It should make up for the weight of those cast valve covers for the F-series heads! LOL

 

it's not on FB either....Went and checked my notifications and went to FED fb page. 😜

 

New and final cam is here and installed. Going to try and find some spare time in the coming weeks to get back on the dyno with this.
Going to be running some Q16 this time and see where I can end up with the ignition timing.

 

How much different is this cam to the previous one? I think you mentioned trying a more aggressive lobe. Same opening and closing events?

 

We just finished our Billet version at half the wait , I'd like to offer a lighter cast valve cover.

 

Helicoil, the only thing I don't really like are the plunge cut reliefs with all the sharp fences around those same reliefs and/or sharp edges as that can do some weird stuff at TDC overlap with breathing and during ignition as well too. One nice deal about the F710s is their generous free drop so you can run fairly minimal reliefs and a little less dome than you normally would. I think the rest of your engine is pretty damn awesome!

 

Very cool! While the heads are off I'd also try to soften the chambers so you can run a bit more timing. Good luck!

 

Good eye on the piston - wow what a strange design.

CP modeled the pistons for my dad's last engine and they designed the dome for better crossflow at overlap and keeping air fuel separation in mind. Those sharp edges I'd imagine could even be shearing the fuel out of the air.

 

836whp give or take.

 

The Baldwin engine comparison mentioned here needs more context. This was clarified on Yellowbullet when this info came out. I’ll post a link to the thread so you can read it yourself.

It wasn’t that CID took it as an attack, it was the fact that the comparison wasn’t a good comparison and the information provided was misleading and it needed clarification. The engines mentioned are an apples to oranges comparison. It was Baldwin’s intention to use the same camshafts but the pistons in the motor with CID heads were not correct. The cam difference was no less than 10 degrees smaller on both the intake and exhaust side on the CID headed motor. Also the FED headed motor was set up with a customer supplied carb with bigger bores than the shop carb that was used on the CID motor. The CID headed motor also had a wet sump oil pump and the FED had a dry sump oil pump and different intakes were used. So to lead someone to believe the only differences between the motors was the heads is a gross misrepresentation of what was actually true. I want to make sure everyone here is perfectly clear on that before people get the wrong idea. And yes, if you want to know Baldwin’s opinion, you should call them.

More carb, bigger cam and a dry sump to pull vacuum on the crank case and reduce windage = more HP from the FED engine. Big surprise. So if FED wants to use this in any way to boost their product or “clout” then they’re just BS’ing you into believing something that’s not worth mentioning. Credit where credit is due, the F series head made good power. I’m simply clearing this up before someone that isn’t informed believes the F series head “stomps other castings” (thread title) because that hasn’t been proven in the least bit. In the words of Greg Good (an absolute gangster in the LS world. Research him.) “There isn't anything about the CID LS7 casting that takes a back seat to anyone, and the fact that you're buying from a stand-up guy that won't turn his back on you makes it a no-brainer.”

Before the nay-sayers jump in on this, Chris Frank himself AGREED with John at CID on these issues. Additionally, Baldwin in no way was intentionally misrepresenting these builds. Did they do a good job of relaying exactly what was going on? No. They just relayed the data they had. Someone that didn’t do their research and just blindly posted it up and thus the “Chris Frank F series LS7 heads stomps other castings” thread was born and information based on lack of facts began to spread. Looks like it’s still spreading….. Some of the people that are spreading it know better. That’s what gets me. Whatever fits the narrative I suppose.

Guys look, I used to be a FED fan boy. I got wrapped up in the marketing and the hype. It was only after a set of heads was ruined (M311) and I really started following the rabbit hole of LS heads that my eyes began to open. The FED F series head is by no means the end all be all to LS stuff like their aggressive marketing and forum posting makes them out to be. Is it a bad head? No. I understand that every company advertises. They have to. But don’t let aggressive marketing and forum posting blur the line between fiction and reality. Look to see who is going fast and winning races. What’s their setup, who ported the heads, who designed the cam, who put it together, what did the engine dyno, and most importantly what is the E.T. and trap speed? This is the information you’re looking for. Follow up by researching what they tell you. I think you’d be surprised at what you find. Skip the hype, cut the BS and go straight to the source. I mean the owner of the car and or the engine builder for example. Ask them their experiences with parts and why they run what they run. Most racers and engine shops won’t mind giving you info and talking engines with you.

If you bought every part that a fan boy recommended and every part that was aggressively marketed, you’d have a $100,000, 12 second car. Do you see CID, WCCH, Mamo or BES in here constantly defending their products? Wonder why that is……….

Thread link below. Also, for you N/A guys, look at the CID headed N/A car in the FB post I'll link. If that doesn't tell you what CID is capable of, idk what will.
https://www.yellowbullet.com/threads...tings.2585197/

CID N/A car.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?sto...72654156260101

 

Yeah you might want to dig deeper to get your facts correct. Gavin and myself have asked you for contact info on your order yet nothing has been provided.
You have a bad taste and you have you're right to feel that way. When anyone of MY (J.R.) customers run into an issue we go above beyond to find out what went south.
We give recommendations and if they go against it that isn't on us yet we still try to work with that customer. So for your experience to be that bad someone dropped the ball somewhere if no one was welling to help you. That is what bothers me the most. I'm not here to change your mind set whatsoever just would like more info on your case.

It's not a hype and we continue to let our customers show results, from engine builders, to EFI instructors and everyday guys and gals like ourselves. We are everywhere, forums, FB pages, YT etc to make sure everything is going well. Our stuff is NOT a cookie cutter casting. Not everyone buys our stuff 2nd hand or 3rd party is aware of what they have.

Hell our engine dyno is open to anyone who'd like to see real life data/results. We are not here to say X brand is terrible or X brand can't deliver... every casting/porter has it's place. We are one of the few that will keep and keep trying to improve our product line and customer service. ANYONE is welcome to swing by and see for themselves. Now, if you want to see apples to apples slide in my DMs and lets set it up. I'd b happy to test same day

 

Would you confirm if what armyboyatc is true or not regarding the specific engine comparison as far as the difference in cam size, wet/dry sump, and carb difference? Putting aside feelings from both sides, I'd just like to know about this specific comparison that was discussed if the cam was significantly smaller and if there was a difference in wet/dry sump and carb difference.

 

Look man, we don’t want anything to do with FED which is why we haven’t reached out. We didn’t buy these heads second hand, we bought them brand new from FED. We are already set up with a different head and we moved on. I saw a post where a guy was having issues, I related to that and I posted. I just wanted the people here to know what the deal was, yall came out and informed everyone that they are china heads and they are not “the best” and that’s more or less what I was after. Hopefully this will steer people away from buying this head and looking to either upgrade to the F series or move to a different head. Now if you’d like to move on….

What facts do I not have straight? Everything I posted came from posts that Chris agreed with. Is he lying too?

I’m just here trying to set the record straight before this goes back down a path and misleads people again. We agree that its not hype to post dyno results and I hope that we can also agree that the posts about CID vs FED were misleading. You stated “Our 10* valve angle and our free drop clearance made it where they were able to run more cam and out gunned the other's by 58HP. That was what set a few off, and took it as a "attack" on said porter and manufacture.” And you did not mention any further variables that had a significant impact on the “comparison” or lack there of.

I pointed out facts that Chris admitted to in the Yellowbullet forum post and that Baldwin will back up. I have my facts straight. If you don’t think I do, please enlighten me as to what I’m stating that’s not correct.

As for dynos, please tell us how fast the FED dyno runs down the track…… It doesn’t. E.T. and trap speed wins races. Since we are in the comparing things mood this week, lets compare this.

CID posted this and they weren’t given a response. This is a N/A CID motor. Who is running these times with FED heads? I’m not saying they don’t exist, I’m just asking.

3270LBS. Has run mid 161 MPH.

BE LS Inline 12 Degree Oval Port heads and BE LS intake.

Same valve placement and overall layout on all the BE LS Heads including the ones by Greg Good.

Made 1100 at BES, shows 1070 in the car.

 

I'm not trying to be a smart *** here but read the thread on Yellowbullet. Its all there.

 

My question should be pretty easy to answer without having to go down a YB rabbit hole.

 

Fair enough.

 

I can confirm, his information not 100% correct. When this is brought up I always asked them to call Baldwin directly. Why you may ask? Because that is what Baldwin requested and will continue to do as they requested. That way there is no "he said, she said" What I can confirm is what they told us by phone and email that day. Later he took down his post and posted those 3 as independent builds vs a shootout as we we're told.

 

A shame there isn't agreement on the engine to engine differences. You would think that would be something easy to confirm.

 

So you buy direct, things go not as planned but reaching out to us is not an option? Got it.
Nowhere on that YB thread did Chris Frank ever come in to say a single word to anyone.
Still figuring out where we are "misleading" anyone. These castings have been out for years. If there was indeed "false, misleading, aggressive marking etc" then shops and builders nationwide would be talking about this. I guess us sharing our customer's results are considered "Aggressive" Marketing? At the end of the day YOU made your choice and entitled to share your opinion and so called experience (yet to till us who you are) all that matters you moved on and happy.

 

Well don’t keep us in suspense. Tell us what happened. Don’t just say I’m not 100% correct.

FED claimed that the CID motor had an advantage over the FED motor due to the CID intake being much better. But conveniently left out the fact that the FED motor had a bigger cam, bigger carb supplied by the customer and not a shop carb, and then they left out that the FED motor had a dry sump oil system on it.

This is what I’m talking about, you can’t omit facts or lead people to believe that it was a direct comparison when it wasn’t. Just come out and say “it wasn’t a legit comparison but our motor made XXX”. Nothing wrong with that but to lead people to believe something that’s blatantly false is lying to people.

No response to the N/A track times still. Wonder why that is?

OP, sorry to junk your thread up. I just wanted to clarify a few things and make sure people know the truth. Best of luck to you and your build. I hope the new cam finds you that power you’re missing.