Once the bottom end is forged what becomes the weak link ?
09-23-2016, 10:07 AM
#1
Teching In
Thread Starter
iTrader: (8)
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Blue Ridge, Ga
Posts: 16
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Once the bottom end is forged what becomes the weak link ? Forgive me if this is a stupid question or too broad but once you forge the bottom end of an ls1 what becomes the weak link in the engine if you stay under the hp rating of the forged components and strength of the valvetrain components ?
Last edited by mad_22_07; 09-23-2016 at 03:49 PM.
09-23-2016, 10:24 AM
#2
Restricted User
Valvetrain components don't have an HP rating lol.
Depends on which block you're talking and what year.
The stock LS1 rotating assembly is good to around ~650whp. The sleeves on the early blocks like to crack not much higher than that. Later LS1 blocks were a lot stronger, and a few guys have made 800+whp on the stock shortblock.
The truck blocks seem to have a lot more success power wise. Lots of 1000 HP stock shortblocks. Limit is usually the 4-bolt heads and 7/16 head bolts/studs. The heads start to lift somewhere in the 1200-1400 HP range and you either need to run custom Aged ARP studs, upgrade to 1/2" studs, or buy an aftermarket block with 6-bolt heads.
Depends on which block you're talking and what year.
The stock LS1 rotating assembly is good to around ~650whp. The sleeves on the early blocks like to crack not much higher than that. Later LS1 blocks were a lot stronger, and a few guys have made 800+whp on the stock shortblock.
The truck blocks seem to have a lot more success power wise. Lots of 1000 HP stock shortblocks. Limit is usually the 4-bolt heads and 7/16 head bolts/studs. The heads start to lift somewhere in the 1200-1400 HP range and you either need to run custom Aged ARP studs, upgrade to 1/2" studs, or buy an aftermarket block with 6-bolt heads.
09-23-2016, 12:03 PM
#3
I've been trying to find the words for years to explain how i feel about this.
Finally found them (my new, go to post when people bring up building engines)
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...l#post19400863
It isn't written by me so... should go over pretty well!
Finally found them (my new, go to post when people bring up building engines)
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...l#post19400863
When you have full control over how much air the engine breathes, increasing displacement has severely diminishing returns. The money spend doing so has even greater diminishing returns. You're likely going to trash your block and rotating assembly at some point and make less HP than the stock shortblock 4.8 guys are making.
It isn't written by me so... should go over pretty well!
09-23-2016, 03:56 PM
#4
FormerVendor
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Santa Ana, CA. USA
Posts: 2,157
Likes: 0
Received 16 Likes
on
16 Posts
Powdered Main Caps The main caps are powered metal in most cases.
This is HOW GM rates block HP.
The C5-R had billet, LS-9 forged, LS-7 forged.
The chance to find a broken LS-7 block, unusable, is good.
Fit those caps if possible using studs.
Use head studs, ProComp, as the block threads WILL "pull" using bolts over and over.
The EARLY LS-1 block has a "window" between the Main/Cam Bearing.
Never use this block for high performance.
Always add the "rubbing block" in the timing chain area.
Lance
This is HOW GM rates block HP.
The C5-R had billet, LS-9 forged, LS-7 forged.
The chance to find a broken LS-7 block, unusable, is good.
Fit those caps if possible using studs.
Use head studs, ProComp, as the block threads WILL "pull" using bolts over and over.
The EARLY LS-1 block has a "window" between the Main/Cam Bearing.
Never use this block for high performance.
Always add the "rubbing block" in the timing chain area.
Lance
09-23-2016, 04:11 PM
#5
Teching In
Thread Starter
iTrader: (8)
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Blue Ridge, Ga
Posts: 16
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks for the input guys. The engine that I'm referring to is a 2002 z28 with a factory ls6 I didn't think they were really different in terms of strength so I said ls1. The other day I changed my oil and noticed when I poured the oil out of the filter and noticed a gold glitter tint no symptoms of problems other than that no noise and holds 45+ oil pressure at idle and goes to 80 at wot but I assume this is temporary and will start seeing symptoms shortly of the wearing parts I assume cam bearings and after doing some research decided to just pull the motor have it machined and replace the pistons and rods with forged components. At the moment the car is putting 440/405 to the wheels and I'm not really wanting to change the displacement and don't see myself ever doing anything more than a 150 shot on it. Was basically just trying to find out if getting it machined, replacing the cam bearings and having the walls honed then installing forged rods and pistons I would be ok to stay with the block I have or are there other components I should look at replacing as well. This is just a street car probably wont ever see a track.
Last edited by mad_22_07; 09-23-2016 at 04:27 PM.
09-23-2016, 06:05 PM
#6
FormerVendor
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Santa Ana, CA. USA
Posts: 2,157
Likes: 0
Received 16 Likes
on
16 Posts
Late LS-1/Z06 = GREAT A BIG Difference 1998/2002 in LS-1 Blocks.
OK, you should have the equal length Head Bolt length, great for a late stud kit.
You should have the Timing Chain "Rubbing Block" there or at the least the holes will be bored/taped. (great)
No hole between cam/main saddle, great.
Non-Sponsor Soliciting Policy
Regrind the camshaft (better for lifter position AND lower roller speed) and install longer push rods.(stronger)
Maybe "yellow" springs for up to .560" ?
My coils for NOS ?
Lance
OK, you should have the equal length Head Bolt length, great for a late stud kit.
You should have the Timing Chain "Rubbing Block" there or at the least the holes will be bored/taped. (great)
No hole between cam/main saddle, great.
Non-Sponsor Soliciting Policy
Regrind the camshaft (better for lifter position AND lower roller speed) and install longer push rods.(stronger)
Maybe "yellow" springs for up to .560" ?
My coils for NOS ?
Lance
Last edited by KCS; 09-25-2016 at 12:14 PM. Reason: Solicitation
09-21-2019, 11:21 AM
#7
I cannot emphasize enough to NOT use a warhawk block. I had one of the early ones it was a piece of garbage. Even if they are better now, why would you use a company that released such a bad product? Their heads were the same and customer service was awful.
There are so many proven options now I would never consider a world product. Save your time and $ and purchase something with a consistently proven track record. Just trying to save you some $ and headaches
There are so many proven options now I would never consider a world product. Save your time and $ and purchase something with a consistently proven track record. Just trying to save you some $ and headaches
Trending Topics
09-23-2019, 10:54 AM
#8
Staging Lane
I had an LS-6 in my 2001 Camaro Z-28. The engine had meth system, cam, and a DS1C pro-charger. Stock internals. It made 605 rwhp and lasted for five plus years of racing(mid 10 et) and driving. It finally broke but it was a valve spring. Rather that repair the valve spring I decided to replace the LS 6 with an LS 3 and unfortunately it only lasted 3000 miles using the same add-ons. Wish I had of repaired the LS 6.
