Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

I was doing some browsing and came across the Dart Pro 1 215cc Aluminum Cylinder Heads for an LT1. Originally I was looking at a set of A.I. 215cc Trick Flow's for ~$2600 fully assembled and shipped but I can get the Dart's for ~$1600 fully assembled and shipped but there are some differences I had questions about. I did a search but there isn't much out there on this topic (probably for a reason lol).

Comparison is as follows: (Head castings only)

A.I. Dart
Trick Flow 23* Aluminum Heads Dart 23* Aluminum Heads
215cc Intake/78cc Exhaust 215cc Intake/78cc Exhaust
2.08/1.6 Valves 2.05/1.6 Valves
62cc Chambers 58cc Chambers
Int CFM 300.4 @ .600 Int CFM 268 @ .600
Exh CFM 204.8 @ .600 Exh CFM 174 @ .600

If I were to open up the valves on the Dart heads, how would that effect the CFM's in comparison to the A.I. Heads?

Does anyone have experience with these heads or know anything about the two that can compare quality?

OR, are the Dart's just a waste of my time and should I just stick with the A.I's?

lt4388stroker

iTrader: (14)

go TEA/Trick Flow heads

355z28

iTrader: (8)

Please dont take this the wrong way, But how can you push a product you havent used yet? I cant wait to see your results.

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

I am probably not going to do it, I was just curious if I SHOULD look more into it...I am looking for a set of heads or a combo that is not widely used...LE2's/LE3's are everywhere, A.I. 215's are fairly popular as well, AFR's are overused already, and the TrickFlow 21*'s are being put on a lot of people NEW builds because they are new so if I did those, I would be part of the trend anyways. The Dart's looked promising but I am afraid that, although they are fairly unused, they may not perform very well and I do want something comparable to the A.I. 215's, AFR 210's, LE3's, etc. I have also been admiring the TEA 220's with 2.055/1.6 Valves and taking them down to a 62cc Chamber. I also might do some research on the difference between 2.055 Valves and 2.08 Valves on the TEA 220's but I am afraid that may hurt the head more than help it.

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

The difference in flow is ported vs. unported, the valvesize is NOT a big piece of that. Slapping some bigger valves in the Darts without proper porting is NOT going to bridge the gap.

Before I am accused of anything I am not saying anything negative about the Darts, I am saying you really should not be comparing a CNC'd head to an as cast one.

SSPerformance

iTrader: (76)

go with TEA trickflows

lt4388stroker

iTrader: (14)

they are bolted on the car now, waiting on header gaskets and injectors

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

Thank you, that tells me a lot. I wasnt sure if valve size mattered or not which is why I was asking. They said that the Dart heads don't have much more room to grow as far as porting goes and that 215cc was about their limit. Does anyone know if Dart 215 heads CAN be ported or modified to increase the CFM's or not? Maybe if I sent them to LE or AI or another shop to get opened up a little bit? Just curious. I am more or less just trying to learn something lol. I am most likely not gonna buy the Dart heads unless something happens to prove I should lol.

RamAir95TA

iTrader: (2)

Of course the Dart's can be ported sure, but if you've seen the results of the AI Trickflow's lately your decision should be made at this point.

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

I see several folks pushing TEA trickflows, are there results out there for them?

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

I can't seem to find any. At least not for the TEA 220's. They are asking $2K for them fully assembled but they don't say what hardware comes with them other than Ferrea Valves. They say they are for an LT1 but that they are set up for the LT4 Intake Manifold so I am going to double check on that and find out what springs, retainers, seats, locks and all that jazz that they are using. I have been searching for TEA results today but I have come up empty handed. No dyno numbers, track times or anything yet. I haven't had a lot of time to search each thread individually though...I have been just looking for something in the titles mostly and researching those. I also searched Youtube with no results lol.

I would definitely be curious to see how they perform though! Here is the link:

http://www.tickperformance.com/produ...4-engines.html

Puck

iTrader: (17)

You never said your goals or the rest of your build, so we can't really suggest a head.

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

Lol, that is because I am not necessarily looking for a head suggestion, I was just looking for a comparison between the potential of the Dart head, and the current A.I. TF 215 head. However, I will indulge since the build hasn't been fully disclosed yet...

LT1 Block Bored to 4.030 and decked to 9.012
Callies Compstar 383 Stroker Crankshaft
Callies Compstar 6" Connecting Rods
SRP Forged -5cc Pistons
.026 Thickness Head Gasket with a 4.100 Bore
Not 100% sure on the head but it will have a 62cc Chamber
Unsure of the cam at this time but will be spec'd to my heads
Comp Cams Ultra Pro Magnum 1.6 NSA Roller Rockers
Trick Flow Chromemoly Pushrods (length TBD)
Ported LT1 Intake Manifold
Professional Products 58mm Throttle Body
LS1 Air Lid Conversion w/SLP Lid and K&N Filter
LPP Long Tube Headers 1 3/4" Stepped to 1 7/8"
LPP 3" ORY with SLP LM1 dumped at axle
Racetronix 42# Fuel Injectors
Walbro 255lph Fuel Pump w/Hotwire Kit
CSR Electric Water Pump
MSD Cap/Rotor Kit w/Delphi Opti
OBD1 PCM Conversion
ASP Underdrive Balancer/Pulley
MSD 8.5mm Wires
Mallory Hyfire Ignition Control w/2-Step and Nitrous Retard
SJM Line Lock/ABS Delete Kit
A/C Delete (retained heat)
TCS Delete
EGR Delete
EVAP Delete
AIR Delete
Stage 2 Tranny Rebuild (It is an M6)
Competition Clutches Stage 2.5 Clutch
Custom Built 31-Spline 8.8" Rear End
4.10 Gears
Moser Hardened 31-Spline Axles w/GM Axle Ends

That is all I could think of off the top of my head. I am considering a Direct-Port Nitrous Express 150 Shot later on in the year, but I want to get the N/A setup running right first.

RamAir95TA

iTrader: (2)

I don't get it... Explain...

tt383lt1

iTrader: (3)

i know you dint say afr heads

but i have a set of afr 210 competion head and i love them it made 550hp on the crank on a 383 and 11.1 compression. they flow 311 cfm

RamAir95TA

iTrader: (2)

Lots of big talk about big flow numbers lately. There are cars making 550 crank HP on ported stock castings nowadays.

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

Ported stock castings have made over 500rwhp using a stock pcm in a few cars I know of.

Z28Camaro30Ann

iTrader: (15)

That meant I am not sure if I am going to use the AI 215cc Heads, or the TEA 220's yet, but whichever I use will have 62cc chambers for my compression ratio. I want it to stay around 11.5 and with a 62cc Chamber I will be at 11.45 SCR.

Also, I am not denying that ported stock castings can and have made power. I am not trying to debate what heads can and will make power. I am merely discussing the heads that have peaked my interest. I have used AFR heads. I have used LE2 heads. I want to go with another brand. Nothing wrong with the others and I am not saying they can't make power, but I want something else...A.I. and TEA are the 2 I am juggling right now...the Dart heads just caught my eye and I thought I would post to try and learn something new. Forgive me for starting another head debate...

Also, those 311 Flow Numbers on the AFR's were on a 4.060 Bore...the A.I. and TEA numbers are on a 4.030. Just saying lol.

05HD

Flow numbers are not worth much. It is the real world where results count. If you scour the intraweb for fast LT1s, you will find the best results from AI and AFR. Alas, you are comparing a ported head to an as cast head so, there are not many worthwhile conclusions anyone can draw from that. Of course, the ported head will preform better.

Jon A

Yes, dramatically. The Darts are an excellent casting with huge potential. Since they're the same as the SBC versions, numerous shops all around the country can take them to the 320-330 cfm range where they support anywhere from 600-800 HP depending upon how many cubes you have and the rest of the setup.

If you want to go that way though, I'd recommend selecting the porter first and going from there as they may not want to start with the 215cc ports.