Clutch Problems with 7k+rpm shifts. story inside!
06-03-2009, 01:19 PM
#1
Clutch Problems with 7k+rpm shifts. story inside! OK guys with my current setup I made peak power at 7200, but my power band is around 6000 to 7800. between those RPM's my power only changes about 25-30 hp in the range. My problem has been with the clutch. When I put this motor in my car, I already had a Textraila oz700, awesome clutch till I went to take it to the track.
Anyways, got the car to the track, made a couple easy passes shifting around 6500 and everything seemed ok. So i upped the shift point to 7500, went out and tried to hit 2nd, it went into gear but the clutch pedal stuck to the floor!. and when it did release it slipped.
Went home, took the trans out and found that it had broken off at one of the mounting bolt locations, not a good deal! So it was time for a new clutch, So I choose Monster level 6 with the sintered Iron disk.
I got it through Joey at Tick, and he had it at my house is 2 days!(thanks for the awesome service Tick, all you guys rock!) So I got it, put around 50 or so miles on it cause I cant stand driving the damn thing on the street that much, made a few pulls and everything was great. clutch shifted fine at high RPM's and everything. but one time the pedal went soft and it would shift at high RPM's again. Called Steve at Monster, explain everything and he was pretty upset that I didn't do the proper break in. After talking some, he wanted me to Try a new clutch that he has came up with. Monster Level 6.5 full face sintered iron disk. This time with a 500 mile break in.
Well I get the clutch, drive the thing to work way to many times, missed out on several races, fuel pump went out and had to replace the rear tires...
BUT finally with about 700+ miles on the clutch, I was ready to go to the track again. Fresh clutch fluid change, new slicks and a fresh tune, and a new fuel system! anyways, made 2 easy passes shifting at 6800, car ran ok. Put more timing in it and bumped the shifts to 7400. again went to hit 2nd and the pedal stuck to the floor. wow damn. I got some bad luck.
AND this was last friday. I got to talk to Steve at Monster to try and figure out why I am having these peoblems. After talking he said he had a Smaller diameter clutch that he has come up with after hearing about the problems I have had at High RPM's. its an 11" unit compared to the others that were 12". This one is going to have more clamp load, and a 6 puck ceramic disk so I dont have to break it in so much. Steve laughed and call this one his "special needs" clutch set. haha BUT if you guys are not reving out this high, then please dont be worried in buying a Monster clutch. The level 6.5 with the full face disk had the best street feel of any clutch, you can take off easy and drive it almost like a stock clutch till you beat on it, then it grabs hard!
Steve at Monster and Joey at Tick have to be some of the best guys around, they have helped and talked with me and done everything they could to get this thing to work. I have even had a thought to change the car over to an auto
but I really dont want to do that....
Lets hope this clutch works with the high RPM shifts so I can get some good times out of this thing before the stock bottom gives up. Hell on one of the Miss shifts, EFI live recorded that it over reved to 8336 RPM's... and its still together with no bent pushrods or weird noises...
I will keep this updated when the new clutch gets here, and I will load up some pictures of everything when I get home. I just wanted to share my story with some of you guys.
Charlie
Anyways, got the car to the track, made a couple easy passes shifting around 6500 and everything seemed ok. So i upped the shift point to 7500, went out and tried to hit 2nd, it went into gear but the clutch pedal stuck to the floor!. and when it did release it slipped.
Went home, took the trans out and found that it had broken off at one of the mounting bolt locations, not a good deal! So it was time for a new clutch, So I choose Monster level 6 with the sintered Iron disk.
I got it through Joey at Tick, and he had it at my house is 2 days!(thanks for the awesome service Tick, all you guys rock!) So I got it, put around 50 or so miles on it cause I cant stand driving the damn thing on the street that much, made a few pulls and everything was great. clutch shifted fine at high RPM's and everything. but one time the pedal went soft and it would shift at high RPM's again. Called Steve at Monster, explain everything and he was pretty upset that I didn't do the proper break in. After talking some, he wanted me to Try a new clutch that he has came up with. Monster Level 6.5 full face sintered iron disk. This time with a 500 mile break in.
Well I get the clutch, drive the thing to work way to many times, missed out on several races, fuel pump went out and had to replace the rear tires...
BUT finally with about 700+ miles on the clutch, I was ready to go to the track again. Fresh clutch fluid change, new slicks and a fresh tune, and a new fuel system! anyways, made 2 easy passes shifting at 6800, car ran ok. Put more timing in it and bumped the shifts to 7400. again went to hit 2nd and the pedal stuck to the floor. wow damn. I got some bad luck.
AND this was last friday. I got to talk to Steve at Monster to try and figure out why I am having these peoblems. After talking he said he had a Smaller diameter clutch that he has come up with after hearing about the problems I have had at High RPM's. its an 11" unit compared to the others that were 12". This one is going to have more clamp load, and a 6 puck ceramic disk so I dont have to break it in so much. Steve laughed and call this one his "special needs" clutch set. haha BUT if you guys are not reving out this high, then please dont be worried in buying a Monster clutch. The level 6.5 with the full face disk had the best street feel of any clutch, you can take off easy and drive it almost like a stock clutch till you beat on it, then it grabs hard!
Steve at Monster and Joey at Tick have to be some of the best guys around, they have helped and talked with me and done everything they could to get this thing to work. I have even had a thought to change the car over to an auto
but I really dont want to do that....Lets hope this clutch works with the high RPM shifts so I can get some good times out of this thing before the stock bottom gives up. Hell on one of the Miss shifts, EFI live recorded that it over reved to 8336 RPM's... and its still together with no bent pushrods or weird noises...
I will keep this updated when the new clutch gets here, and I will load up some pictures of everything when I get home. I just wanted to share my story with some of you guys.
Charlie
06-03-2009, 05:54 PM
#3
well at the LSX shootout the car went 11.41 at 122 with 50 less whp. One of my best passes with the new cam and head work was a 11.58 at 123 shifting 6500 before the Textralia broke. Car straight ******* rips, till you go to hit the next gear and it sticks to the floor lol. Car weighs around 3700 or so... I need to weigh it with the cage and bottle. Its going on a diet and getting 4.88 gears before the new clutch gets here
06-04-2009, 12:36 PM
#5
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Now the clutch seems ok, is my clutch just a ticking time boom? I think this is the stock clutch. Works good under 6500 RPM's.
06-04-2009, 03:06 PM
#6
I hope it works too man... I really do. And if nothing else, I may have just helped you get things figured out for when other guys figure out how much power they can make with these L92's when you get rid of that junk *** flat intake, and rev the thing to the moon!
ohh and Please send some break in instructions with that haha
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06-12-2009, 01:49 PM
#8
well I got the clutch yesterday and installed it last night.
Its an 11" unit compared to the 12" ones I have been having bad luck with. Steve thinks the smaller one will have less mass and hope the pedal dont Stick to the floor at 7500 shifts. Its a 6 puck level 5 disk, and as he said "Most extreme" pressure plate. He also sent me the lightweight package with a 15lb flywheel.
I have not drove it very far yet, being as the car is sitting on slicks and skinnies and I had to work at 6am, I have not had time to drive it.
I hope to drive the car throughout next week and get some miles on this thing and see if it will shift at the track where I need it to! I cant wait!!
Charlie
Its an 11" unit compared to the 12" ones I have been having bad luck with. Steve thinks the smaller one will have less mass and hope the pedal dont Stick to the floor at 7500 shifts. Its a 6 puck level 5 disk, and as he said "Most extreme" pressure plate. He also sent me the lightweight package with a 15lb flywheel.
I have not drove it very far yet, being as the car is sitting on slicks and skinnies and I had to work at 6am, I have not had time to drive it.
I hope to drive the car throughout next week and get some miles on this thing and see if it will shift at the track where I need it to! I cant wait!!
Charlie
06-12-2009, 02:05 PM
#9
I hope it works too man... I really do. And if nothing else, I may have just helped you get things figured out for when other guys figure out how much power they can make with these L92's when you get rid of that junk *** flat intake, and rev the thing to the moon!
Mike
06-12-2009, 02:12 PM
#10
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Polly= !driver mod. LOL. Hope it works for ya. I cant stand the SPEC I have becuase of all the abuse it CANT take. I may have to try one out after I see if it can handle the spray when I get it tuned. Do you guys have problems with premature failure and half a page of side effects if you slip or ride the clutch a little to launch the car.
06-12-2009, 02:22 PM
#11
Smokn...what stage clutch do you have? What kind of power are you making? I ask because different stages are idea for different uses and torque capacities. If you provide me with a little more info, here or through PM or email, I will be happy to help you. Thanks and have a good weekend!
06-12-2009, 03:23 PM
#13
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My 7200 rpm 1-2 shift occasionally crunches but I have not had any problem with hydraulics or pedal sticking. Some clutch disks (such as the Spec 4) have much lower rotational inertia than others (Spec 3+). I selected the Spec 4 because I wanted to help my T56’s synchros survive high speed shifts. Have your hydraulics been thoroughly bled? Do you have a theory to explain how spinning higher could cause the pedal to stick?
06-12-2009, 04:38 PM
#14
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My 7200 rpm 1-2 shift occasionally crunches but I have not had any problem with hydraulics or pedal sticking. Some clutch disks (such as the Spec 4) have much lower rotational inertia than others (Spec 3+). I selected the Spec 4 because I wanted to help my T56’s synchros survive high speed shifts. Have your hydraulics been thoroughly bled? Do you have a theory to explain how spinning higher could cause the pedal to stick?
06-12-2009, 05:42 PM
#15
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I am a granny shifter – my intent is full travel of both throttle and clutch pedals. My 1-2 shift is usually clean and smooth but it will occasionally crunch. I do not know the cause of the crunch. It is difficult to know the exact sequence of events during a quick shift. I recently rebuilt my transmission and my synchros seem to work perfectly. It may be that during fast shifts I don’t fully depress the clutch pedal and the clutch doesn’t fully disengage. The 1-2 shift happens without any thought - its just a reflex. The 2-3 shift is more deliberate and perhaps more precise.
06-13-2009, 09:53 PM
#16
Kind of off topic here (sorry), so you're running an EFI single plane intake with an elbow on the L92's? I've got some hand ported L92's and a smaller cam than yours. I've contemplated going with a single plane type manifold. Are you using the new Edlebrock, or the GM manifold? What kind of hp are you at with your newest combo?
Mike
Mike
it made 580 flywheel horse
with a pretty good power band... so if this thing wont stick to the floor then I should get some decent time out of this heavy thing.as far as the pedal sticking to the floor, I guess it would be because of rotational mass not letting the the clutch engage back??? I am no expert, but the clutch pedal stays on the floor, cant argue with that. and yes I have a new slave and Tick master adjusted several times to try different pedal travels.... you name it I have done it to get it to work. Lets hope this setup does the trick.
ohh and I drove it up the street real quick, I also changed the tranny fluid to amsoil ATF, and damn this thing shifts smooth now! clutch feels good so far. like I said next week it will get some street miles put on it, and off to the track Friday. and if it works its getting a 150 shot too.
06-14-2009, 08:53 AM
#17
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Well, I will have more testing done on the Monster Level VI....soon! I just picked up a set of new Morel solid roller lifters, bigger cam (270-280 @ .050 range, old one was 260/270) with .800+ lift and a set of L92's and a sheetmetal intake. Hoping for 750+ FWHP and hit it with a 250+ worth of sauce. Was at machine shop on Sat (yesterday) and they checked clearance on new lifters (lifter bores are bushed) and had more work done on teh heads. My point is, once teh customers car hits teh track, we'll have even more testing on this disc and high RPM's (this one's gonna see north of 8K RPM) for you guys. I am gonna try both the Billet steel fly and Chromoly fly to compare 60' and on down the track, to log some data, and it will be on my site once finished.
Last edited by Gen414; 06-14-2009 at 10:56 AM.
06-15-2009, 10:40 PM
#19
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I've been battling the 'ole soft pedal problem for years. After 1-2 its not disengaging well. I have done everything, except switch to an auto. I ordered some heat tape today for the header that's right next to my master cylinder & line. I want to also build a heat shield shield for the master if that doesn't fix it. I'm thinking the header is transferring a ton of heat when I give it alot of throttle.
06-19-2009, 01:47 AM
#20
Did the proper break in Steve told me to do over the phone...
again clutch shifts perfect at 6800, so I went for the 7500 shift and stuck on the floor it went again. Now the pedal is soft like the other two.
I am running out of idea's with this.............................................. .........
auto?
again clutch shifts perfect at 6800, so I went for the 7500 shift and stuck on the floor it went again. Now the pedal is soft like the other two.
I am running out of idea's with this.............................................. .........
auto?