z-maro

iTrader: (18)

Thanks, I am hoping all the research pays off. Boost is not in the plans, especially with the higher compression heads. A 100 shot would probably be the extent of any power adders at this point.

00pooterSS

iTrader: (40)

Lighter is always better. Plus it puts more of the power to the pavement rather than sucking some of it up getting those "flywheels" spinning. I'd rather take weight out of "flywheels" on the car by lightening the wheels. If you lighten the flywheel on the engine or lighten the wheels you get the same effect, but if you lighten the flywheel at the engine you will loose a little ooomph on the launch at the track.

Plus light wheels also have the added benefit of reducing unsprung weight.

I've broken a couple high end sockets on those rocker bolts, get you a 3/8" drive impact socket in 8mm. Be very careful, a broken socket ends up in a rounded bolt a lot of times. I would also highly recommend you get a good quality 6 point socket for the head bolts. 12 point sockets are weaker in general, get you a really good 12 point for the ARPs if you use them, my craftsman 1/2" drive thin wall has done several sets with no problems. The only sockets I have broken on a regular basis are snap on. Last one I broke was a 8mm and I broke it on an LS rocker arm and it rounded the bolt and I had to chisel it out. I've had better luck with craftsman than I have snap on. So now I buy Matco. But I also have craftsman sockets that have lasted 20 years of abuse with impacts, and they are non impact sockets.

z-maro

iTrader: (18)

I use craftsman sockets, it was an easy exchange for new ones at my local sears and none of the bolts got rounded out.

I finally got that last headbolt out and drivers side head removed. I had to loosen up the exhaust to get the headers to drop low enough.

Yesterday I got the ATI damper off using the O'reillys rental tool. Now I just have to remove the front cover, oil pump, timing set, and cam. Then I can start putting it all back together. I am getting excited to have it running again, and am hoping that the clutch will hold up for the street tune and for the summer. Any suggestions to keep the clutch alive? I'm hopeful that with the street tires they would break loose before the clutch starts slipping.

Firebirdmuscle

iTrader: (16)

Got an update yet Z camaro?

z-maro

iTrader: (18)

Yes, I actually got out to work on it today (probably won't for the rest of the week). Got the timing cover off, cam removed, and loosened the bolts on the oil pan. Dumb question, but do I need to remove the oil filter do get the oil pan to drop and give me access to the oil pickup tube to swap out the oil pump? The LS1howto procedure said it may take some prying to get the pan to drop but I didn't want to risk messing up the gasket by prying so I just gave it some love taps with a rubber mallet. The oil filter only has a few hundred miles on it so I wasn't going to take it off if I didn't need to.


Anyways the stock timing chain had quite a bit of slack, I took a quick video that is below. I sure hope the Cloyes Hex-A-Just set is tighter than this. I also noticed that my block is not tapped for a timing chain damper so I will be ordering the trick-flow adaptor and damper.

I have also pretty much decided to go with the GM 12605716 rear steam tube kit and Y it into the stock front coolant crossover vs. something like the kurt urban or Nitrous Outlet setup due to the excessive cost. I will still keep my eye on the classifieds though.

Now some Pics and vids to keep everyones attention:
Both heads finally off after having to loosen up the exhaust to get the last headbolt out of the drivers side head. I also have suspicion that the drivers side head gasket was replaced at some point as it seemed to be the new style gasket vs the graphite on the passenger side (it came off much easier and cleaner).


Timing cover removed.


Cam 3/4 of the way out.


And video of the slack in the timing chain:

Once the oil pump is off is there anything special to getting the timing gear off? Once I have those two things disassembly will be complete and I will start putting the new parts on

TrentB

iTrader: (1)

[QUOTE=z-camaro;19495612] do I need to remove the oil filter do get the oil pan to drop and give me access to the oil pickup tube to swap out the oil pump? The LS1howto procedure said it may take some prying to get the pan to drop but I didn't want to risk messing up the gasket by prying so I just gave it some love taps with a rubber mallet.


I ran into this when I was doing mine a few months ago. LS1howto leaves out a few bolts in their guide. If I remember right there are 5 bolts on each side of the pan up top to the bottom of the block. Then undo the 2 bolts on the bellhousing side, then 2 bolts on the very bottom of the pan going up and down. Once I did the last bolt the pan came down nice and easy with it.

Pretty sure I left my oil filter on as well because I also had just a few hundred miles on it.

Firebirdmuscle

iTrader: (16)

My own came down smooth after loosening all the bolts. I did not have to remove the oil filter.

And I got the gear off with a 3 jaw puller that I picked up from advance. My local one had 2 sizes. A small one and large. I ended up getting the smaller one and it has worked fine for removing the crank pulley and that gear.

Darth_V8r

iTrader: (4)

My recommendation -

1. Drop the K
2. Drop the oil pan
3. Do everything you need to do
4. Reinstall oil pan
5. Install tubular K. Going forward, you now have the room to remove the oil pan with much less fuss and effort.

FYI - once I dropped the oil pan, I never got it to properly seat until I finally dropped it again and replaced the gasket. The gasket is riveted to the oil pan by the factory (who the f*** does that???) so forget any dreams you have of working it around the pickup tube.

00pooterSS

iTrader: (40)

Don't have to pull the filter but I hope you aren't planning to reuse a sub $10 filter after all the work you're putting in.

Don't worry about the pan gasket you'll want to replace that, they are notorious for leaking so if you reuse it you'll have a leak sooner than later and be back in there doing it again.

There are bolts all around the perimeter of the oil pan, the two real long ones at the back, and the two that go through the transmission bell housing into the pan, i'd guess you may have not gotten those two.

If the pan does't fall right off a gentle tap should make it fall, every one I do the pan falls off. Most pans you'll need to persuade a little, but the LS motor pans will just fall off if you aren't careful, I had one fall and hit the floor a few years back because I pulled all the bolts out and turned to put the bolts down and the pan fell to the floor. Haven't made that mistake again lol.

z-maro

iTrader: (18)

Sounds like i need to make sure I have all the bolts loose. I thought I did 10, but maybe there are 12.

Now I'm confused on the oil pan and pump deal. The LS1Howto procedure shows you being able to get the pick up tube off the pump and on to the new pump without completely removing the pan. I also was under the impression that you couldn't replace the gasket without completely removing the pan, and have read a few places were people dropped it the .5" to 1" and just tightened it right back up without replacing the gasket with no sealing issues.

Tubular K is a whole different project that would be way down the road if I ever were to do it. If I were to do that I would want tubular control arms and the cost would get out of control fast there too.

I figured the filter would be ok for a few hundred miles then I would do another oil and filter change. I sure can just replace it now too for piece of mind.

Firebirdmuscle

iTrader: (16)

Yeah you don't have to drop the pan completely to swap pumps. Just loosen all the bolts a bit and the pan will ease down. The pick up tube will be a little stiff but you can manage to get the new pump on and still have the o ring not get pinched in there.

I think the fellow was just stating that after going through all of this work why chance a leak after it, on a cheap pan gasket.

If you wanted to drop the k member a little bit to give you more room to drop pan completely, well that also wouldn't be to bad either I suppose. But I also have a tubular k. The stocker may need some persuasion on the rusted bolts. Lol.

TrentB

iTrader: (1)

Just another bit of advise...When you go to bolt the pickup tube back on, tie a piece of thread on the bolt and the other end of the thread to the sway bar. I was really worried I would drop it. Saved my a$$ 3 times before I got it started since it was tied off with string I fished it out.

z-maro

iTrader: (18)

But is it going to leak if I reuse the gasket, or can I replace the gasket without completely removing the pan?

Thanks for the tip, I know I do not want to drop that bolt in the pan!

cals400ex

iTrader: (27)

You'll need to drop the pan to replace the gasket. I changed my pump and timing chain with just removing the bolts and dropping the pan the minimal amount that you can. I was also scared of the oil pan gasket leaking afterwards. I got lucky and it didn't. Then again, I only put a couple hundred miles on my car per year, so maybe the time will come. I also dropped the bolt in the oil pan. I panicked bc of the horror stories. I actually had it fished out of the pan in a matter of a minute. If I remember right, I used once of those magnets that extends to get the bolt.

PowellSixO

iTrader: (1)

Along those same lines, use a timing cover alignment tool as well when putting the timing cover back on. Or the front seal will leak. It's a lot easier to do now the right way, than to have to take the whole front of the motor apart again later to replace a cheap seal.

z-maro

iTrader: (18)

I guess I will plan on reusing the old gasket and hope for the best. If it leaks I'll have to think about the tubular front end setup a little sooner than later.

Like the SacCityCorvette tool, or the $700+ Kent Moore one? For the reinstallation process using something like the SacCityCorvette took I would think I would get all but the front two oil pan bolts tightened up, set the front cover on and get the bolts loosely started, use the alignment tool, tighten front cover bolts, remove the tool, install the new seal, and install the damper. I do not see a big difference between that tool and using the actual damper to align the cover, but maybe I'm missing something.

gagliano7

I loosely tighten the timing cover and put damper on to center cover than torque down timing cover. Never had a problem that way.

PowellSixO

iTrader: (1)

I attempted to do it this way, but it didn't work for me. I have a slight oil leak from the seal. Since then we've done a few more with the tool, and no more leaks. I mean it's only $39.99 for the tool, and it seems to work. Just throwing my 2 cents into the pot.

00pooterSS

iTrader: (40)

Sorry, I didn't realize you were not planning on removing the pan, I thought you were taking it all the way out not just lowering it. I guess you can reuse the pan gasket, I'm a tech so I go about repairs a little differently than someone in their driveway. I never reuse gaskets and probably never will. However I have done oil pan gaskets on F bodys and understand why you don't want to, it's a pain.

On reusing the filter, I guess you can do that too, but I just don't see the point of reusing a $5 filter. The peace of mind (in my opinion) is worth far more than that. Besides, when you drop the pan you're likely to knock dirt and **** into the pan and into the holes where oil goes to the filter, unless your motor is hospital clean. So I would take the filter off and spray the pan down and through the oil filter hole with the pan lowered and the drain plug out. Then once the motor was together I pour a quart or two into the motor with the drain plug out to wash out any remaining crap.

To help with that I would spray the **** out of the motor with brake clean to make sure there is not dirt etc that will fall into the pan while it's down.

Firebirdmuscle

iTrader: (16)

I used the sac city tool and it worked great to install. I haven't fired up yet to be 100% on no leakage but it went smooth so I don't think it will. Z that tool isn't that bad of a price and it shipped pretty fast as well.