dirk70301

I'm building a 383 LT1 and will be using an eletric waterpump . I was wondering if a SBC non LT1 timing set will work . It is worthless for me to buy a lt1 gearset for hundreds of dollars if I will not be using a waterpump drive.

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

The stock LT1 set is stout and costs about the same as the popular Gen 1 sets guys like to use so do not use cost as an excuse to buy a different timing set.
Aside from the waterpump drive the LT1 just uses a roller cam block timing set, guys have particular favorites that require little or no clearancing but they are all meant for 87+ smallblocks.

97LT1

iTrader: (3)

your correct. As long as you have the later model timing cover, then you have way more better options.

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

This guy has half a point. What year motor, are you using a vented opti or an unvented one. The unvented leaves you few options.

On the "better" options though he is a bit sheepleish. Lots of guys throw this around but so few people have broken stock sets that it proves this opinion invalid. People just ASSume stock is weak and that is why they make statements like this. Not based on real world results.

FlamingChicken

iTrader: (2)

isnt the stock set a link chain though? i would hope if somebody is "upgrading" they would go with a true roller but not sure what even that would give you power wise. with that said i went with a gm sbc roller set since i took the drive out.

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

Everybody loves to hate on the stock chain but reality is it works, People prefer to ignore reality though. The chain in my car has over 50K on it, unplanned circumstances lead to reusing the one in the engine.

If you look for instances of timing chain failures you will find amazingly few, and few stock failures in particular given the number of guys using them. Also consider if you are concerned with strength that going to an electric WP takes more than 10hp load off the chain making it that much more durable.

I am not saying everyone should run a stocker, just saying that the usual arguments of price and strength are utter bullshit.

96lt1m6

iTrader: (31)

very true statement!
of all my Lt1 friends i have only 1 that broke his chain and that was on the dyno at dynojet here in vegas. his car had been apart sooo many times so it is hard to say if it was the pure beating the TA had or it was reassembled improperly.
Atleast GM did not use the old nylon gear sets like some of the old school motors!

Biggin'89

iTrader: (2)

i went with the progear tc and it is awesome. Its a VERY heafty chain mean't for sbc's w/o a w/p drive gear. and its very reasonablely priced, I paid 100 for it from a board member that ended up not using it, but i know they aren't anywhere near the lt4 ed chain.

97LT1

iTrader: (3)

I dont feel in need to write out a long super post to get the idea across. The OP can take what I said and do some research. (it isnt like this has not been talked about a million times.) Are you saying I ASSume the stock chain is weak? Or am I just wasting my money on a better part?

I have seen increasing amounts of posts on Cz28 with broken stock timing sets lately BTW. It all depends on how much $$$ you have and invested in the short block and heads etc. I really dont feel like rolling the dice on a stock chain, when I use a EWP and have the option to upgrade. So before you go bashing my opinion, you might wanna find out my reasoning of why I say "better". Got that Mr. Holy Grail of LT1?

Heres 3 of the posts off the top of my head.
http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/show...k+timing+chain

http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/show...k+timing+chain

http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/show...k+timing+chain

Agreed went with a Progear tc as well. It is the 4 series that has adjustments also for cam degreeing. The metal in those gears and chains is vibratory tumbled 2x. You take the edges off of metal, it prevents fracture points. I am sure GM did that.

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

One of those look to be original yet 11+ years old, the one is a modified engine and installation error could easily be blamed. The other post is 4 frigging years old so you searched and turned up three threads on a forum that active. If the stock set was weak would see a hell of a lot more problems.

With the number of stock sets out in service the ultra low numbers of failures reported are proof it is a good piece. Everything breaks eventually and everything has freak failures, you find 10 examples of broken chains in 4 years worth of posts on cz28.com and it is still statistically insignificant.



Last night someone pointed out to me Joe Overton ran a stock set into the 9s NA, but yeah you are right ever goober who aims for an 11 second car "needs" to "upgrade".

97LT1

iTrader: (3)

All I am saying is it is cheap INS. If you are running a EWP like the OP then why not? Why does it matter when it happened in those posts? Does that make it different? I am glad Joe pulled that off, props to him. I am content with my decision, just like you are. This conversation is almost like the 2 bolt vs 4 bolt main preference.

Karl Ellwein

I always prefer to install an aftermarket double roller timing set if given the choice. A new stock set is something like $90 bucks and that's as much or more than a Cloyes double roller or ProGear.

Reason is, as mentioned, insurance and another reason is it's way easier to degree the cam with an aftermarket timing set.

Sock set has advantages such as quiet and will run water pump if you decide to do that later but that's about it as far as advantages.

A quality roller chain with billet gears is nice to have.

Karl Ellwein

jakesz28

iTrader: (9)

Before I'm told that the stock timing set is strong enough for my application I'm running valve spring pressures in the 660 to 680 open.

What timing sets fit under the 94 or nonvented timing chain covers? The cover I was going to use already has the waterpump and opti drive holes welded closed and I don't want to go looking for a vented cover.

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

http://camaroz28.com/forums/showpost...73&postcount=8
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showpost....9&postcount=54
http://camaroz28.com/forums/showpost...70&postcount=6
http://camaroz28.com/forums/showpost...70&postcount=6



Jake, since you say the opti drive is welded up as well as the WP, all you need is a timing set for a factory roller cam setup. Lots of choices, one shyster will tell you to buy a $80 billet but I have it on good authority that a $30 Comp one will work just fine too.

Going rear mount on the distributor?

97LT1

iTrader: (3)

Hey who and what is a shyster out of curiosity?

Karl Ellwein

Dwayne what works for one person does not make it required that everyone do the same thing. Back off of the save the hot rodding world, "do it my way or you're an idiot" attitude.
What I've learned through the years is that a person's true deep down personality shows through in the typed word. Reason is because there is time to think about what one really want to say when one types a note.
You are always calling people "idiot" and "stupid" and "sheepish" and you best stop doing that and learn to be civil. When you consider someone stupid and sheepish do you really mean it? If yes then you still have some things to learn about human nature. People are far more intelligent than you think and there is value in everyone's experience and knowledge.

Karl Ellwein

fergymoto

iTrader: (129)

I didn't read this whole thread but if you want an inexpensive solution get a new GM chain, reuse your crank sprocket if it isn't very worn, and find a cam sprocket from a Vortec truck. I had the sprocket laying around so that's the route I went.

94blownz281

iTrader: (12)

curious what the idea of using a new cam sprocket does? (vortec) thanks

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

You did not read what I am writing, I said the arguments people pose are wrong it is strong and it is not expensive, not that everyone should invariably stick to stock.

I also went on to tell Jake what to look for to find a chain that will fit.

96capricemgr

iTrader: (1)

Maybe try a little different angle here. My assertion is that the statements about swapping to a gen 1 chain for "insurance" are NOT based on experiance or knowledge.

Rather they are based on false assumptions.

My expeiance and Karl's, though he is trying to argue with me now, is that the stock set is stout.