. No one here would suggest running ls6 springs with our TR230.

As far as the injector issue goes... Get it to a tuner and he can tell you what you need. Although you are getting to the point of upgrading, stock injectors should be ok with this combo (we have done a few ;) )

Yeah, I know I am fine. People have good points and I already considerd resizing them well before installing the cam, maybe I will do that this winter in anticipation for finer tuning or future upgrades. For now its fine, plugs look good, no overheating issues on the highway, its running well.